is vitali best HW ever for judging and controlling distance?

[j]

none of those fighters controlled distance like vitali. ali was a master at counter punching and deception and had fast hands but didnt control his perimeter like vitali does, mostly due to his lack of reach and bulk. only comparable fighter he fought was foreman and foreman was one-dimensional, tough and strong as they come but one-dimensional with no variety. holmes was a good traditional HW and liston was a vicious monster but neither was a strategic dominator

vitali beats all three imo

agreed. and i had a weird almost double post that wasnt appearing until i entered another comment. weird!

[YNWA]

anways, this thread is about controlling distance and ring generalship.

i start counting from the pre-fight staring, and base it in rounds of 2, or somethimes round by round if it is a crazy fight.

so, this argument is not about LL.

it is about how the boxing fans feel about VK's ring generalship, timing, and use of his body to fight with.

and me, personally, i have seen him look pretty much unbeatable using his unorthodox skills.

i think most people would be more on-board if he were an american or african american. it seems like there is more a problem having a light skinned champion, especially in the heavyweight division.

i agree, if vitali was american or even british he would be hyped as the best HW ever

i'm not saying he is the best ever, but he'd give any HW in history a fuucking good fight, as would lewis who i also think is underrated due to his ****** losses against rahman and mccall, which he avenged admittedly. i personally dont think vitali would have ever got beat by rahman or mccall. as the guy on US tv said (larry marchant?) vitali is one of those rare breed - a 365 fighter - always in shape, never partying, always training never letting himself get complacent just in case a fight appears on the horizon - ultimate sportsman

[j]

i agree, if vitali was american or even british he would be hyped as the best HW ever

i'm not saying he is the best ever, but he'd give any HW in history a fuucking good fight, as would lewis who i also think is underrated due to his ****** losses against rahman and mccall, which he avenged admittedly. i personally dont think vitali would have ever got beat by rahman or mccall. as the guy on US tv said (larry marchant?) vitali is one of those rare breed - a 365 fighter - always in shape, never partying, always training never letting himself get complacent just in case a fight appears on the horizon - ultimate sportsman

again, i would agree with u. i think lewis and vitali would be able to beat any fighter in history of boxing. sure, they could lose also. but i doubt they would lose 3 out of 3 to any heavyweight ever. so, that does a lot for an alltime rating IMO. i dont officially have one, but i would say that the brothers and lewis could handle themselves with relative ease i any decade and become champs. and i dislike lewis a lot, but i give credit whee it is due. these 3 are super heavyweights in every sense of the word.

[Pullcounter]

i think finally people are realising that despite a slightly awkward looking style and stance he's a master at judging and controlling range, distance and perimeter

how many HWs past or present can/could get away without a high guard against renowned punchers and never be in trouble simply through the abilty to eliminate their danger through clever movement, jabs and footwork

best ever???? no... just no.

[bojangles1987]

Um...

Muhammad Ali? He was quicker and better at it, and it wasn't as easy because he wasn't 6 foot freaking 8. Don't be fooled by his fights after getting out of prison, in his prime Ali did nothing but dance around his opponents and rarely get touched.

[PensionKiller]

the same lewis who got knocked out by rahman and mccall?

i dont think vitali would have had any trouble with either of them. lewis was suscepible to complacency, vitali isnt.

That complacentcy was his downfall, not his ability to judge distance. That old Lewis did make Vitali look like his skin was made out of potatoe.

[PensionKiller]

Quality also makes a difference.

Tua looks great VS some guys and looks terrible VS Lewis.

Vitali does come in great shape which I love about him and his brother. The other boxers in the heavyweight divison don't come in as if they are broke even if they are. Fighters like Fraizer would train their ass off.

Vitali is a good fighter that I respect. He has a different style, and it's not really fundamentally sound, but it does a good job for him. He uses his size well, if he was smaller, then he wouldn't be so hard to hit and with the way he fights, he would get tagged.

To me, a fighter of equal size and weight would be easier to judge if he had the ability to control distance without the fact that he is 6 foot 7 and 245+ pounds etc... for example Cotto isn't that big a guy but can judge distance pretty well. He gets tagged by bigger guys in terms of reach and height, and sometimes speed, but he's pretty good now that he has developed. Mayweather is another that judges distance great. He has wonderful boxing eyes.

[TheGreatA]

Wladimir is better in my opinion.

[TheGreatA]

Lewis was in awful shape for Vitali, I don't see how anyone can dispute this. He said he was in great shape for the first Rahman fight as well, when he had spent his time filming a movie instead of training and it showed in his performance.