Calzaghe Fires Verbal Jabs at Roy Jones and Pavlik

[abadger]

Seriously, do you not realize that any championship-level boxer is going to look great against decidedly mediocre fighters like Andrade, Beyer, et al? It is EXPECTED of them. What really separates the men from the boys is facing truly elite competition. Kessler has done it once, and it looked like he was out of place. Taylor, whether or not you agree with the official scores of the two Hopkins fights or the Winky bout, PROVED that he BELONGED in the ring with those types of guys.

And Taylor is MUCH, MUCH faster than Kess. End of story.

Hmm. So what does him getting stopped by Pavlik prove? That he doesn't? You can't have it both ways. This is just more alarming lack of grey areas thinking. Did Kessler look like he didn't belong in the ring with Calzaghe? Who are these any championship level boxers who go around looking great againt Andrade, Beyer etc. Are there even any, or is it a special class for guys like Kessler and Abraham, clearly elite boxers who are not from the USA?

[Chase8400]

Hmm. So what does him getting stopped by Pavlik prove? That he doesn't? You can't have it both ways. This is just more alarming lack of grey areas thinking. Did Kessler look like he didn't belong in the ring with Calzaghe? Who are these any championship level boxers who go around looking great againt Andrade, Beyer etc. Are there even any, or is it a special class for guys like Kessler and Abraham, clearly elite boxers who are not from the USA?

Elite? NO, they are unproven still. Pavlik IS proven. That's the difference. He is unbeaten when stepping up. Kessler is NOT. Abraham just has his "0" because he has yet to acually step up, only fighting no names, damaged goods, etc...

Nationality has nothing to do with it. Proof is in the pudding. One fighter IS verified and the other two are still wanting to be. That's why AA wants to fight Pavlik now & Kessler is back to fighting nobody's and would love any kind of publicity.

You see who B-hop wanted to fight and there is a reason for that.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Elite? NO, they are unproven still. Pavlik IS proven. That's the difference. He is unbeaten when stepping up. Kessler is NOT. Abraham just has his "0" because he has yet to acually step up, only fighting no names, damaged goods, etc...

Nationality has nothing to do with it. Proof is in the pudding. One fighter IS verified and the other two are still wanting to be. That's why AA wants to fight Pavlik now & Kessler is back to fighting nobody's and would love any kind of publicity.

You see who B-hop wanted to fight and there is a reason for that.

Pavlik fought Jermain Taylor

Kessler fought Calzaghe.

In other words, Kessler went swimming with sharks whilst Pavlik splashed around in his paddling pool.

[Steel Town USA]

Hmm. So what does him getting stopped by Pavlik prove? That he doesn't? You can't have it both ways. This is just more alarming lack of grey areas thinking.

Taylor was WINNING the first fight with Pavlik when he got stopped. And he was very competitive in the return bout as well. So yes, I would say that when factoring in his earlier showings against top fighters in B-Hop and Winky, you have to say he most definitely deserves mention among the elite.

Did Kessler look like he didn't belong in the ring with Calzaghe?

For much of the fight, yes. Anyone who is bothered by Calzaghe's punching power (as Kessler was by that body shot that had him retreating to the ropes in discomfort) is, in my opinion, a little bit of a question mark. The fact that Sartisan clearly hurt him early on in their fight just confirms my uneasiness about him. Look, Kess might go on to reign supreme at 168, but for the moment, I believe there are some valid questions about just how good he really is.

Who are these any championship level boxers who go around looking great againt Andrade, Beyer etc. Are there even any, or is it a special class for guys like Kessler and Abraham, clearly elite boxers who are not from the USA?

Oh, I don't know, but since we're around middleweight, let's go with:

Pavlik
Winky
B-Hop
Abraham
Kessler
JT

Those types of guys are EXPECTED to make the Andrade's, Beyer's, etc. of the world LOOK MEDIOCRE. That's why they're championship-level fighters. But what I'm saying is, the REAL test doesn't come until they're in the ring with another guy who is truly elite. That was my whole point. With Kess and Abraham, they have one such bout combined between them, and it was a fairly lopsided defeat. Hence the question marks.

[Chase8400]

Pavlik fought Jermain Taylor

Kessler fought Calzaghe.

In other words, Kessler went swimming with sharks whilst Pavlik splashed around in his paddling pool.

As funny as that was, you know better.

Taylor beat the man who almost beat Calzaghe.(Hopkins, in case it baffled you) That would put them in about the same class. Until Kelly beat Jermaine, he really had a better record than Joe if you factor in important wins.

Who's next?

[MELLY-MEL...]

Pavlik fought Jermain Taylor

Kessler fought Calzaghe.

In other words, Kessler went swimming with sharks whilst Pavlik splashed around in his paddling pool.

if thats the case than how did joe not beat bhop (who was years younger when taylor fought him) more convincingly than taylor?

[Chase8400]

Any takers on the Klitschko-Peter fight?

Ive got 5k on Vitali.

[IMDAZED]

if thats the case than how did joe not beat bhop (who was years younger when taylor fought him) more convincingly than taylor?

Because Hopkins keeps getting better as he gets older. Look for himt o KO Pavlik next and then move up to cruiser.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

if thats the case than how did joe not beat bhop (who was years younger when taylor fought him) more convincingly than taylor?

Thats down to interpretation. I thought Taylor lost both fights to Hopkins. First one definitely and the second could've gone either way.

There are no doubts in my mind that Calzaghe beat Hopkins.

Looking at both fights, Taylor had better moments than Calzaghe who never really imposed anything damaging on Hopkins like Taylor did.

Calzaghe got flash KDed. But Taylor got hurt by Hopkins and gassed so badly that he made the 40 year old Hopkins look fresh. Whereas Calzaghe was clearly stronger down the stretch.

Also factor in weight, age and the fact that styles make fights and you can throw the triangle theory out the window.

Calzaghe is a level above Taylor. Anyone can see that without having to compare common opponents.

[Boofdatruth]

Elite? NO, they are unproven still. Pavlik IS proven. That's the difference. He is unbeaten when stepping up. Kessler is NOT. Abraham just has his "0" because he has yet to acually step up, only fighting no names, damaged goods, etc...

Nationality has nothing to do with it. Proof is in the pudding. One fighter IS verified and the other two are still wanting to be. That's why AA wants to fight Pavlik now & Kessler is back to fighting nobody's and would love any kind of publicity.

You see who B-hop wanted to fight and there is a reason for that.

How is Kessler not proven when he won a world title. He went into his fight with Cal and undefeated champion and with two belts. How is he not proven?