Comparing Usyk to Ali is laughable.

[NihonJim]

Americans are desperate to rubbish this era because the truth is. Americans can't fight anymore.

[TheProudLunatic]

Americans are desperate to rubbish this era because the truth is. Americans can't fight anymore.

How many HOFers are coming from this non American era

British HOF don't count

[Haka]

A HW era with maybe 2 HOFers...........my stomach hurts

The path to HOF was much simpler back then, given the opponents Ken Norton faced up until Ali, Chisora would have been in the mix as well.

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[TheProudLunatic]

The path to HOF was much simpler back then, given the opponents Ken Norton faced up until Ali, Chisora would have been in the mix as well.

image.png

Throw in the towel already

[NihonJim]

How many HOFers are coming from this non American era

British HOF don't count

AJ, Fury, Usyk, Parker, Wilder

[TheProudLunatic]

AJ, Fury, Usyk, Parker, Wilder

I rest my case !!!!!!!

[TheProudLunatic]

In no particular order -
Ali
Holmes
Lenny
Holy
Wlad
Vit
Bowe
Tua
Foreman
Frazier
Spinks
Louis
Norton
Lyle
Shavers
M Tyson (glorified bully)
Marciano
J Ruiz (love him or loathe him, homeboy's resume is sick !)
Moorer
Morrison
Valuev
Berbick
Tucker

Who would Usyk realistically beat ?
Does his resume stand up to any/all of these guys ?

[Dr Z]

In no particular order -
Ali
Holmes
Lenny
Holy
Wlad
Vit
Bowe
Tua
Foreman
Frazier
Spinks
Louis
Norton
Lyle
Shavers
M Tyson (glorified bully)
Marciano
J Ruiz (love him or loathe him, homeboy's resume is sick !)
Moorer
Morrison
Valuev
Berbick
Tucker

Who would Usyk realistically beat ?
Does his resume stand up to any/all of these guys ?

Usyk is knocking in the door being a top 8 all time heavyweight.

Oleksandr Usyk’s case for being a top-12 all-time heavyweight is strong but depends on how you weigh different factors. His resume is elite: undisputed cruiserweight champion, undisputed heavyweight champion (WBA, WBC, WBO, IBF), and wins over top-tier opponents like Anthony Joshua, Tyson Fury, and Daniel Dubois. There is no question as he has beaten each man twice.

His technical mastery—footwork, angles, and punch accuracy, combined with his ring IQ and natural 12+ round stamina where he does not need any breaks and forces the other man to match his never ending movement or be out angled and not have their feet set to throw a punchh—is arguably unmatched in the division’s history. He’s also got an Olympic gold medal (2012) and a perfect 24-0, 15 KO's. At 6'3" 255 pounds he is neither short, or lacking reach. Very few heavies were faster handed and and had swifter feet. Very few had better reflexes. You could count them on one head. His chin is very good.

Beating Fury in their rematch (December 2024) further solidified his legacy, making him the first to unify all four major belts in the four-belt era and defend them.

However, ranking him top-12 all-time invites debate due to the heavyweight division’s storied history. Legends like Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, Lennox Lewis, George Foreman, Larry Holmes, Vitlai Klitscko, and Wladimir Klitschko dominate such lists in my opinion.

Each has a mix of dominance, longevity, cultural impact, or iconic fights that Usyk, at 38 with only eight heavyweight bouts, doesn’t fully match yet.
No heavyweight has matched his cruiser-to-heavyweight undisputed double, and his win over Fury, a 6’9” giant, showcases his ability to overcome size disadvantages with skill.f opposition. However he needs more title defenses to crack the upper echelon. He has not finished boxing yet ( he has 1.5 - 2 more good years left in my opinion ) and can rate a bit higher.

How? By beating younger pros like Parker, Kayabel, Hrgovic, and Jarolov and having them carve out their own legacy when he retires. He has ducked no man and had no oops moments ( losses, draws, or questionable decisions ) like every one else does above him on the all time list.

IMO, he is a top 12 all time great heavyweight.

He would likey beat Tucker, Berbick, Valuev, Morrison, Moorer, Ruiz, Lyle, Shavers, Spinks, and Tua.

Arguments can be made for the other names you listed.

- Dr Z

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

You literally list him among the 7 Hall of Famers that Ali beat. That's the sentence you wrote. Even though Norton deserved the win all 3 times. The argument you constructed used Ali's "wins" over Norton to say that Ali was great.

Now you can't even read your own posts.

No different than someone saying with a straight face that Canelo's first "win" over GGG is why he's so great. Or that Peterson's "win" over Khan is what makes him great. Next you'll be telling me that Josh Taylor's "win" over Jack Catterall was the stuff of legends. Get a grip.

He factually won the fight. I was acknowledging the official result which apparently have no issue with, yet you’re in like page 10 of this thread desperate for argument because you have no social life beyond your keyboard.

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

Usyk is knocking in the door being a top 8 all time heavyweight.

Oleksandr Usyk’s case for being a top-12 all-time heavyweight is strong but depends on how you weigh different factors. His resume is elite: undisputed cruiserweight champion, undisputed heavyweight champion (WBA, WBC, WBO, IBF), and wins over top-tier opponents like Anthony Joshua, Tyson Fury, and Daniel Dubois. There is no question as he has beaten each man twice.

His technical mastery—footwork, angles, and punch accuracy, combined with his ring IQ and natural 12+ round stamina where he does not need any breaks and forces the other man to match his never ending movement or be out angled and not have their feet set to throw a punchh—is arguably unmatched in the division’s history. He’s also got an Olympic gold medal (2012) and a perfect 24-0, 15 KO's. At 6'3" 255 pounds he is neither short, or lacking reach. Very few heavies were faster handed and and had swifter feet. Very few had better reflexes. You could count them on one head. His chin is very good.

Beating Fury in their rematch (December 2024) further solidified his legacy, making him the first to unify all four major belts in the four-belt era and defend them.

However, ranking him top-12 all-time invites debate due to the heavyweight division’s storied history. Legends like Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, Lennox Lewis, George Foreman, Larry Holmes, Vitlai Klitscko, and Wladimir Klitschko dominate such lists in my opinion.

Each has a mix of dominance, longevity, cultural impact, or iconic fights that Usyk, at 38 with only eight heavyweight bouts, doesn’t fully match yet.
No heavyweight has matched his cruiser-to-heavyweight undisputed double, and his win over Fury, a 6’9” giant, showcases his ability to overcome size disadvantages with skill.f opposition. However he needs more title defenses to crack the upper echelon. He has not finished boxing yet ( he has 1.5 - 2 more good years left in my opinion ) and can rate a bit higher.

How? By beating younger pros like Parker, Kayabel, Hrgovic, and Jarolov and having them carve out their own legacy when he retires. He has ducked no man and had no oops moments ( losses, draws, or questionable decisions ) like every one else does above him on the all time list.

IMO, he is a top 12 all time great heavyweight.

He would likey beat Tucker, Berbick, Valuev, Morrison, Moorer, Ruiz, Lyle, Shavers, Spinks, and Tua.

Arguments can be made for the other names you listed.

- Dr Z

Remember when you claimed Hrgovic would beat Usyk? Good times.