Mayweather-Hatton Conference Thread

[sonofisis]

Empirical? Facts? Again Isis, you overstep your bounds. What you used as examples are opinions based on current hypothesis(other than the DNA results which are questionable at best) Every example is laced with opinionated assumptions based on dogmatic principles.

I can quote assertions by every sadistic Scholar in existence, but that doesn't make them facts!


The fact is, the jury is still out as to the so called whereabouts of "Cradle of civilization".

How are cranial and skeletal measurements/comparisons equivalent to a "hypothesis", you dumb fool? Also, since when has DNA data become questionable? LOL! You're not very scientifically literate, are you?

[MightyMikeA]

Well I have provided empirical studies indicating the the earliest Egyptians had tropical adaptations and modal patterns consistent with Nubians and Somalis, so what other interpretation can I logically put fourth? Are you suggesting that these are not "Egyptian looking" people? Are you denying their ancestry in Egypt? What is your basis for such bias?

Brace also found that the ancient Egyptians clustered (cranio-facially) closest to Somalis, while differing significantly from modern populations. Why should this be ignored in favor of your rhetoric?



I'm merely speaking from the studies and citations presented, which you have skillfully avoided addressi


Stop misquoting Aristotle.. "Melas" in ancient Greek literally means "black", hence the word melanin. It is standard medical terminology, derived from this word and what it meant.

Aristotle had this to say about their physical appearance in relation to Ethiopians:

Too black a hue marks the coward as witness Egyptians and Ethiopians and so does also too white a complexion as you may see from women, the complexion of courage is between the two. - Aristotle, Physiognomics, Vol. VI

You say: (dark skinned), but not totally dark

Aristotle says: "Too Black"

Your foolish semantics only hurt your credibility my friend..

He then goes on to say in another book:

Why are the Ethiopians and Egyptians bandy-legged? Is it because the bodies of living creatures become distorted by heat, like logs of wood when they become dry? The condition of their hair supports this theory; for it is curlier than that of other nations, and curliness is as it were crookedness of the hair. - Physiognomics, Book XIV, p. 317

Herodotus says:
Several Egyptians told me that in their opinion the Colchians were descended from soldiers of Sesostris. I had conjectured as much myself from two pointers, firstly because they have black skins and wooly hair and secondly, and more reliably for the reason that alone among mankind the Egyptians and the Ethiopians have practiced circumcision since time immemorial. - Herodotus, Book II, 104

Ammianus Marcellinus simply states:

the men of Egypt are mostly brown and black with a skinny and desiccated look. - Ammianus Marcellinus, Book XXII

Diodorus Siculus writes:

They (the Ethiopians) say also that the Egyptians are colonists sent out by the Ethiopians, Osiris ["King of Kings and God of Gods] having been the leader of the colony . . . they add that the Egyptians have received from them, as from authors and their ancestors, the greater part of their laws."

Al-Jahiz, centuries later in around the 9th century, had this to say:

The Copts natives of Egypt are also a black race. Abraham wished to have a child by one of their race and thus Ishmael the ancestor of the Arabs was born. The Prophet Mohammet also had a child by Mary the Copt. If a black skin is thought unsightly what then must be said of the French, the Greeks, and the Slavs with their thin, red, straight hair and beard? The paleness of their eyelids and their lips appear to us, Negroes, very ugly...God did not make us black in order that we should be ugly; our color comes from the sun. The proof of this is that among the Arabs are also black tribes as the Beni Solaim ibn Mansour - Al-Jahiz, Risalat mufakharat al-sudan 'ala al-bidan


Now stop lying!

Ok then. I too, can fervently dig through the depths of good ol' wikipedia and pick and choose "evidence" as a rebuttal to your arguments. You see, my friend, as Easton stated earlier, anyone can misconstrue scholarly HYPOTHESES to distort and lend credence to their own agenda.

For example. If you're going to quote from wikipedia next time, please include ALL of the direct evidence (because that is what we are dealing with here, aren't we?) and include our old friends;

Strabo (c. 64 BC – AD 24):

As for the people of India, those in the south are like the Aethiopians in colour, although they are like the rest in respect to countenance and hair (for on account of the humidity of the air their hair does not curl), whereas those in the north are like the Aegyptians.[30]
Arrian (c. 86 - 146 AD) (Indica 6.9):

The appearance of the inhabitants is also not very different in India and Ethiopia: the southern Indians are rather more like Ethiopians as they are black to look on, and their hair is black; only they are not so snub-nosed or woolly-haired as the Ethiopians; the northern Indians are most like the Egyptians physically.[31]
The above writings of Strabo and Arrian were drawn from the earlier accounts of Nearchus (c. 360 - 300 BC), Megasthenes (c. 350 - 290 BC) and Eratosthenes (276 - 195 BC).[32]

It is important to note however, that phenotypes differ among populations and skin color varies and is highly adaptive, therefore alone, they're not good indicators of any concept of 'race'.[33] In some cases, ancient textual sources can be extremely reliable, however, in cases like these bioanthropologist Shomarka Keita warns us that interpretation is highly dependent on stereotyped thinking, and in his words, "the ancient writers were not doing population biology", and given that as a result, all of this should be taken with 'a grain of salt'.

And there you have it. As with your (sketchy) DNA evidence, most of your "findings" are hypothetical in outlook and in context as Easton said so earlier.

[Easton Assassin]

Ok then. I too, can fervently dig through the depths of good ol' wikipedia and pick and choose "evidence" as a rebuttal to your arguments. You see, my friend, as Easton stated earlier, anyone can misconstrue scholarly HYPOTHESES to distort and lend credence to their own agenda.

For example. If you're going to quote from wikipedia next time, please include ALL of the direct evidence (because that is what we are dealing with here, aren't we?) and include our old friends;

Strabo (c. 64 BC – AD 24):

As for the people of India, those in the south are like the Aethiopians in colour, although they are like the rest in respect to countenance and hair (for on account of the humidity of the air their hair does not curl), whereas those in the north are like the Aegyptians.[30]
Arrian (c. 86 - 146 AD) (Indica 6.9):

The appearance of the inhabitants is also not very different in India and Ethiopia: the southern Indians are rather more like Ethiopians as they are black to look on, and their hair is black; only they are not so snub-nosed or woolly-haired as the Ethiopians; the northern Indians are most like the Egyptians physically.[31]
The above writings of Strabo and Arrian were drawn from the earlier accounts of Nearchus (c. 360 - 300 BC), Megasthenes (c. 350 - 290 BC) and Eratosthenes (276 - 195 BC).[32]

It is important to note however, that phenotypes differ among populations and skin color varies and is highly adaptive, therefore alone, they're not good indicators of any concept of 'race'.[33] In some cases, ancient textual sources can be extremely reliable, however, in cases like these bioanthropologist Shomarka Keita warns us that interpretation is highly dependent on stereotyped thinking, and in his words, "the ancient writers were not doing population biology", and given that as a result, all of this should be taken with 'a grain of salt'.

And there you have it. As with your (sketchy) DNA evidence, most of your "findings" are hypothetical in outlook and in context as Easton said so earlier.

Thank you for doing the legwork i was too lazy to do. You are right of course.

I understand Isis's need to be correct. I also understand that he believes what he reads as if it were written in stone.

I for one, do not pretend to understand the depths of our ancient past, but i will say this.

If the truth is ever discovered, we will all most likely be surprised at the outcome as i believe civilization is much older and grander than todays rigid construct would have us believe.

[MightyMikeA]

No problem. Every human group and culture that has ever existed on this earth has added to our collective knowledge as a whole but nothing is as it seems and to say that "ebony" people had no contribution at all to Ancient Egypt is just ignorant and nobody is debating this.

It's just that when one group tries to entirely usurp and hijack the history of another in the hopes of increasing it's own value then that just impedes our progress altogether. Ya dig, Isis? :-P

[Easton Assassin]

How are cranial and skeletal measurements/comparisons equivalent to a "hypothesis", you dumb fool? Also, since when has DNA data become questionable? LOL! You're not very scientifically literate, are you?

I don't fancy myself literate at all. Of course I am comparing myself to the truly literate. You know, Guys like Einstein,Keppler,Hawkings,Bohr and the like. But I'm sure your right on their level ISIS!

I could be wrong but haven't DNA procedures been questionable from the start?

Interpretation plays a role in the procedure and therefore makes the whole process open to debate!

I could also be wrong, but aren't the archetypal references that these measurements of craniums are based on subject to Hypothesis as well?

Therefore couldn't one infer that the data by which the whole procedure is based on be flawed?

Holes all in your **** Isis!

[WLAD OWNS]

How can anyone like Floyd Mayweather ?

I just finished watching the press conference on youtube with Floyd making an absolute fool of himself saying his usual bull**** like how he is gonna go toe to toe and that Hatton is a bum. Hatton played it out like the civilized, cool customer that he is and he is not in the least bit intimidated by Floyd Gayweather. Floyd is an absolute disgrace to black people, he represents every negative stereotype about black people and I can't see how any of you clowns on this board could nuthug him. Even his own family hates him. FLOYD IS OFFICIALLY THE BIGGEST TOOL ON THE PLANET.

[Fox McCloud]

Because all we care about are black fighters. We hate all white fighters, which is why we all hate Wladimir Klitschko, and why we have such contempt for Ricky Hatton.

Seriously.

I think there are quite a few threads of the same topic, why did you make a new one?

[Amir K Shareef]

I just finished watching the press conference on youtube with Floyd making an absolute fool of himself saying his usual bull**** like how he is gonna go toe to toe and that Hatton is a bum. Hatton played it out like the civilized, cool customer that he is and he is not in the least bit intimidated by Floyd Gayweather. Floyd is an absolute disgrace to black people, he represents every negative stereotype about black people and I can't see how any of you clowns on this board could nuthug him. Even his own family hates him. FLOYD IS OFFICIALLY THE BIGGEST TOOL ON THE PLANET.

he not a disgrace to black people.. he talk ****.. and beats ppl asses.... you mad because u wish you could be like him..

[Super Cartel]

Im a grown ass man and that behaviour to me spells out
his an arsehole

I dont know about u guys in the states
but where im from saying your suit cost's 3 grand etc..
and all that talk bull**** dont make you know friends..

We could'nt giv a **** how much your worth floyd or none of that
material bull**** means nothing m8 its all about if your heart is pure and clean
Bling,cars means **** all to us...

Because all we care about are black fighters. We hate all white fighters, which is why we all hate Wladimir Klitschko, and why we have such contempt for Ricky Hatton.

Bra do you think he gives to ****s about you? lol
we care for our black fighters what a joke man
go ask that ****a for a loan when you see your man
he'd laugh in your face..

I respect being a fan but that racist **** gets you no where

Year 2k dude not 1970's no more get over it

[WLAD OWNS]

he not a disgrace to black people.. he talk ****.. and beats ppl asses.... you mad because u wish you could be like him..

You think I would wanna be like that classless tool. It I wanted to be like a fighter I would choose WLAD or HATTON because not only do they kick everyone's ass, they carry themselves with dignity,class and intelligence. Not to mention, they are both exciting fighters. FLOYD is hands down the most boring fighter/runner in boxing and he also has the least amount of fans, except for the douchebag nuthuggers that support him.