Calzaghe beats Jones at any age.

[Wiley Hyena]

Actually, Bruno exposed Tyson first. He exposed Tyson's inabilityto be 100% effective without Rooney...and like all athletes, proper training both Mentally and Physically is key to victory.

Holyfield fought Tyson post-prison. Tyson was shot mentally and hadn't trained properly in a long time. Some would say he was shot mentally after Douglas, but I don't think so; more like, "not all there."


However, it is funny you speak of this topic: Calzaghe was exposed as well in a way: he waited, waited, waited, until the best fighters that could expose him were old.

Or as a great quote I once read goes:

"Show me a fighter whose undefeated and I'll show you a fighter who hasn't fought anybody." --Whitey Bimstein, legendary boxing trainer.

That's good stuff, but everything I said is true, nevertheless. I guess we'll never know why Hopkins and Jones didn't fight Calzaghe way back when. But, it's all done now. Calzaghe's run through of Lacey, Kessler, Hopkins, and Jones, Jr., iced the argument and marked Calzaghe's place in history. He's a great fighter with a style nobody ever figured out, and is arguably the best of his generation.

P.S. We can argue about Jones' longevity, but Calzaghe's win over Hopkins is another matter. That fight illuminated Calzaghe's true greatness, which to any reasonable boxing aficionado is beyond dispute.

[ferocity]

I just finished watching the fight and this Roy Jones Jr. would have beat Tarver in there 3rd fight and would of beaten Glenn Johnson. Too many Calzaghe haters. Roy never gave up and had his legs through 12, and what a hell of a chin from Calzaghe. And him showing off is nothing compared to how Roy used to show off to his opponet Roys fans should be ashamed of themself for crying of taunting by Calzaghe.

And one thing i noticed is that no way that is a prime Calzaghe in there. I know it wasn't a prime Jones but that wasnt' a prime Calzaghe either he looked tired after 7 rounds. This was a great win for Calzaghe, Roy didn't look as finished as many of his fans would like you to belive.

And it was kind of funny, Roy would keep his cut eye closed as if it was fully closed when it wasn't. He got blood in his eye but i think Roys fans played the drama queens. And Roy said in the interview, "i didn't know wheather i wanted to go for the ko or some other plan" and that right there in a bunch has been Roys career of thought, a few fights after getting to LH and that mentality would get any fighter ko'd, cause your opponet sure as hell isn't taking a step back if he has the chance to ko you. But i dont' think Roy in his prime would have Ko'd Calzaghe, prime for prime Calazghe v. Jones is an even fight but i'd put my money on Calzaghe.

[RayLeonard82]

Heres my answer to the thread starter.

Simply go back to the 1st round and look at after Roy knocked Calzaghe down. Look at how slow Roy is when he tried to open up end of the 1st round. Please don't credit that to Calzaghe's defense. The openings were right there and Calzaghe was stunned. Roy just had no snap on his punch and you could see it coming as a observer. Prime Roy was so fast as a observer i could barely see the punch coming. He was extremely slow and it wasn't Joe's defense.

The lunging upercut that used to be Roy's specialty in the 1990's. Had Calzaghe tried putting his hands down like that against that Roy, ge gets clocked with it. Lets keep in mind he was badly hurt by Roy in the 1st round and that wasn't even Roy's best punch. His best shot is the lunging upercut which he has not even attemped in years because he knows he's to slow to reach the target. He didn't even use it against Hanshaw or Tito.

Roy used to be so fast he could nail a opponent with a upercut from 10 feet away. Watch the fight with Julio Gonzales. Watch how quickly he reaches the target from distance.

If your going to say Calzaghe is better then Roy because he beat this Roy than Terry Norris is better then any version of Sugar Ray Leonard. Its the same thing.

Again, watch the end of the 1st round when Roy attempts to open up. Calzeghe did nothing special to make Roy look that slow.

[Benny Leonard]

That's good stuff, but everything I said is true, nevertheless. I guess we'll never know why Hopkins and Jones didn't fight Calzaghe way back when. But, it's all done now. Calzaghe's run through of Lacey, Kessler, Hopkins, and Jones, Jr., iced the argument and marked Calzaghe's place in history. He's a great fighter with a style nobody ever figured out, and is arguably the best of his generation.

P.S. We can argue about Jones' longevity, but Calzaghe's win over Hopkins is another matter. That fight illuminated Calzaghe's true greatness, which to any reasonable boxing aficionado is beyond dispute.

We know why Joe didn't fight Roy back then: He didn't one to leave Britain, or if we want to blame Warren, even though Warren works for him, he couldn't get the fight done. Joe could have moved up in weight and became the *1 contender, but never did. In past interviews with Calzaghe regarding Jones Jr., it seemed Joe was in awe of Jones Jr. back then.
Roy is not going to leave the States after what happened to him in the Olympics; this was known. Plus, the money was better over here and I never heard of an offer from Calzaghe's camp.

Long list of fighters that made their way to the States to fight for the Money and Champion. Joe waited until the end when Roy was shot.

Hopkins: I blame Hopkins. He does have somewhat of a pass because he was waiting for that big payday against Oscar. After that, Euros wanted him to fight Eastman, so he did that. Then, Taylor was the man that was going to replace him; so he stayed and fought. After that, he moved up.

I still think Hopkins should have made the move up after Tito; that would have been a great time for the two to fight. But I'm not sure where Hopkins was at the time with title defenses for record...which is another reason he stayed down.

But it works both ways: If Joe wanted Hopkins to move up, then why didn't Joe move up to face a Prime Roy Jones Jr.?

ANd for not figuring Joe out; well, nobody figured out Rocky Marciano either but look at who they fought and when they fought them. Although I'll give credit to Joe for to impressive wins against Lacy and Kessler, but neither were boxer that could test that style like Roy Jones Jr. and Hopkins.

Joe is a very good fighter and going into the Hall of Fame. He is not to me, the best fighter of his generation. He is part of the Roy Generation and no way do I see him being better than a prime Roy Jones.

P.S. We can argue about Jones' longevity, but Calzaghe's win over Hopkins is another matter. That fight illuminated Calzaghe's true greatness, which to any reasonable boxing aficionado is beyond dispute

How so?
I still recall Hopkins becoming a pot-shot artist; a heavy clincher; and pacing himself carefully as he got up there in age.
I recall him losing to Taylor, Twice.

He did beat Tarver, but Tarver beat a deflated Roy Jones, and Tarver himself experienced this deflation of his body in the same manner Roy did. That victory over Tarver for Hopkins, and I said this on this board, was overrated.

Hopkins was 43 years old and kept it close.

[Vasyl’s dad]

Heres my answer to the thread starter.

Simply go back to the 1st round and look at after Roy knocked Calzaghe down. Look at how slow Roy is when he tried to open up end of the 1st round. Please don't credit that to Calzaghe's defense. The openings were right there and Calzaghe was stunned. Roy just had no snap on his punch and you could see it coming as a observer. Prime Roy was so fast as a observer i could barely see the punch coming. He was extremely slow and it wasn't Joe's defense.

The lunging upercut that used to be Roy's specialty in the 1990's. Had Calzaghe tried putting his hands down like that against that Roy, ge gets clocked with it. Lets keep in mind he was badly hurt by Roy in the 1st round and that wasn't even Roy's best punch. His best shot is the lunging upercut which he has not even attemped in years because he knows he's to slow to reach the target. He didn't even use it against Hanshaw or Tito.

Roy used to be so fast he could nail a opponent with a upercut from 10 feet away. Watch the fight with Julio Gonzales. Watch how quickly he reaches the target from distance.

If your going to say Calzaghe is better then Roy because he beat this Roy than Terry Norris is better then any version of Sugar Ray Leonard. Its the same thing.

Again, watch the end of the 1st round when Roy attempts to open up. Calzeghe did nothing special to make Roy look that slow.

They fought 11 other rounds guy.

Not just one.

Calzaghe is past his prime as well and would have been faster had they fought 7-10 years ago.

[ferocity]

Heres my answer to the thread starter.

Simply go back to the 1st round and look at after Roy knocked Calzaghe down. Look at how slow Roy is when he tried to open up end of the 1st round. Please don't credit that to Calzaghe's defense. The openings were right there and Calzaghe was stunned. Roy just had no snap on his punch and you could see it coming as a observer. Prime Roy was so fast as a observer i could barely see the punch coming. He was extremely slow and it wasn't Joe's defense.

The lunging upercut that used to be Roy's specialty in the 1990's. Had Calzaghe tried putting his hands down like that against that Roy, ge gets clocked with it. Lets keep in mind he was badly hurt by Roy in the 1st round and that wasn't even Roy's best punch. His best shot is the lunging upercut which he has not even attemped in years because he knows he's to slow to reach the target. He didn't even use it against Hanshaw or Tito.

Roy used to be so fast he could nail a opponent with a upercut from 10 feet away. Watch the fight with Julio Gonzales. Watch how quickly he reaches the target from distance.

If your going to say Calzaghe is better then Roy because he beat this Roy than Terry Norris is better then any version of Sugar Ray Leonard. Its the same thing.

Again, watch the end of the 1st round when Roy attempts to open up. Calzeghe did nothing special to make Roy look that slow.

Stop the excuses Calzaghe would have given Roy problems even in his prime. And i don't think Calzaghe is prime right now not when he looks gassed after 7 rounds where he is dominating a fighter.

Julio Gonzalez was a slow fighter, but you should mention that he put Roy on the ropes a lot of the time during there fight as would Calzaghe as he did.

Roy just got a taste of his own medicine simple as that, power is the last thing to go and Roy landed some clean ****en shots and Calzaghe stood up to every single one after the first round.

[ferocity]

We know why Joe didn't fight Roy back then: He didn't one to leave Britain, or if we want to blame Warren, even though Warren works for him, he couldn't get the fight done. Joe could have moved up in weight and became the *1 contender, but never did. In past interviews with Calzaghe regarding Jones Jr., it seemed Joe was in awe of Jones Jr. back then.
Roy is not going to leave the States after what happened to him in the Olympics; this was known. Plus, the money was better over here and I never heard of an offer from Calzaghe's camp.

Long list of fighters that made their way to the States to fight for the Money and Champion. Joe waited until the end when Roy was shot.

Hopkins: I blame Hopkins. He does have somewhat of a pass because he was waiting for that big payday against Oscar. After that, Euros wanted him to fight Eastman, so he did that. Then, Taylor was the man that was going to replace him; so he stayed and fought. After that, he moved up.

I still think Hopkins should have made the move up after Tito; that would have been a great time for the two to fight. But I'm not sure where Hopkins was at the time with title defenses for record...which is another reason he stayed down.

But it works both ways: If Joe wanted Hopkins to move up, then why didn't Joe move up to face a Prime Roy Jones Jr.?

ANd for not figuring Joe out; well, nobody figured out Rocky Marciano either but look at who they fought and when they fought them. Although I'll give credit to Joe for to impressive wins against Lacy and Kessler, but neither were boxer that could test that style like Roy Jones Jr. and Hopkins.

Joe is a very good fighter and going into the Hall of Fame. He is not to me, the best fighter of his generation. He is part of the Roy Generation and no way do I see him being better than a prime Roy Jones.





How so?
I still recall Hopkins becoming a pot-shot artist; a heavy clincher; and pacing himself carefully as he got up there in age.
I recall him losing to Taylor, Twice.

He did beat Tarver, but Tarver beat a deflated Roy Jones, and Tarver himself experienced this deflation of his body in the same manner Roy did. That victory over Tarver for Hopkins, and I said this on this board, was overrated.

Hopkins was 43 years old and kept it close.

Explian why didn't want to fight Steve Collins? Roy ducked fighters that were true LH or you can say the money wasn't right but all i know is i remember people and hbo complaining of Roys opponets and Roy didn't want to lose the ABC belts so he made easy defences and got paid millions, so why fight tougher opponets. .

[RayLeonard82]

Since your saying Calzaghe would have dominated 1994 Roy Jones

Then Anthony Hanshaw would have also given 1994 Roy a tough fight because that was a close fight until Roy landed the upercut 11th round and Roy looked slow in that fight also. Roy's speed has not been the same for years. You would have a point had Roy showed his old speed in previous fights but he didn't. His hand speed was 50% of his former self against Tito and Hanshaw and he had plenty of openings.

Also you cant look at age. Certain fighters have a style thats suited for a older age and others dont. My idol Sugar Ray Leonard was a horrible older fighter and so is Roy Jones. Thats because they relied heavy on there speed and quick reflexes.

[Wiley Hyena]

"If your going to say Calzaghe is better then Roy because he beat this Roy than Terry Norris is better then any version of Sugar Ray Leonard. Its the same thing."

No. It's not the same thing at all. First of all Calzaghe is only 3 years younger than Jones. So now you have to consider the issue as to whether or not longevity is an element of true greatness. Surely it is, and Calzaghe wins again. However, if you're disposed to disagree, then one is forced to consider how a prime Calzaghe would have handled a prime Roy. There is absolutely no reason to think that Calzaghe, who in his prime was a lightening fast mongoose of a fighter, could not just as easily have disposed of a prime Roy Jones, Jr. IN the end, "styles make fights." And, Roy simply could not handle Calzaghe's style. NOBODY ever has.

[Vasyl’s dad]

Explian why didn't want to fight Steve Collins? Roy ducked fighters that were true LH or you can say the money wasn't right but all i know is i remember people and hbo complaining of Roys opponets and Roy didn't want to lose the ABC belts so he made easy defences and got paid millions, so why fight tougher opponets. .

I'll explain it, Joe Calzaghe is the only guy responsible for putting fights together.

Its Joes fault that Roys resume has some holes in it as well.

Its Joes fault that a Hop/Roy rematch never happened.

He is that powerful.