Pac wants to contest Cotto’s title/ Cotto insists that it should be a Non Title!

[OnePunch]

If Cotto signed a contract that said the limit would be 145 and the title would be at stake, he's screwed. I may be wrong, but I think the WBO has final say whether its sanctioned as title fight or not. If there was nothing in the contract yet make it a title fight at 145 it seriously compromises the integrity of the whole organization, as they would be disregarding their own established weight limits.

but if the WBO presses the issue and pisses Cotto off, Cotto could just vacate the title tomorrow and that would be the end of it, and theres nothing the WBO, Top Rank, or Pac could do about it.

Besides, to hear all the Pac fans tell it (until today, lol) THE BELTS DONT MATTER!!! haha

[MJ406]

what's hypocritical is these so called purist fight fans/ the righteous fight fans who get all bent out of shape because of catch weights & titles on the line not on the line talk so tough on line when they have nothing on the line, nothing to gain or lose but just for the sake to be high & mighty act like a judge jury & executioner on whether a fight is legit or someone is weight drained, or if the fight should ever happen.

really conceited.

regardless of the above, and your opinion on people commenting/criticizing catchweights or not

I put things into two catagories

1. things in life worth arguing about

and things in life not worth arguing about.

for the people defending the 145 catchweight .. if 2 lbs for Cotto isn't such a big deal .. and the fight being at 145 could risk the title (like this topic suggests)

why doesn't Pacquiao just fight at 147?

I don't consider that "high and mighty"

looking at the situation, boxing has 17 weight divisions right?

145 is 2 lbs less.

why not scrap the catchweight and just fight at 147?

it is 2 pounds after all, right?

and all the "legit" "weight drained" arguments would go away

if this fight was at a regular division limit .. oppose to a catchweight.

**I believe the quote goes

"divisions exist for a reason"

not "catchweight's exist for a reason"

[mikelovesfood]

So we should give in to money over integrity? Would Henry Armstrong be remembered so fondy or looked upon with such respect if he had been asking for catchweights? I think not.

i think they had only 7 weight divisions back then right?

[JAB5239]

but if the WBO presses the issue and pisses Cotto off, Cotto could just vacate the title tomorrow and that would be the end of it, and theres nothing the WBO, Top Rank, or Pac could do about it.

Besides, to hear all the Pac fans tell it (until today, lol) THE BELTS DONT MATTER!!! haha

You would know more on this than me, Terry. If Cotto DID sign a contract saying his title would be at stake he would be unable to vacate without breaking that contract, no?

One more question. Does the sanctioning organization have the final say as to what will be a title fight, or are they bound to follow the contracts of their champions?

[MJ406]

i hear ya bud...money talks and in boxing, it barks orders






you should protest and not watch the fight....dont expose yourself to such a childish bout

stop putting words in my mouth, I didn't call the bout childish

just the concept of men arguing about such a small amount of weight is childish.

Don't you agree? what are they women? why not just fight within a division?

can the catchweight and fight at 147. but I guess that would make too much sense.

and if I was gonna fight you, it would have to be a catchweight, for the record.

[JAB5239]

i think they had only 7 weight divisions back then right?

They had actually had 10 (I believe), with 8 being recognized. Armstrong was at large disadvantages in weight during his win over Barney Ross for the welterweight title and his draw with Ceferino Garcia for the middleweight title. He simultaniously had the only titles in the 126, 135 and 147 divisions and almost had the title at 160.

[mikelovesfood]

so then by your "brilliant" logic, every time a fighter moves up to challenge for a title in a higher weight division, its perfectly fine for him to "rework" the weight limits to his benefit??

Something tells me this has a lot more to do with you being a Pac fan, and a lot less to do with the actual merits of the issue.........

no, but i wasn't the one who signed it.

i'm pretty sure when cotto signed it he forgot about the 47' issue because he thought of money first. you disagree with me here?

with that said...why won't he put the belt on the line as well?

it will only bring in more revenue to the fight.

if he wanted to uphold the "integrity" ( the real issue of this thread) of the paper belt handed to him by the WBO he would've just said hell no to Arum and forget about the whole catchweight issue. he didn't though did he?

so by the result of their actions so far, it is in best issue for both camps to have the belt on the line.

[OnePunch]

You would know more on this than me, Terry. If Cotto DID sign a contract saying his title would be at stake he would be unable to vacate without breaking that contract, no?

One more question. Does the sanctioning organization have the final say as to what will be a title fight, or are they bound to follow the contracts of their champions?

If Cotto's bout agreement indicated that it would be a defense of the WBO title, then Cotto vacating the title would indeed be a breach, and he would be open to damages to Top Rank. Typically though bout agreements would absolutely indicate if a title defense was being made, so it leads me to believe it wasnt in the contract, otherwise Cotto would be making statements right now against his own interests if there were to be an ultimate breach later, which his lawyer would certainly have advised him against. But I have not seen the bout agreement, so I have no way to know for sure.
Here is the WBO policy on "non-title fights":

SECTION 15. NONCHAMPIONSHIP FIGHTS or NON-WBO CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHTS
(a) Nothing in these Rules is intended to prohibit a World Champion from engaging in non-WBO Championship fights, even if the non-championship fight is in a weight category different from that in which the Champion is the WBO Title holder. The outcome of any non-title fight shall not affect the recognition of the World Championship by the Organization, provided, however, if a WBO Champions loses a match subject to this Paragraph, the WBO the World Championship Committee may order the WBO Champion to conduct a Mandatory Contest within 120 days of losing the match.

(b) A WBO champions shall not participate in a non-championship fight that is not a WBO Championship without the prior authorization of the WBO World Championship Committee. This authorization shall be subject to such conditions as the WBO World Championship Committee determines. In addition, this authorization will be granted only on the condition that the WBO Champion pay a fee to the WBO that is the equivalent of the amount that he WBO Champion would have paid to the WBO if the nonchampionship fight were conducted as a WBO Championship fight.

(c) A WBO Champion who wins a non-WBO Championship in weight class that is different than the weight class in which he holds his WBO Championship must decide within ten (10) days of the non-WBO Championship which title in which weight class he will retain. No WBO Champion may hold a non-WBO Championship in a weight class that is different from the weight class of his WBO Championship.


The WBO differs from the IBF in a very important way. In the IBF, you only retain the title if your bout was OVER the weight limit of your title. If you fight a non-title fight at or below your weight and lose, the IBF vacates the title. The WBO should correct this rule, because to have a guy keeping a title if he loses a non-title bout at or below the weight limit (unless his opponent was overweight) is just silly...............

[-MAKAVELLI-]

stop putting words in my mouth, I didn't call the bout childish

just the concept of men arguing about such a small amount of weight is childish.

Don't you agree? what are they women? why not just fight within a division?

can the catchweight and fight at 147. but I guess that would make too much sense.

and if I was gonna fight you, it would have to be a catchweight, for the record.

you got that right...i would FORCE you to come down 1 whole lb from your last weigh-in...that way, i would have ALL this advantage...aaaaaand...it would make you put up your e-thug championship belt on the line


save it tough guy...we have differing views on the matter...you've brought good points that i can agree with...keep your inner troll on check...

[JM1]

145 + 65/35=no way in hell cotto's title is on the line..that wouldnt be fair at all..you wanna challenge the champ...play by the champs rules

so if pac goes back to lighweight tomorow, then challenges edwin valero, you mean valero must be the one to dictate the stipulations of the fight?