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Usyk may actually be the Heavyweight Goat

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  • #21
    I see the usual predictable rubbish about present day HWs being weak and useless compared to the incredible, superhuman monsters from the past. Lol,

    Even if he loses to Dubois - at the age of 38 - Usyk will rightly go down in boxing history as one of the greatest HWs ever. He probably hasn't had enough fights to vie with the likes of Louis and Ali for GOAT recognition, but that doesn't mean he couldn't have beaten them , and everybody they beat, head to head. That's another discussion.
    Damn Wicked Damn Wicked likes this.

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    • #22
      Originally posted by DeeMoney View Post
      How does what he did at Cruiserweight make him the heavyweight GOAT?
      Present day cruiserweights are as big, if not bigger, than most of the top HWs from previous eras, so Usyk's cruiserweight accomplishments can't be dismissed as irrelevant here.

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      • #23
        He's got to.beat everyone who's anyone today. So best parker and kabayel
        Willow The Wisp Willow The Wisp likes this.

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        • #24
          Originally posted by kafkod View Post
          I see the usual predictable rubbish about present day HWs being weak and useless compared to the incredible, superhuman monsters from the past. Lol,

          Even if he loses to Dubois - at the age of 38 - Usyk will rightly go down in boxing history as one of the greatest HWs ever. He probably hasn't had enough fights to vie with the likes of Louis and Ali for GOAT recognition, but that doesn't mean he couldn't have beaten them , and everybody they beat, head to head. That's another discussion.
          Because the modern day heavyweights are weak and useless.

          Fury and AJ have no punch resistance. None. They also have terrible stamina, they are 8 round fighters at best. Fury also has no power, AJ has fairly good power but that's about it.

          It's insulting to mention him in the same sentence as Louis and Ali, and if he loses to Dubois his legacy will be that of a John Ruiz level champion.
          Oracle01 Oracle01 likes this.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by hugh grant View Post
            He's got to.beat everyone who's anyone today. So best parker and kabayel
            Forget about Parker that would be terrible, I want to see Usyk vs Kabayel, Kabayel will throw 80 punches a round, all to the body, if Usyk can get past that I'll be mildly impressed.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by NihonJim View Post

              Forget about Parker that would be terrible, I want to see Usyk vs Kabayel, Kabayel will throw 80 punches a round, all to the body, if Usyk can get past that I'll be mildly impressed.
              Yes, actually AJ has a win over parker, so usyk needing Parker might not be so urgent, even though Parker is in form.
              Maybe beating Itauma is better, as itaum a is next generation. Ali, and joe louis best everyone and hung around long enough to best the new crop coming through too

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              • #27
                Originally posted by Bennyleonard99 View Post
                Olympic gold medal. Perfect record as a pro. Unbeaten undisputed cruiserweight champion. Unbeaten undisputed heavyweight champion. He totally cleaned out two divisions and is still going strong at 38. Never seen hurt, never knocked down. This ring genius with the most multi dimensional style we ever saw just keeps beating everyone, bigger, smaller, stronger, longer, whatever, they all get beaten the same. He beat everyone he had to beat, everyone in his era. There is no such thing as a weak era, the perception of eras is what varies. Every era is as strong as the other. Usyk is unbeatable. I am confident he would figure out and solve any style in history including Ali, Lennox, Klitschko, Holmes, Marciano, Dempsey, Louis, Tunney, Johnson, Foreman, Frazier, etc. I see no reason why Usyk would not be able to solve the styles puzzles. The man can't be beaten. Usyk is the goat.
                I think you need to relax, and stop getting carried away with the current moment 'We get it? Oleksandr Uysk is the current premier Heavyweight Champion, and yes he is the most accomplished active fighter in the entire sport. Oleksandr Uysk's two wins vs both Tyson Fury I & II and Anthony Joshua I & II are pound for the pound the most impressive wins of the last 25 years. But I think Oleksandr Uysk is some way off as being the Greatest Heavyweight fighter of all-times. The only way Uysk becomes a potential candidate for such a title, is if? People universal rate both Tyson Fury and Anthony Joshua as all-time great Heavyweight fighters'.

                So which is Bennyleonard99? Do you suddenly now rate Anthony Joshua as one of the greatest top - 10 Heavyweight fighters of all times along with Tyson Fury? Oleksandr Uysk for sure is a great fighter of this era. But quite simply I still don't think he has the wins on his resume, to really propel him very high in terms of being an all-time great Heavyweight Champion'.

                Oleksandr Uysk did not clean out or clear out the Heavyweight Division 'Tyson Fury, Anthony Joshua and Deontay Wilder in combination cleared out the entire Heavyweight division. That is why they are the three heavyweight mountains of this era'.

                Note: When Oleksandr Uysk entered into the Heavyweight Division, he first came into contact with Derek Chisora a few miles outside of his peak and then jumped straight into the bosses i.e. Tyson Fury and Anthony Joshua. The Heavyweight era already at this stage was in its latter stages, Tyson Fury, Anthony Joshua and Deontay Wilder were all arguable outside of their peaks. Or definitively in the case of Anthony Joshua enduring a very turbulent and vulnerable times as fighter'.

                Oleksandr Uysk did not dethrone or conclude the Kiltschko occupation of the Heavyweight Division 'Both Tyson Fury and Anthony Joshua effectively achieved this in combination. Tyson Fury was the first heavyweight fighter for almost 10 years, to breach the defenses of the Kiltschko occupation of the Heavyweight Division'.

                And then Anthony Joshua on April 29th 2017, conclusive took the Heavyweight Division into a completely new dynasty. Wladimir Kiltschko vs Anthony Joshua was the greatest Heavyweight title fight of the past 25 years. Anthony Joshua knocked out Wladimir Kiltschko and forced him into retirement, in the greatest heavyweight title fight still of this era'.

                Oleksandr Uysk entered into the Heavyweight Division at an opportune time 'If he would have entered into the Heavyweight divisions earlier, theoretically he would have encountered more heavy resistance. Uysk would have collided with a better version of Derek Chisora, Tyson Fury and Anthony Joshua. This is a absolute fact'.

                And we have not even considered the danger of Deontay Wilder 'Stylistically, if you struggled to seriously hurt Wilder. And your main tactics are to just accumulate points over the distance vs all of your opponents. I think many people within the boxing community would agree? That those tactics are extremely dangerous tactics to use against Deontay Wilder at his peak'.

                To claim that Oleksandr Uysk is unbeatable 'I think you need to check yourself, he is an all-time great fighter. But like I stated at the beginning of the post, relax and stop carried away in the moment'.

                Oleksandr Uysk wins vs Tyson Fury I & II and Anthony Joshua I & II were great 'But they also showed in my opinion, the areas of Uysk's game where he lacks. Tyson Fury during round 9 of their first fight, was pretty knocked out on his feet. And yet still? Oleksandr Uysk could not force a stoppage or deck Tyson Fury. For me that is concerning, because although Tyson Fury was in his best condition for many years vs Oleksandr Uysk I & II. Tyson Fury was not at his absolute peak, and was coming into his first fight vs Oleksandr Uysk after losing to Francis Ngannou over 10 rounds'.

                Oleksandr Uysk has benefited from competing in this Heavyweight era 'He has exploited the modern day super heavyweight fighters, with superior endurance and points scoring ability. That is Uysk's entire game. He does not inflict heavy damage on his opponents, and he really struggles to knock them out'.

                The only top level fighters Oleksandr Uysk has stopped are Daniel Dubois who is front runner at top level 'And Tony Bellew completely dead at the weight. Bellew many years after the fight as admitted, that he should have fought Oleksandr Uysk at heavyweight'.

                For me personally on any given fight night 'David Haye at his absolute peak, is the beat cruiserweight we have seen since Evander Holyfield. Haye also technically became the Undisputed Cruiserweight Champion, and during that quest? He beat up, and knocked out all the major champions in the division. David Haye beat Jean Marc Mormeck in France, and then Enzo Maccarinelli back in UK. After this run of fights he was the WBC, WBA, WBO, and Lineal Cruiserweight Champion. Jean Marc Mormeck in his fight prior to fighting Haye, avenged a loss to O'Niel Bell who was the IBF Champion but was stripped of this title before his rematch Mormeck'.

                To conclude: Overall OIeksandr Uysk has benefited from the opportune time he entered into the Heavyweight Divisions 'and the timing of his fights with the major champions. That is not a heavy criticism of Uysk, it is just a fact of the action. And I think this has all aided in Oleksandr Uysk being able to beat all of those fighters with impressive performances'.

                Without a shadow of a doubt, Oleksandr Uysk is an all time great fighter 'But when you look of the details of his entire resume, combined with his actual performances. I honestly would not rate him as the greatest heavyweight fighter of all-times or unbeatable' etc.
                Last edited by PRINCEKOOL; 07-17-2025, 06:18 AM.

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by NihonJim View Post
                  Usyk is a feather fisted technician who is good at beffudling big stiff useless boxers with no stamina or chins who don't want to be in there.

                  The greats of the past would not fall for his BS and would stick it on him and force him into a firefight which he would not win.


                  Usyk is the best conditioned heavyweight in the last 50 years. He also has very good skills and excellent footspeed footwork.

                  Which heavyweight do you think could match this and force him into a firefight?

                  Last edited by Dr Z; 07-17-2025, 04:09 PM.
                  Bennyleonard99 Bennyleonard99 likes this.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by kafkod View Post
                    I see the usual predictable rubbish about present day HWs being weak and useless compared to the incredible, superhuman monsters from the past. Lol,

                    Even if he loses to Dubois - at the age of 38 - Usyk will rightly go down in boxing history as one of the greatest HWs ever. He probably hasn't had enough fights to vie with the likes of Louis and Ali for GOAT recognition, but that doesn't mean he couldn't have beaten them , and everybody they beat, head to head. That's another discussion.
                    LOL Yes Earnie Shavers would have KOed Godzilla and King Kong. And Sonny Liston would have terrorized The Wolfman and Creature From Black Lagoon. I think it's endless propaganda about the previous eras, the non stop media blitz that the Ali era fighters were ten levels above everyone else when the reality is they were no better or worse. If Cassius Clay never had his bike stolen and didn't meet coach Joe Martin, the Ali era would have been flat out boring. Ali's electricity and media hype distorted the era and made it seem greater than it really was. Foreman Norton and Frazier had little personality.
                    Damn Wicked Damn Wicked likes this.

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by kafkod View Post

                      Present day cruiserweights are as big, if not bigger, than most of the top HWs from previous eras, so Usyk's cruiserweight accomplishments can't be dismissed as irrelevant here.
                      Great point. Marciano and Louis were cruiserweights. Frazier maybe too. Usyk's flaw is he beat a lot of great fighters that didn't have the hype that Frazier, Foreman, Norton, etc have. It's very possible Chisora could beat Frazier, Foreman, Norton, Liston, Lyle, etc.

                      Bottom line is Usyk has a perfect career, perfect record and is the closest thing to Heavyweight perfection we ever saw. These so called armchair champions here talk about Usyk's alleged flaws but not one fighter, NOT ONE, has been able to exploit them.

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