The definitive poll: Who's higher on the ATG list--Calzaghe or Hopkins?

[Obama]

true actually my bad - DLH was proven at WW and LMW i dont know what i was thinking when i typed that.

but he did lose to sturm - no doubt about it and like i said had no buisness being up at MW.

iv no idea who was in the MW's at the time but if johnson was he would have beat DLh handily.

He "lost" to Sturm because he was out of shape. It's pretty obvious he would have beat him handidly in a rematch. And Glen Johnson hadn't been a Middleweight since 1997...DLH fought Sturm in 2004. Dude, how can you rip me as a biased person then not know your facts?

Back before boxing got silly, if you were bigger than a Welterweight, you were a Middleweight. De La Hoya was EASILY a top 3 calibur Middleweight when he fought Hopkins. And the only name you could decisively put ahead of him is Hopkins. No one else. Jermain Taylor had begun to make a name for himself around that time, but other than him I don't recall a Middleweight who would have beat De La Hoya.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

He "lost" to Sturm because he was out of shape. It's pretty obvious he would have beat him handidly in a rematch. And Glen Johnson hadn't been a Middleweight since 1997...DLH fought Sturm in 2004. Dude, how can you rip me as a biased person then not know your facts?

Back before boxing got silly, if you were bigger than a Welterweight, you were a Middleweight. De La Hoya was EASILY a top 3 calibur Middleweight when he fought Hopkins. And the only name you could decisively put ahead of him is Hopkins. No one else. Jermain Taylor had begun to make a name for himself around that time, but other than him I don't recall a Middleweight who would have beat De La Hoya.

Getting beaten up by Felix Sturm makes you a top 3 middleweight?

Im sure Sturms last few opponents will be delighted with that

[SHB]

true actually my bad - DLH was proven at WW and LMW i dont know what i was thinking when i typed that.

but he did lose to sturm - no doubt about it and like i said had no buisness being up at MW.

iv no idea who was in the MW's at the time but if johnson was he would have beat DLh handily.

p.s. SHB im interested in your opinion who do you think had the more impressive career hopkins at MW hopkins or calzaghe at SMW

As you're asking, their resumes are roughly the same during their title reigns. Plenty of decent world-level operators (Echols, Vanderpool, DLH vs Mitchell, Brewer and Lacy) and plenty of worthless opponents - for every Pudwill there's an Andrew Council, for every Mcintyre there's a Simon Brown. Are Hopkins' best (Trinidad and Echols) better than Calzaghe's best (Kessler and Eubank)? Possibly. You can argue it either way.

Where Hopkins stands out for me is his jumping up two divisions to wipe out Tarver. Plus big name wins against Wright and Moby, even if both had no business being up at LHW ... just how fat was Winky at 170?! However Calzaghe stepping up to 175 and beating a still #1 ranked Hopkins and a lively enough Jones are still decent achievements even if the latter would have been quite something 10 years earlier.

[SHB]

You mean the ceo who is Frank Warrens American Representative in negotiations Jay Larkin?

I mean the person who brokered the deal and was the CEO of the television company who had both fighters on their books and with no axe to grind.

Give it up ... there's no shame in Hopkins walking away from the fight. No compulsion on him to step up to SMW. But stop saying he didn't walk away from an agreement - because he did.

[Patheticfraud?]

maaaan, you're still here? i stopped taking notice of your comments a long time ago, go home kid its past your bed time

Sure you did, You've been hanging on my every word for a couple hours. You even wrote a novel in response to one of my earlier posts. I didn't read any of it by the way so it was time well spent.

[SHB]

Getting beaten up by Felix Sturm makes you a top 3 middleweight?

Im sure Sturms last few opponents will be delighted with that

DLH isn't in Hopkins' top 10 wins IMO.

[hookoutofhell]

As you're asking, their resumes are roughly the same during their title reigns. Plenty of decent world-level operators (Echols, Vanderpool, DLH vs Mitchell, Brewer and Lacy) and plenty of worthless opponents - for every Pudwill there's an Andrew Council, for every Mcintyre there's a Simon Brown. Are Hopkins' best (Trinidad and Echols) better than Calzaghe's best (Kessler and Eubank)? Possibly. You can argue it either way.

Where Hopkins stands out for me is his jumping up two divisions to wipe out Tarver. Plus big name wins against Wright and Moby, even if both had no business being up at LHW ... just how fat was Winky at 170?! However Calzaghe stepping up to 175 and beating a still #1 ranked Hopkins and a lively enough Jones are still decent achievements even if the latter would have been quite something 10 years earlier.

fair do's, personally i think theres a reason he missed out on the SMW division and its not because he 'wanted to go where they would be no excuses'

[Patheticfraud?]

I mean the person who brokered the deal and was the CEO of the television company who had both fighters on their books and with no axe to grind.

Give it up ... there's no shame in Hopkins walking away from the fight. No compulsion on him to step up to SMW. But stop saying he didn't walk away from an agreement - because he did.

No axe to grind you say?

"Showtime made a very aggressive offer so we're confident there will at least be a fight for Joe [in 2007], said Jay Larkin, the former Showtime boxing chief now serving as Calzaghe promoter Frank Warren's U.S. representative."

You just got owned kid, Go take a nap!

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/columns/story?columnist=rafael_dan&id=2927585

[Dirk Diggler UK]

I mean the person who brokered the deal and was the CEO of the television company who had both fighters on their books and with no axe to grind.

Give it up ... there's no shame in Hopkins walking away from the fight. No compulsion on him to step up to SMW. But stop saying he didn't walk away from an agreement - because he did.

Reasoning with ******ity is futile

[SHB]

fair do's, personally i think theres a reason he missed out on the SMW division and its not because he 'wanted to go where they would be no excuses'

Well, quite possibly. I picked Calzaghe to win when the fight was first mooted 7 years ago and I stand by that. Calzaghe just was not an attraction to the big names - partly because he wasn't a big draw in the US, partly because he couldn't bring the money they wanted but partly because he was a massive threat to anyone. Hell, we even have Roy Jones saying that he wasn't worth the risk back in the day. If he has the class to say that then you have to wonder why other people can't.