is Pavlik a good Champion or was it just right place right time

[squealpiggy]

Don't get me wrong, Pavlik as a GOOD champion, but he isn't a GREAT champion. He isn't in the same league as the likes of Hopkins, Monzon, Hagler but he is a league above Taylor, Joppy etc.

[kayjay]

Taylor was indeed ready to give that title away, but Kelly took it in style. I say a little of both.

[deanrw]

good post

dont get me wrong i like watching Pavlik fight & i do think he is a good fighter but i dont think he is in that Elite Level i see Pavlik on the same level as guys like of Eubank ,Benn ,very good fighters but just shy of Elite IMO

i aint saying Taylor is chinny but lets face it if he had a chin like Hopkins ,Toney ,Calzaghe ,Eubank ,he would not have been knocked out by Pavlik & hurt by Winky & Hopkins ,Pavlik put Miranda away granted but Miranda was clearly overated ,Howard Eastman had Miranda going aswell & Eastman aint exactly a puncher

good wins but Taylor & Miranda had bigger reputations than they deserved IMO

Taylor just gets gassed, but he has a pretty good chin. He just tires out and gets vulnerable. Miranda is actually a bit underrated I think, but Pavlik attacked his weakness and made him back up. Miranda is a tough cookie and he will do well against guys who try to fight him on the outside. He clips guys who try to retreat from him. Miranda is another guy that is deceptive. He has probably the longest arms of anyone in the 160-168 class. He is a dangerous guy to try to box as that right hand can reach.

[Dynamite Kid]

Taylor just gets gassed, but he has a pretty good chin. He just tires out and gets vulnerable. Miranda is actually a bit underrated I think, but Pavlik attacked his weakness and made him back up. Miranda is a tough cookie and he will do well against guys who try to fight him on the outside. He clips guys who try to retreat from him. Miranda is another guy that is deceptive. He has probably the longest arms of anyone in the 160-168 class. He is a dangerous guy to try to box as that right hand can reach.

u maybe right about Taylor but i dont see how he can get hurt against Hopkins due to being gassed when niether fighter threw hardly anything over the coarse of 12 rounds ,regardless of that the point im trying to make is Taylor is vulnerable wether it is lack of durability or bad defence or bad stamine the point is he is susceptable to getting hurt especially late in fights & u dont have to be a huge hitter to be able to hurt him

i think Miranda is a nearly man a guy who is gonna give any fighter a stiff test but he aint never gonna achieve much

[deanrw]

u maybe right about Taylor but i dont see how he can get hurt against Hopkins due to being gassed when niether fighter threw hardly anything over the coarse of 12 rounds ,regardless of that the point im trying to make is Taylor is vulnerable wether it is lack of durability or bad defence or bad stamine the point is he is susceptable to getting hurt especially late in fights & u dont have to be a huge hitter to be able to hurt him

i think Miranda is a nearly man a guy who is gonna give any fighter a stiff test but he aint never gonna achieve much

If Taylor can overcome his stamina issues, he could very well be the guy to beat again. Miranda is an enigma who has the potential to beat anyone, but is not tame enough to see his full potential. That could change also. we will know more about both guys in the next year of where they stand.

I think the type that will truly test Pavlik is a Southpaw with good lateral movement. We both know who that fighter is. If Pavlik has an answer to that puzzle, then he has answered all his questions. Pavlik has sloppy foot positioning and has only faced one southpaw that i can think of at the top of my head, he stopped the guy (McKart), but had a hell of a time landing against him. McKart is no Joe Calzaghe either, although he was a crafty good fighter when he was in his prime.

Sent you some green K Terrible. Great arguments. These are the type of posts I like to see.

[Dynamite Kid]

If Taylor can overcome his stamina issues, he could very well be the guy to beat again. Miranda is an enigma who has the potential to beat anyone, but is not tame enough to see his full potential. That could change also. we will know more about both guys in the next year of where they stand.

I think the type that will truly test Pavlik is a Southpaw with good lateral movement. We both know who that fighter is. If Pavlik has an answer to that puzzle, then he has answered all his questions. Pavlik has sloppy foot positioning and has only faced one southpaw that i can think of at the top of my head, he stopped the guy (McKart), but had a hell of a time landing against him. McKart is no Joe Calzaghe either, although he was a crafty good fighter when he was in his prime.

Sent you some green K Terrible. Great arguments. These are the type of posts I like to see.

thanks for green k ill send some back your way dude

TBH i dont think Taylor can overcome his stamina problems it might be that he is always gonna have stamina trouble like Oscar i mean from what i hear he was in tremendous shape against Pavlik in the second fight & he secluded himself away from his freinds and family to train which i dont think he has ever done before whilst in traning camp his family yes but i dont think he has ever not been in contact with his freinds during training camp but for all this Taylor still tired against Pavlik towards the end of the fight ,obviously i dont know its just what i heard

yeah i agree i saw the McKart fight and Pavlik did get caught a helluva a lot in that fight

[deanrw]

thanks for green k ill send some back your way dude

TBH i dont think Taylor can overcome his stamina problems it might be that he is always gonna have stamina trouble like Oscar i mean from what i hear he was in tremendous shape against Pavlik in the second fight & he secluded himself away from his freinds and family to train which i dont think he has ever done before whilst in traning camp his family yes but i dont think he has ever not been in contact with his freinds during training camp but for all this Taylor still tired against Pavlik towards the end of the fight ,obviously i dont know its just what i heard

yeah i agree i saw the McKart fight and Pavlik did get caught a helluva a lot in that fight

For Taylor, I think he rose to the top too quickly, then allowed too much pressure on himself. He gets too keyed up during his fights and is too emotional in the ring. If his trainer can capture what he was when he was up and coming, he may find that relaxation he once had in the ring come back. Everyone put so much pressure on him to perform and took potshots at the guy left and right. Maybe the two Pavlik fights will help him. He still has a lot to offer if he can find what took him to the top. I won't write him off yet, he may come back and falter, or he may surprise us all. He seems like a great guy and I wish him all the luck.

[Degsy]

I think Kelly needs a little more time at MW, but the signs are there, he certainly has the heart of a champ and he hasn't ducked anyone. I do get a bit pissed off when people rate his ko power to the point you'd think he was Tyson or Shavers, but you got to give the boy some credit for getting to where he is

[Dynamite Kid]

For Taylor, I think he rose to the top too quickly, then allowed too much pressure on himself. He gets too keyed up during his fights and is too emotional in the ring. If his trainer can capture what he was when he was up and coming, he may find that relaxation he once had in the ring come back. Everyone put so much pressure on him to perform and took potshots at the guy left and right. Maybe the two Pavlik fights will help him. He still has a lot to offer if he can find what took him to the top. I won't write him off yet, he may come back and falter, or he may surprise us all. He seems like a great guy and I wish him all the luck.

u might be right personally i have my reservations dont get me wrong i like Taylor he is a skilled fighter ,Taylor reminds me of Eubank TBH because both like to control the pace of a fight both can look dominent when they claim the centre of the ring and both do not like working at someones elses pace ,if u give Taylor the centre of the ring where he can utilise his jab he is one helluve good fighter but u back him up & make him work for 3 mintues of every round he will start to fade same as Eubank did against Calzaghe ,Watson etc

Taylor can reclaim his best form again IMO but he has to tighten up defensively and find an effective way to enhance his stamina

[KESSLER]

Pavlik is a great champion, exciting fighter.. He'll destroy his next 2 opponents, Lockett and Rubio .. I can't wait to see him in there with the big names again, such as Miranda and Taylor.