Why do Calzaghe fans deny, lie and distort information.

[abadger]

To actually think Kessler is good boxer as Cotto is absolutely crazy. Cotto boxing skills is not near Mayweather level but is close. Kessler is no way a the better boxer than Cotto, outrageous stuff

You say that, and are perfectly entitled to disagree with me, but if Cotto is such an incredibly skilled boxer, how come he just lost to one of the slowest, most predictable fighters in elite boxing today. Surely he should have been able to outbox a fighter like this?

[ALT-Assassin]

You say that, and are perfectly entitled to disagree with me, but if Cotto is such an incredibly skilled boxer, how come he just lost to one of the slowest, most predictable fighters in elite boxing today. Surely he should have been able to outbox a fighter like this?

Did you watch Cotto's performance in that fight?It was near flawless and the only thing preventing him from winning was his stamina and Margs incrediable chin.He put together combinations and worked the jab countered,fought off the back foot.He didn't even use his best asset,body punching and still sweeped the first four rounds on clean punching.Any boxer in that divison except maybe Mayweather would of succumed to Margs relentless pressure.

I noticed how you downplay Taylor for loosing to the "inferior" Pavlik but you seem to forget that Marg and Kelly have the will to win no matter what and the power/pressure to make you fold and sometimes that outweighs all the talent in the world.Styles make fights and Marg/Pavik had the style to beat Cotto/Taylor

[IMDAZED]

Badge,

If you can't see the quality Mikkel Kessler has you must be crazy, and I say that not as a Joe fan, but a fan of boxing. Kessler does not have the wins over fighters of big reputation, thats true, but he is young and at SMW the only fighter of that calibre was Calzaghe anyway.

I don't give extra points to fighters for being young.

He beat experienced champions in the division at a very young age, and made a series of solid defences, in fact had he not run out of opponents his resume would actually be close to bettering Calzaghe's in the division, which is hard for me to admit.

The super middleweight division is barren. Everyone knows this. In what other division (aside from heavyweight) would guys like Eric Lucas and Markus Beyer be still relevant? Lucas got beatdown by a disinterested Roy Jones 12 years ago. And Markus Beyer...with all due respect, sucks. he was decent at best in his prime - what would you call him at the time Kessler fought him? To call these guys experienced champions is quite deceptive. Maybe when they were champs. Or a little closer to their primes.

You raise Cotto as an example of what Kessler should aspire to, as though he is far and away the better man, and I don't think this is true at all. Cotto is right now one of the three best boxers at welter, along with Williams and Margarito, whereas Kessler is the best by a mile in SMW, assuming Joe does not come back.

Yeah but who cares who's the best at this and that? that's like arguing who has more belts. Here - DEBATE THIS: Miguel Cotto has 33 fights spanning the biggest names in two divisions. Divisions, I might add, that were arguably the hottest when he fought in them. Margarito, Mosley, Judah, **** you could argue his win over CARLOS QUINTANA is better than any on Kessler's resume! How can we even compare the two? One is/was a pound for pounder while the other is still on the outside in! I was merely pointing out to the poster that a young, hungry, dangerous champ in his prime is more fitting for Miguel, not Mik-kel.

Throw in MW and LHW too and I'd say only Pavlik, Abraham and Dawson are in Kessler's league, and I believe he would start as favourite against any of them. You can argue it either way, and yes, I know Cotto has a better resume, but is he a better boxer than Mikkel Kessler, I don't think so.

I don't like sweeping opinions like this. I go by who they fight and who they beat. What in the world is Mikkel Kessler's league? Siaca? Mundine? Andrade? Are you kidding me? These names are what put you in the league of Miguel Cotto? Holy ****. I'm sorry, call me an old-school boxing head. I don't go by who looks prettiest in the ring. I go by who you beat and Mikkel Kessler is found seriously wanting.

[Flawless.]

Did you watch Cotto's performance in that fight,it was near flawless and the only thing preventing him from winning was his stamina and Margs incrediable chin.He put together combination and worked the jab countered,fought off the back foot.He didn't even use his best asset,body punching and still sweeped the first four rounds on clean punching.Any boxer in that divison except maybe Mayweather would of succumed to Margs relentless pressure.

Cotto boxing against Margarito was a bloody clinic. It was a great site to watch. He may have lost the fight but his performance was brilliant. The Cotto that lost to Margarito would give Mayweather his toughest fight.

[Flawless.]

Badge,


I don't give extra points to fighters for being young.



The super middleweight division is barren. Everyone knows this. In what other division (aside from heavyweight) would guys like Eric Lucas and Markus Beyer be still relevant? Lucas got beatdown by a disinterested Roy Jones 12 years ago. And Markus Beyer...with all due respect, sucks. he was decent at best in his prime - what would you call him at the time Kessler fought him? To call these guys experienced champions is quite deceptive. Maybe when they were champs. Or a little closer to their primes.


Yeah but who cares who's the best at this and that? that's like arguing who has more belts. Here - DEBATE THIS: Miguel Cotto has 33 fights spanning the biggest names in two divisions. Divisions, I might add, that were arguably the hottest when he fought in them. Margarito, Mosley, Judah, **** you could argue his win over CARLOS QUINTANA is better than any on Kessler's resume! How can we even compare the two? One is/was a pound for pounder while the other is still on the outside in! I was merely pointing out to the poster that a young, hungry, dangerous champ in his prime is more fitting for Miguel, not Mik-kel.



I don't like sweeping opinions like this. I go by who they fight and who they beat. What in the world is Mikkel Kessler's league? Siaca? Mundine? Andrade? Are you kidding me? These names are what put you in the league of Miguel Cotto? Holy ****. I'm sorry, call me an old-school boxing head. I don't go by who looks prettiest in the ring. I go by who you beat and Mikkel Kessler is found seriously wanting.

Now that is what you call a rebuttal. Top post

[Mafcherano]

I doubt it. Mayweather would beat him quicker. Cotto got found out!

[abadger]

IMDAZED,

You make lots of very valid points, as usual, most of them to do with resume, so yes I agree with you about that. I think you overestimate the average quality of oppoent on Cotto's resume, and underestimate those on Kessler's, but thats opinion and the bottom line is that I agree with you, Cotto's resume is better.

I would just ask that you remember, I am not seeking to compete with you or lay a line in the sand saying X is better than Y nah nah nah, merely express my opinion. Regarding Mikkel Kessler, I see him as one of the best orthodox boxers I've ever seen, with few flaws, maybe the biggest being that he is so textbook and orthodox. I see Cotto on the other hand as a destructive body puncher when in with opponents that are not Margarito, but with plenty of flaws. His boxing ability is very overrated, he's really not that good on the backfoot, and basically I see him very much more as the brawler, or at least thats when I think he's most effective. For those reasons I rate Kessler as the better talent, but I'm not asking anyone to agree with me.

[IMDAZED]

Cotto has achieved more, based solely on the quality of his opposition, but rating Kessler as the better talent is perfectly acceptable IMO.

Ugh. You can rate Kessler the better talent even though Cotto has beaten better opposition? That's like me arguing with the average architect that I'm better because I'm real good at building with Lego's.

[abadger]

Ugh. You can rate Kessler the better talent even though Cotto has beaten better opposition? That's like me arguing with the average architect that I'm better because I'm real good at building with Lego's.

Surely you are able to distinguish between the skills somebody brings to the ring and the piece of paper that describes their careers?

Naseem hamed was massively more talented than Ricky Hatton but achieved less on paper.

[Dan...]

Ugh. You can rate Kessler the better talent even though Cotto has beaten better opposition? That's like me arguing with the average architect that I'm better because I'm real good at building with Lego's.

Yeah, I agree with this. It is just not good enough to refer to how good Kessler looked against this guy or that guy. He needs to produce the goods against a top level fighter. His biggest wins to date are over Anthony Mundine, Andrade and the horribly overrated Beyer, hardly HOF stuff. Sure he has looked very impressive in several of his victories and has a great deal of talent but until he turns that talent and potential into performance output against a top fighter he cannot be placed in the same class as Miguel Cotto. This is the way I see it.