Top three statistical misrepresentations about Hopkins that irk me...

[Guest]

Hopkins was a very good maybe borderline great (a top 11 or 12 middleweight I think) but the 19-20 title defenses is especially misleading. We should only count the title defenses he made as the undisputed champion, and not who he was forced to defend against by these BS alphabet title rankings when he wasn't the unified champion. This cheapens the accomplishments and pads his apparent standing in the pantheon of middleweight greats.

Yep, and like I said, factor in the quality of opposition and how any of the other Middleweight greats would have fared under the same circumstances.

[eazy_mas]

Hopkins was a very good maybe borderline great (a top 11 or 12 middleweight I think) but the 19-20 title defenses is especially misleading. We should only count the title defenses he made as the undisputed champion, and not who he was forced to defend against by these BS alphabet title rankings when he wasn't the unified champion. This cheapens the accomplishments and pads his apparent standing in the pantheon of middleweight greats.

which belt do you consider to be undisputed champ?

[Kid Achilles]

None of them. The term undisputed implies that the fighter is recognized as THE champion of his division and holds all of the most respected belts. When Ring magazine accepts him as THE champion, I usually concede it at that point.

[Left2body]

which belt do you consider to be undisputed champ?

Oh, this question is tooo easy. Its the NABF

[Hydro]

2. The "career defining" KO of The Acting Amigo. The guy was WAY outside his weight class, so much so that virtually NO ONE gave him a chance of winning. The size difference between the two was a joke, with Oscar having no power to speak of at the weight and having already been largely exposed as a middleweight in his previous bout.

Hopkins's career defining wins are his wins over Trinidad (who badly beat up the 2nd best MW in the world in Joppy before that) and Tarver. I don't rank the win over DLH that high.

But it was sort of justice to see DLH getting beat up by bigger guys, when he fought so many guys moving up in weight, and was very big for the weight classes he was in.

[Hydro]

3. "Bernard beat a light heavyweight, even Sugar Ray Robinson didn't do that." SRR fought a light heavy over the fifteen round distance (not twelve) in heat estimated at 104 degrees. He had to retire from exhaustation, despite being ahead on points. In contrast, while I DID admire the performance, Bernard beat a weight-drained, overrated light heavy who forgot to pack his balls. In a decent temperature. So what's the point of mentioning the stat when it's comparatively meaningless? It's like talking about how boxers today are better than the boxers of old because there are more "multi weight champs". Except in the old days there weren't anywhere near as many divisions, or as many belts.

That whole thing is blown out of proportion anyway. Robinson (who started at lightweight) couldn't win the LHW title, but several middleweight champs have won LHW titles. Robinson just wasn't quite able to.

[GEOFFHAYES]

Calzaghe has to be a cert for the HOF if he beats a Taylor or a Hopkins at MSG.

Sorry but that's just my honest opinion.

[Hydro]

Calzaghe has to be a cert for the HOF if he beats a Taylor or a Hopkins at MSG.

Sorry but that's just my honest opinion.

He's already a certain HOFer.

Look at the standards of the HOF.

Donald Curry and Esteban Dejesus's inductions are long overdue. They ought to get in there.

[Guest]

Hopkins would have been considered an all-time great if he wasn't robbed against Taylor. Without that marquee victory over a true middleweight contender (and the future of the division), Hopkins really doesn't have any major victories. His wins over Trinidad and DLH aren't that great considering they were way above their best weights. The Trinidad win might have meant something if Winky Wright didn't completely humiliate him...

[Kid Achilles]

Robinson wasn't going after "a lightheavyweight title" though, he was going after THE title. There's a big difference. The difference is as big as the one of RJJ fighting Ruiz as opposed to Lewis. One was clearly the champion and the other just had a belt. To me a belt holder is nothing more than one of the highest ranking contenders in his division. You can't be half a champion, you're either THE champion or just a top contender trying to gain THE championship title as a goal.