Armstrong vs. Pacquiao: Catchweights Make Alltime P4P Comparisons a Moot Point

[El Jesus]

His decision to vacate was dictated greatly by sanctioning body politics. A marquez rematch at 130 was optional. His mandatory defense at 130 would have been Francisco Lorenzo. His mandatory at lightweight would have been Anthony Pitalua. Hardly worthy contenders. Something that would not have happened in the days of Armstrong.

How would you know? Everytime you discuss old school fighters/fights/circumstance you usually get it wrong, and this here is no exception. The sanctioning bodies back then were just as crorrupt then as they are now, infact in some instances it was even more blatant and fights were constantly fixed and unworthy challangers were pitted against a top champion in an effort to make fighters look good. The difference is that fighters have more say in what they do and if they wanna duck someone they can.

Pacs desicion to vacate was his and his teams desicion, period, you hoenstly telling me that a corrupt *** like jose sulaiman wouldnt allow him to take on each WBC titleholder from 135-147 all while he held the belts at the same time? Hell yes he would. The only thing stopping pac from doing that is...

Currently at 140 that title is vacant, a fight could easily be arranged to allow a cash cow like pac to fight for that title and take it. Valero is the champ at 135, berto is the champ at 147.

In order to bring legtimacy to the comparison of armstrong hed have to beat all three and hold them at the same time. AND YES, they would let him do it. Doing it would seriously bring a legit comparison, until then, pac is just moving up and collecting paychecks against big names like everyone else. There is a reason why armstrong is rated 2 or 3rd all time usually. And its not because he wouldnt step into the ring against slick boxers, its not because he was matched against guys who possibly could play into what would make him successfull, its not because he moved up to up his PPV status, NO he did it because he dared to be great, something only a guy like hopkins i can honestly say really tries anymore. Not mayweather and not pac i can truely say really do this, i know thats a strong opinion, but neither of those guys really give a *** about history, they care about the money, th eonly difference is that one of them has a fanbase and is a genuine nice guy, so its acceptable. No matter how you look at it, there is no comparison from pac to armstrong other than a couple of similarities.

[Deja_Vous]

these WWs need to stop begging pac for a fight.

And Fanny Pac should stop begging WW's to drain down and fight the mofos at 140 since he's such a big draw.

[Deja_Vous]

126 through 147. Damn, I never knew that.

And he fought to a "draw" with the Middleweight Champion...MOST say he was robbed.

[TheGreatA]

Those who say that Armstrong fought sparring partner level opposition in most of his 180 fights would be wrong. He had a couple of fights against "bums" but most of his fights were against ranked contenders.

Armstrong was one fighter who really did not care about weight, he was slightly bloated even at 140, but he kept fighting at welterweight. He did have one catchweight fight however, against the lightweight champion of the world Lew Jenkins. Armstrong had to come in at under 140 lbs.

The man was serious about challenging greats like Joe Louis and Billy Conn.

Robinson I'm sure would have used catchweights to his utmost advantage, he was as much of a businessman as anyone today.

[TheGreatA]

Those who say that Armstrong fought sparring partner level opposition in most of his 180 fights would be wrong. He had a couple of fights against "bums" but most of his fights were against ranked contenders.

Armstrong was one fighter who really did not care about weight, he was slightly bloated even at 140, but he kept fighting at welterweight. He did have one catchweight fight however, against the lightweight champion of the world Lew Jenkins. Armstrong had to come in at under 140 lbs.

The man was serious about challenging greats like Joe Louis and Billy Conn.

Robinson I'm sure would have used catchweights to his utmost advantage, he was as much of a businessman as anyone today.

Even then, near 40 year old Robinson challenged the heavyweight champion Floyd Patterson. D'Amato turned the offer down, thinking it would be insane on Robinson's part and that Patterson would be given no credit.

[Pullcounter]

And Fanny Pac should stop begging WW's to drain down and fight the mofos at 140 since he's such a big draw.

if they weren't begging pac for fights in the first place, then pac wouldnt even consider them.

[Thread Stealer]

but back then catchweights wasn't a luxury... its like saying back then we had cassette walkmans while now u have iPods.. if only such idea was suggested back then...hmmmm..

times are a changin'.. I'm sure Robinson and Armstrong would have LOVED catchweights..

Armstrong probably didn't like catch weights that much.

He was the one who had to lose some weight for a catch weight bout with Lew Jenkins.

Although Armstrong was a small welter, and won the fight, so I suppose it didn't bother him too much.

[2nd Round KO]

Bump for further discussion.

[MJ406]

to hit on an old point I brought up in another topic regarding this catchweight madness

I heard someone refer to "Manny fighting the Welterweights at 147 is suicide"

so I ask if the above is suicide, then what is Manny fighting a Welter at 144-145?

and on top of that, sure Cotto or Mosley will weight blow up in weight over night and weight more than Pacquiao come fight night

but will the weight advantage they have be such a deciding factor in the outcome?

**Pacquiao might have leverage in negotiations being Pound For Pound #1, however the fight options for Pac at Welter (Cotto, Mosley or Floyd) to name three

trump the names Manny could fight at 140 (Bradley, Campbell and/or Valero)

just something to consider. ^