Better Resume: Calzaghe or Mayweather?

[Benny Leonard]

who did mayweather beat better than jones jr, hopkins.

no1.

Ignorance isn't that funny....

[77Ritchie77]

floyds biggest wins: corrales, castillo, de la hoya, judah, hatton, baldomir
calzaghes biggest wins: b-hop, kessler,eubank, lacy, mitchell, jones

corrales was a big win for floyd at 130, although corrales' head wasn't there still big win for floyd
castillo was close but he still got the win and won a rematch - in castillos prime
de la hoya - very underrated win for floyd, although he didnt dominate not on p4p
judah - no longer on p4p - was on downside of his career - not on p4p
hatton - beat one of the best 140 lbers in a long time - on p4p list
baldomir - beat judah and thats it for his career

Calzaghe
Hopkins - big win as it came in between hopkins wins over winky, tarver and pavlik.
higher than any floyd opponent on p4p lists
Kessler - awesome 168 lber beat in unification - in top 15 p4p
eubank - had only lost to collins by 1 round, nobody else - big win for calz - was he still on p4p lists then? im too young
Lacy - ruined his career - not on p4p
mitchell - this fight would have been for wba, ibf and wbo if not for horrible german judges
overall calzaghe has beaten better opponents in his best 6 fights
after his best 6 calzaghe didnt face too much competition at all where floyd beat a whos who of lower top 10 fighters from 130-147.

[77Ritchie77]

calzaghes win over jones says maybe a bit more than floyd over baldomir... but not much

[Benny Leonard]

calzaghes win over jones says maybe a bit more than floyd over baldomir... but not much

Baldomir at least had a heart-beat...as well as a size advantage and a title.


Seriously, take Jones off the resume. It is admitting to someone you beat your Grandfather up.

[Savino]

Mayweather.

[Mugwump]

Bernard wasn't good enough to beat Taylor. That's what Calzaghe brought up prior to their fight.

Joe was always going to needle Hopkins over a loss - even if that loss had been to Jesus Christ Almighty fighting the fight of his life. It was certainly dismissive of Taylor. Either Joe genuinely believes Taylor's no good (in which case I think he's got it wrong)* or the needling served a dual-purpose as the opening salvo in the build-up to a fight with Taylor.

Bernard had become a boring fighter for a reason; he was on the decline.

Speak for yourself. I don't think Hopkins is boring at all. I find there are a million subtleties to appreciate about his fighting. The guy is a model of economical exertion in service to peerless boxing aptitude. If he doesn't go on to become a great trainer I'll be amazed.

I think it says more with Kelly being overrated and should always stick to fighting at MW and never go into a fight with a crafty fighter.

I think perhaps his fans have been guilty of overrating him. Outside of them I'm not too sure. Pretty much all the smart journos I read had him tagged pretty well: heavy-handed, high-work rate, brave and limited beyond plan A. I don't believe he was unwise to take on Hopkins. As Hatton said to Larry Merchant - "What are we in this business for?"

Hopkins prime ended 8 years ago and ever since he was on the decline...but yes, he has always been smart enough to make up for it to a point...except when he had to go up against a young athletic type like Taylor.

Agreed. Although Pavlik is young and not unathletic [forgive the double negative]

He is still a "decent" fighter, but not what he once was. His biggest problem has been his stamina.

This I don't agree with at all. "Decent" is a guy who wins as many fights as he loses - a journeyman.

This version of Hopkins doesn't stand a better chance at beating the Roy that beat the younger more athletic Hopkins.

Roy wins both for sure. But this version would pose a completely different set of problems for him.

People act like Hopkins was so green, but the truth is, he had been fighting in prison and was the prison Champ.

Sure. But that is no substitute for the real thing. If it were Tyson wouldn't have needed to bother with the dubious ilk of McNeeley.

* I still rate Taylor. Or at least I rate the potential of Taylor. Even now I don't think Joe would have it easy against him. Perhaps when Jermaine looks back on his career in years to come he'll think he let himself down pretty badly. Beating Hopkins should have signalled a long reign at the very top. I don't want to dump on Kelly's achievements (because I still feel he's a very good fighter) but I think JT was partially the architect of his own downfall. Pity.

[Benny Leonard]

Mugwump;4382112Joe was always going to needle Hopkins over a loss - even if that loss had been to Jesus Christ Almighty fighting the fight of his life. It was certainly dismissive of Taylor. Either Joe genuinely believes Taylor's no good (in which case I think he's got it wrong)* or the needling served a dual-purpose as the opening salvo in the build-up to a fight with Taylor.

Losing to Taylor just showed Hopkins was past it. Even before that, he hadn't fought like he used to. Robert Allen also pointed to Hopkins decline and he should know, he fought Hopkins a few times.

It was if the last time Hopkins was oiled was for Tito and after that; he was running on whatever oil he had left. He became as stiff as the tin-man when he wasn't oiled.

Speak for yourself. I don't think Hopkins is boring at all. I find there are a million subtleties to appreciate about his fighting. The guy is a model of economical exertion in service to peerless boxing aptitude. If he doesn't go on to become a great trainer I'll be amazed.

Hopkins is boring. If you watch all his fights leading up to Tito you would know what I'm talking about.

I forget how Larry Merchant put it in one of his fights...something like: Hopkins used to be a Lion that hunted down his prey, now, he is a Lion that waits behind the bushes.

I think perhaps his fans have been guilty of overrating him. Outside of them I'm not too sure. Pretty much all the smart journos I read had him tagged pretty well: heavy-handed, high-work rate, brave and limited beyond plan A. I don't believe he was unwise to take on Hopkins. As Hatton said to Larry Merchant - "What are we in this business for?"

Fans tend to overrate everybody they like. I don't think he sucks, far from it, but I don't think he has had the proper training to be that "elite" fighter people were talking about. Elite as in: once he moves up can he handle being the same size as everybody else.

I'm for what Hatton said; a great comment.

Agreed. Although Pavlik is young and not unathletic [forgive the double negative]

LOL; you got me

This I don't agree with at all. "Decent" is a guy who wins as many fights as he loses - a journeyman.

Decent compared to his original self. Decent compared to being "Great."

It's like one of those great athletes that has been on the slide and somebody asks you, "How is he now," and you say "Eh, Decent." Basically, better than most, but not the same as he once was; just good enough.

Sure. But that is no substitute for the real thing. If it were Tyson wouldn't have needed to bother with the dubious ilk of McNeeley.

Tyson wasn't allowed to box, let alone train in boxing. He started to recondition himself in jail, but he wasn't boxing. HUGE difference.

* I still rate Taylor. Or at least I rate the potential of Taylor. Even now I don't think Joe would have it easy against him. Perhaps when Jermaine looks back on his career in years to come he'll think he let himself down pretty badly. Beating Hopkins should have signalled a long reign at the very top. I don't want to dump on Kelly's achievements (because I still feel he's a very good fighter) but I think JT was partially the architect of his own downfall. Pity.

I don't think Taylor has the stamina to keep up with Joe. I also don't see Taylor as a crafty fighter.

Taylor's problem may be mental more than anything else. I think that was what Emmanuel may have alluded to as well. Taylor has many physical gifts, but he doesn't connect the Mental and Physical to make a complete fighter.

[them_apples]

Like Floyd ducked Cotto, Marg, Williams and Clottey and fought Judah,Baldomir,Mitchell and Hatton?

Please... "peeleft:"peeleft:

At least they were in their Primes...also keep in mind thats floyds 4th-5th jump in weight..calzaghe moved up once. Floyds a little overated but Calzaghe is the epitome of overated, picking a shot Jones was just discraceful..especially after he himself said he was shot. Why doesn't he stop picking and choosing and fight a legit prime champion.

[Mugwump]

At least they were in their Primes...also keep in mind thats floyds 4th-5th jump in weight..calzaghe moved up once. Floyds a little overated but Calzaghe is the epitome of overated, picking a shot Jones was just discraceful..especially after he himself said he was shot. Why doesn't he stop picking and choosing and fight a legit prime champion.

Two out of his last six opponents have been prime champions.

Three out of his last six opponents have been champions. Can't think of too many fighters hitting that ratio or better at the moment.

[-Boxzilla-]

this is such an easy poll . . . mayweather without a doubt or second thought.