The Bernard Win Over Pavlik

[THE REED]

This fight is weird for me... because on one count... Im blown away, on another count, im not overly impressed.

Im blown away at the fact a 43 year old athlete can perform the way Bernard did for 12 rounds... truly shocked, I was then and I am now...

I'm not overly impressed in a way because from another angle, what resistance did Pavlik really give Bernard? He seemed to plod and barely even let his punches off, he didn't make Bernard work, he didn't force the fight.

The common rebuttal to that is, well that's because he was fighting Bernard.

And I would agree with you there, to a degree. I'd also say Winky moved up to 170 and STILL fought a VERY close fight with Bernard. I'm not convinced Kelly won a single round.

Pavliks look in that fight DID have a lot to do with Bernards tactic, movement, and speed advantage.

But what about the weight? Did the weight REALLY not effect him? I mean I watched Pavlik come in Taylor I to completely DESTROY Jermain... In the rematch, 166 pounds... Pavlik looked a little more normal of a fighter, and I do agree Jermain stepped up his game somewhat in the rematch. But what I mostly noticed was Pavlik seemed a little more sluggish at that weight.

Now at 170 lbs. Pavlik looks horrible... he's barely moving, barely punching.


So this thread isn't really a "im telling you what happened" sort of thread... but more of a ... whats your view point of the whole situation? as far as how big of a threat was Pavlik really, at 170?


Like I said on one hand you have a 43 year old fighter doing something extraordinary for a 43 year old athlete.. just as far as moving around the ring for 12 rounds, and letting his hands go like crazy.... then on the other hand you basically have a plodding punching bag, no real threat.

It's almost like Bernard showed up to the gym that day.



Please comment how highly you rate the win: A 43 yr old victory over the undefeated middleweight champ blown up at another weight

[Golden Boy 360]

Kelly is one dimensional

[street bully]

Hopkins does his best work against come forward grinding types of fighters ie. Glenn Johnson, Tito ect, and Kelly fits that mold. Also it isn't right comparing that fight to the Winky fight because Winky while smaller than Pavlik is more skilled and has outstanding defensive skills.

[hammerhiem]

In teh first taylor fight taylor stood still, in the second fight taylor added limited lateral movement and pavlik looked worse.

In the Hopkins fight Bhop showed pavlik angles and he froze, he honestly didn't know what to do, because the amateur system no longer rewards lateral movement or good boxing he has never had to deal with someone who moves when he's lining up his jabs.

So unable to work of his jab he had nothing to fall back on and got beat left right and center by a Bhop who did nothing more than the basics a championship level fighter should do.

[S A M U R A I]

'Nard just has a nightmare style for Pavlik. I think that's all there is to it. They could fight at any weight and the outcome would be more or less the same. Pavlik has never had to deal with movement, experience and ring smarts like that.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3

[S A M U R A I]

In the Hopkins fight Bhop showed pavlik angles and he froze, he honestly didn't know what to do

Yeah, exactly.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3

[THE REED]

basically im looking for.... after taking everything into consideration how high do you rate the win...


a 43 yr old victory over the undefeated middleweight champ blown up at another weight

[Sparked_1985]

I think Pavlik will always lose to the elite guys with great movement.

I still don't know how Jermain Taylor couldn't beat him, he done very badly against Pavlik - twice.

Although to be fair he could have wiped him out in two rounds.

[ИATAS]

I think it was just hopkins taking away Pavliks only weapons, his jab and his 1, 2. That's all pavlik had. Once those are gone, pavlik has nothing.

Now as far as the weight, I don't think it makes a difference. For one, pavlik is a big middleweight and two, he fought at 166 just prior. Sure, he didn't knock out taylor in the rematch, but taylor was fighting smarter, and didn't fatigue like he did in the first fight.

Plus, Pavlik was planning on moving up in weight anyways. Both pavlik and his trainer, prior to hopkins, said on several occasions that it was becoming harder and harder for pavlik to make weight and he would be more comfortable at a higher weight class like super middleweight. Only after hopkins kicking his ass did they decide to stay at 160 and use the weight as an excuse.

Also, I think right from the start pavlik was shocked by hopkins. I mean from the opening bell hopkins attacked, and kept attacking, which I'm sure was completely the opposite of what he thought was going to happen. He got tagged a couple times in the first round and I bet he was shocked at both hopkins' speed & power. After round 2, look at pavlik's face, he looked lost and confused. Then it was just a matter of pavlik waiting for hopkins to slow down, which obviously never happened and by the later rounds, pavlik was simply trying to survive as he knew the fight was over.

[hammerhiem]

basically im looking for.... after taking everything into consideration how high do you rate the win...


a 43 yr old victory over the undefeated middleweight champ blown up at another weight

very high, he's 43 and that was one of the most complete distructions of a legitimate champion i've seen in a long long time, Pavlik may have flaws but you have to expose the flaws they don't expose themselves.