Mayweather-Pacquiao Will Take Time, Says Arum

[WESS]

[QUOTE=Dave Rado;6165921]

Hatton is a measuring stick for Jnr Welterweight, not for Welterweight. I did not claim that Pac is a natural Welterweight. He looked physically stronger than Hatton in the ring, and Hatton was generally regarded as the physically strongest of all the Jnr Welters. And Hatton was coming off his best win for several years.

Jr WW or not the guy was done 2 years ago. You say a "best" win. I say it was a win vs a guy who couldn't KO him. Easy fight. I like Pauli but really? lol Hatton switching trainers was a sign of destruction as well. The guy was mentally and physically destroyed. Mayweather had him literally crying for days. He will never be the same. Pac has a shell of a guy that was never anything great but just good. I never once doubted Pac in that fight. Anyone that did where complete idiots to the sport.

I discount the De La Hoya fight, but in terms of Jnr Welterweight, you can't rationally say that the man who was the lineal champ for nearly four years, who was ranked #1 at the weight by nearly everyone, and who was coming off a good win, was not a valid test at that weight.

I said Pac could possibly be a jr WW. Its arguable. Again it was vs a bum that night. I really hope Hatton hangs them up. He is nothing more than a stepping stone for guys. Mayweather literally ended this guys career, even up to his corner which split. Dude was done. Pac capitalized on that.

That will be a measuring stick for Welterweight, but even if Pac turns out to be out of his depth at Welterweight, that would not prove that he's not a natural Jnr Welterweight.

my point was its ok for him to win and the other guy gets ****ted on but if he loses the other guy picked on the smaller guy and Pac was just too small and everyone knew it would happen etc etc.

If Cotto beats Pac, then Mayweather Pac won't happen, so this hypothetical discussion would become completely irrelevant. We're only discussing what would happen IF Pac beats Cotto, and whether he'd then and only then be able to be competitive with Mayweather. If he doesn't beat Cotto, the only meaningful discussions would be about Cotto-Mayweather or Mosley-Mayweather. Pac would then be out of the Welterweight picture completely.

Well either way for Mayweather he gets ****ted on. The fight makes the most money but it will be a blow out. Pac almost literally has no chance IMO at competing with Mayweathers skills. Only person that would beat him must be a BIG ass beast like PWILL or a straight up MW. BUT the true test for Pac will be vs Cotto at 145. Which is still BS IMO....

The most meaningful fight for Pac if he loses to Cotto would be against the Bradley-Holt winner, or possibly against Marquez.

JMM III

De La Hoya was coming down 7lb to fight Pac at 147. 147 was effectively a catchweight between Pac's weight at the time (135lb) and De La Hoya's weight at the time (154lb). Cotto is only being asked to come down 2lb. I don't like catchweights, but the catchweight Cotto has agreed to is far less of a problem to him than the effective catchweight De La Hoya agreed to was to him.

No excuses for Hoya he wanted a pay check. Just as Mosley wanted to come down to 140 for Pac. Its for the money. But Hoya that Mayweather "beat" (I had it a draw) and the Hoya that Pac destroyed are two VERY different fighters from two very different times. Cotto is fighting for the WW belt. It should be at the WW limit. This catchweight BS is pissing me off. Emanuel Steward commented on all of this catch weight BS and it sounded like he doesn't like Pac fighting Cotto. he said there are a reason we have weight classes. I couldn't agree more. Its time for Mayweather to man up (like all the haters keep saying) and fight a WW...... yet all of a sudden the want May to fight Pac????? Contradicting.

Having said that, it was De La Hoya's own fault - he stipulated the weight the fight was held at. This isn't an excuse for him. But the fact is, he had to lose far more weight than Cotto is having to lose.

No excuse but its for a WW belt and Cotto should be (since he's fighting for his belt) be allowed to fight at the limit. If Pac cant handle that he needs to move his little 135lb ass back down. Its annoying and its will only be excuses out the ass when he loses. Cotto should not be fighting for his WW belt. Again if Pac wants to challenge the big boys he needs to fight them at that weight or go home. May needs to man up and fight REAL WW.... Pac will only lose and it will be Mayweather ****ing up these little guys excuses all over again. Its old. Pacs too little for May, Mosley, and Cotto.

Does anyone TRULY think that the Cotto that took some hard ass punches from Marg, FAST punches from Mosley and just a tough fight from Clottey will fall to little Pac???? Pac is highly over rated at this point and time. I called this scenario like a year ago. Pac would beat Hatton to the point the that everyone would think he could beat Mayweather or any other WW.....

If Pac dos get past Cotto and gets the WW belt he better be fighting Mayweather at WW. We know Mayweather will no matter what little Pac says. Mayweather will probably walk in at 150 plus if they fought and at the end of the day when Mayweather beats /outclasses him people will still say he was too small and Mayweather fought a small guy yet once again.....

[MindBat]

Manny's best fighting weight is 149. That's above Welter.

[Dave Rado]

either that or the fact the in their 3 common opponents (hatton marquez and de la hoya) floyd sold more ppv buys than pacquio so take that into consideration that mayweather would be the draw and not pacquiao i think mayweather has an edge in negotiating

With respect to Marquez, the PPV figures are not out, and the speculation is no more than speculation.

With respect to Hatton, the difference was small, and taking into account that Pac was fighting Hatton during the worst recession since the 1930s, whereas Mayweather was fighting Hatton during a boom, the difference was completely negligible.

With respect to De La Hoya, not only had the recession started by the time Pac fought him, but the Pac-De La Hoya fight was considered by most people to be a mismatch in De La Hoya's favour, and a circus act, and many fans boycotted it because of that. Taking all that into account, 1.25 million buys was extremely impressive.

In addition, Pac has dramatically increased his exposure to the casual boxing public in the last two years, with two megafights, whereas during the same time period, Mayweather hasn't fought at all, until the Marquez fight.

Mayweather was certainly a bigger draw than Pac before his "retirement", but it's highly debatable whether he is any more.

[Dave Rado]

Well either way for Mayweather he gets ****ted on.

I disagree with that statement. If Cotto beats Pac, which we both think is likely to happen, then Mayweather will have to fight a real Welterweight and won't get ****ted on. If Pac beats Cotto, no one would **** on Mayweather for fighting Pac in that circumstance, other than the most extreme haters (and they would find an excuse to criticise him even if he fought Vitali Klitschko with his hands tied behind his back). But if Pac beats Cotto, no rational fan would criticise Floyd for fighting Pac, and nor would they blame it just on the size difference if he wins, because Pac would by then have already beaten a top Welterweight - admittedly at a bull**** catchweight, but at a catchweight that is not likely to seriously affect the outcome of the fight.

At the end of the day, all Floyd has to do in order to gain the respect of most neutral boxing fans is fight both the Pac-Cotto winner and Mosley. And all he has to do to be rated as highly by neutral boxing fans as he is rated by his worshippers is to beat both of them plus Paul Williams. If he beat all three convincingly, he would have very few haters left, if any; and very few boxing fans would then rate him outside the top 20 of the ATG lists.

[nj_evoixgsr]

Manny's best fighting weight is 149. That's above Welter.

let me guess you missed that cotto will be approximately 160. that's closer to WW? that's pretty damn close to WW limit when other WW are going well over 150s

[WESS]

I disagree with that statement. If Cotto beats Pac, which we both think is likely to happen, then Mayweather will have to fight a real Welterweight and won't get ****ted on. If Pac beats Cotto, no one would **** on Mayweather for fighting Pac in that circumstance, other than the most extreme haters (and they would find an excuse to criticise him even if he fought Vitali Klitschko with his hands tied behind his back). But if Pac beats Cotto, no rational fan would criticise Floyd for fighting Pac, and nor would they blame it just on the size difference if he wins, because Pac would by then have already beaten a top Welterweight - admittedly at a bull**** catchweight, but at a catchweight that is not likely to seriously affect the outcome of the fight.

At the end of the day, all Floyd has to do in order to gain the respect of most neutral boxing fans is fight both the Pac-Cotto winner and Mosley. And all he has to do to be rated as highly by neutral boxing fans as he is rated by his worshippers is to beat both of them plus Paul Williams. If he beat all three convincingly, he would have very few haters left, if any; and very few boxing fans would then rate him outside the top 20 of the ATG lists.

Good point but its Mayweather, those haters WILL be out there and they will hate. I think by beating Pac he gains more hate than any other fighter (excluding Calzaghe) or any fighter that is currently fighting. lol Joe does get a lot of hate (I hate on him lol). Not so much anymore though...

Anyway in a sense I would like to see Mayweather vs Pac just because there will be so much hype behind it and it will blow any MMA/any event out of the water let alone boxing PPV records. On the hand I would like to see Mayweather fight a true WW in which I think will take place just because like you, I don't see Pac beating Cotto. Which IMO is reasonable and fair.

/\/\/\/\/\made this short(er) lol/\/\/\/\/\

November couldn't come any faster.....

[defcon215]

With respect to Marquez, the PPV figures are not out, and the speculation is no more than speculation.

With respect to Hatton, the difference was small, and taking into account that Pac was fighting Hatton during the worst recession since the 1930s, whereas Mayweather was fighting Hatton during a boom, the difference was completely negligible.

With respect to De La Hoya, not only had the recession started by the time Pac fought him, but the Pac-De La Hoya fight was considered by most people to be a mismatch in De La Hoya's favour, and a circus act, and many fans boycotted it because of that. Taking all that into account, 1.25 million buys was extremely impressive.

In addition, Pac has dramatically increased his exposure to the casual boxing public in the last two years, with two megafights, whereas during the same time period, Mayweather hasn't fought at all, until the Marquez fight.

Mayweather was certainly a bigger draw than Pac before his "retirement", but it's highly debatable whether he is any more.

well the numbers came out and it did over a milli so thats 3-0 in favor of mayweather...

with respect to hatton: dont give me that recession talk because we still in it now and that fite was 4 months ago...

as far as de la hoya being a mismatch: wasnt marquez mayweather the same kind of mismatch????? and mayweather took heat for taking the fight instead of pacquiao and that still posted over a million.. more than the pacquiao marquez I & II and both fights were sensational so your argument is kind of weak imo

[Iceta]

This sure sounds like a far cry from what Mosley did by getting up in Floyd's face on national TV in front of over a million people saying, "Let's do this and give the fans what they want."

[big_james10]

Las Vegas - Top Rank promoter Bob Arum says it will take some time to negotiate a best-seller fight between reigning world pound-for-pound king Manny Pacquiao and former No.1 Floyd Mayweather Jr. [details]

This is nothing more than Arum starting to make excuses for not putting Pacquaio in the ring with Mayweather if he beats Cotto. He says its going to take time, so he is going to put Pac in a "stay busy" fight against a still while he "negotiates" with Mayweather. If he thinks it is going to take time, he should start negotiating now.

[1 on 1]

to say that Pac is "much faster" than Floyd is just silly. JMM was able to hit Pac quite a bit, but JMM couldnt hit Floyd with a bucket of water.

I dont believe in "triangle theories" all that much as far as outcome is concerned, but you can clearly see the speed difference looking at the common opponents of Pac and Floyd. Floyd has the speed edge all day.....

That explains why it only took PAC 2 rounds to destroy Flattened and how many rounds did it take for Phony Boy to dismantle Flattened ?? Yeah, hmm.