Ten Most Important Fighters

[Willie Pep 229]

I've done a thread similar to this. Here is my list.

https://www.boxingscene.com/forums/showthread.php?t=783842

10. Lennox Lewis-The first British heavyweight to hold the title and be known as a champion by the world and not just the Brits (see Frank Bruno).

9. Tommy Burns-Had the distinction of being the man to give up the heavyweight championship to the first black heavyweight champion in history and change the sport forever.

8. Max Schmeling-While nothing he did as champion stands out, his win and loss to Louis helped set and destroy a symbol of **** power.

7. Rocky Marciano-retired undefeated and was the last white American to be the undisputed champ. His name is synonymous with the heavyweight title.

6. John L. Sullivan-The first gloved champion and a certified star of his era. Everyone knew who the Boston string boy was.

5. Joe Louis-His win over Schmeling was a crushing defeat to **** propaganda and his patriotic devotion made him loved by blacks and whites alike during a turbulent time in the countries history.

4. Mike Tyson-His star burned so bright everybody in the world knew his name and stopped to watch him fight. They also stopped to watch his tragedies and turbulent life as if it were a car wreck.

3. Jack Johnson-The first black heavyweight champion and its most despised during his reign. So hated that white America actively pursued a "white hope" to wipe the golden smile of his face.

2. Muhammad Ali-Never had a fighter gone from being so disliked to so beloved. His stance on Vietnam brought a surreal amount of disdain for Ali. But his first loss to Frazier proved his conviction and courage so much the masses got behind him. He went from one end of the spectrum to the other and did it with flair not seen before or since.

1. Jack Dempsey-No fighter was ever so revered in their era. Never did so many people flock to see one man fight. So popular was Dempsey that his name alone conjures up images of the roaring twenties.

Funny, 8 out of 10 we agreed on, albeit on a few, for different reasons.

On our differences:

RE Schmeling: I must concede that The Second World War was kinda important, LOL, so certainly those fights changed the world by creating, challenging, and destroying 'held beliefs,' important held beliefs. But I think WWII was gonna happen anyway, even if the fights didn't occur.

Of course I am not sure what you OP criteria originally was, you only stated that it was 'similar' -- anyway, I don't see Max as a (fight game) game changer.

RE Burns: Interesting point and it has clout. Burns no doubt gets big points for taking the 'mixed match' despite a intensely racial world, and it should have been a game changer, but I feel Jack Johnson blew the opportunity (I argue this in a post above) and sent the game, in regards to Black fighters, tumbling backwards. Johnson's championship, when it was done, looked to be only an anomaly; it looked like the white supremacists had won; Burns' sacrifice was for naught and the entire issue still had to be confronted!

[DeeMoney]

Like it or not, I think in 10 years we will have to put Floyd on, or near, a list like this. Maybe I am giving him too much credit for what modern pro boxing business has become. But essentially the best protects themselves and their record at all costs.

FWIW I know that Floyd was a tremendous fighter, the best of his generation, and I give him credit more than a lot do. But he established a precedence that many will try to emulate, and the way for most fighters to try to match it is to play it safe when it comes to matchmaking.

[Willie Pep 229]

Like it or not, I think in 10 years we will have to put Floyd on, or near, a list like this. Maybe I am giving him too much credit for what modern pro boxing business has become. But essentially the best protects themselves and their record at all costs.

FWIW I know that Floyd was a tremendous fighter, the best of his generation, and I give him credit more than a lot do. But he established a precedence that many will try to emulate, and the way for most fighters to try to match it is to play it safe when it comes to matchmaking.

As in you market solely the fighter, not the fight. The opponent is always just the opponent and the fans come to see the fighter, not the fight.

That can take the fight game the way of the WWE.

PVV 'barn storming' -- no big fights, just showcase fight after showcase fight.

There are enough sanctioning belts out there that it could be become an industry.

Ali and Louis' 'bum of the month' run ascended to that level unwittingly, but ultimately they fought the big fights.

Money wise 'Money' certainly changed the game. You look at his 2015 purse for Pacquiao, which I believe was close to 300 million (I find that hard to believe, but anyway) if you match that against Douglas' 24 million (for Holyfield) in 1991 it only inflates to 41 million in 2015 dollars.

Floyd Mayweather's purses are a game changer.

Digression: Have you ever checked out the 'lineal' history of the WBA Super HW Champions?

It is as if there is some separate marketing event going on that never leaves Russia (Belarus) and they trade the belt back and forth between local Russians.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Like it or not, I think in 10 years we will have to put Floyd on, or near, a list like this. Maybe I am giving him too much credit for what modern pro boxing business has become. But essentially the best protects themselves and their record at all costs.

FWIW I know that Floyd was a tremendous fighter, the best of his generation, and I give him credit more than a lot do. But he established a precedence that many will try to emulate, and the way for most fighters to try to match it is to play it safe when it comes to matchmaking.

I think he's up there.


I wouldn't say he invented the protected career. That trend had been a growing one in Boxing, and clearly was encouraged by all parties involved: HBO, Promoters, Venues, Trainers, etc. (LEAST of all the fighters). But he made himself richer than Messi and Ronaldo doing it, and not even being a Heavyweight.

Tyson and Ali are culturally iconic, but not anywhere as good as Mayweather. So, you can even spin it that he made Boxing about Boxing again.

[QueensburyRules]

Like it or not, I think in 10 years we will have to put Floyd on, or near, a list like this. Maybe I am giving him too much credit for what modern pro boxing business has become. But essentially the best protects themselves and their record at all costs.

FWIW I know that Floyd was a tremendous fighter, the best of his generation, and I give him credit more than a lot do. But he established a precedence that many will try to emulate, and the way for most fighters to try to match it is to play it safe when it comes to matchmaking.

- -Manny exposed himself to more Ring p4pers in history and set all their records.

Most are HOFers.

No protection by his record, and as such he becomes the model for every foreign fighter to aspire to in the US.

[Marchegiano]

I am not arguing anything, it is a fine list with fine explanations. I guess I mean this as additional, or non-competitive. I just feel like there are some figures in boxing who deserve a shoutout for their importance to the sport and don't necisarrly feel strongly about ranking any of the names from your list or my own or together.

That said, these are the names I feel should be honored along with the names Willie posted

Daniel Thew *** Mendoza pioneered hit and don't be hit back boxing in the 1780s. Yes, pre-gloved boxing, but, if you follow his line of influence it does lead directly to Corbett and his defensive "genius" of the time. Corbett without a doubt popularized D in gloved boxing. So, I mean, take your pick of those men. Whether Daniel, James, or an inbetweener like Molyneaux Hewlett, one of the men who pioneered defense ought to be recognized given most boxers fight defense first these days and hit and don't be hit back boxing has been labeled simply boxing by most fans... hit and don't hit back is the point of the sport now to most people. Daniel started it, Corbett made it popular, now everyone does it, somewhere in there someone deserves respect and acknowledgement.

After that, Kid McCoy for the corkscrew punch.

Tommy Ryan for the crouch.

Nonpareil Dempsey is the first p4p champion ever. His abilities inspired the title.

Richard Dover...possibly the most important figure in boxing's history today.

Dover get his own paragraph too. So, y'all know how boxing was made illegal as the ancient era became the medieval. You know boxing came back during an era in history when is was super cool for rich men to dig up ancient **** in greece and italy and model their philosophies, entertainments, governments, art, you name it, off ancient ideas. Okay, the man responsible for the revival of boxing in that period, the man who thought it was super cool to dig up records of ancient contests and have people in his time try to recreate those contests is Richard Dover in the 1600s. He isn't the first boxer or pugilist, but he is the backer who revived many of the Olympic games including boxing. Duelists would take interest and by the start of the 1700 English Bare Knuckle is a sport.

The only other figure who could be considered more important is maybe Onomastos because Onomastos wrote the first rules and is the man Dover was mimicking as far as rule....but Ono did not create the Olympic itself and Dover was also very interested in the political aspect of sports. A first creator of boxing is not named, a people are, Sparta is said to have created boxing. So I guess one could give honor to Sparta as a whole. But, I think boxing had run its course without Dover's revival. I do not believe it was just a matter of time. I believe boxing could very well have gone the way of ancient religion. No one prays to Apollo anymore, we know all about him, but hardly anyone is interested in reviving that religion, I very much feel like without Dover boxing would be more like that. Known, but not truely revived.

Jim Jeffries is your first belt gatherer. Sullivan failed to and drew the English champ. Jeffries toppled the Anglo, the Colored, the pretense, the former, and the current on his rise up. Corbett caused the pretense, and Fitzs failed to settle it. Jeffries unified the lineal claims.


That's it from me. I think Marciano's only 0 is important, but that's probably more a personal thing. These are my six I reckon all fans should honor.

[Willie Pep 229]

I am not arguing anything, it is a fine list with fine explanations. I guess I mean this as additional, or non-competitive. I just feel like there are some figures in boxing who deserve a shoutout for their importance to the sport and don't necisarrly feel strongly about ranking any of the names from your list or my own or together.

That said, these are the names I feel should be honored along with the names Willie posted

Daniel Thew *** Mendoza pioneered hit and don't be hit back boxing in the 1780s. Yes, pre-gloved boxing, but, if you follow his line of influence it does lead directly to Corbett and his defensive "genius" of the time. Corbett without a doubt popularized D in gloved boxing. So, I mean, take your pick of those men. Whether Daniel, James, or an inbetweener like Molyneaux Hewlett, one of the men who pioneered defense ought to be recognized given most boxers fight defense first these days and hit and don't be hit back boxing has been labeled simply boxing by most fans... hit and don't hit back is the point of the sport now to most people. Daniel started it, Corbett made it popular, now everyone does it, somewhere in there someone deserves respect and acknowledgement.

After that, Kid McCoy for the corkscrew punch.

Tommy Ryan for the crouch.

Nonpareil Dempsey is the first p4p champion ever. His abilities inspired the title.

Richard Dover...possibly the most important figure in boxing's history today.

Dover get his own paragraph too. So, y'all know how boxing was made illegal as the ancient era became the medieval. You know boxing came back during an era in history when is was super cool for rich men to dig up ancient **** in greece and italy and model their philosophies, entertainments, governments, art, you name it, off ancient ideas. Okay, the man responsible for the revival of boxing in that period, the man who thought it was super cool to dig up records of ancient contests and have people in his time try to recreate those contests is Richard Dover in the 1600s. He isn't the first boxer or pugilist, but he is the backer who revived many of the Olympic games including boxing. Duelists would take interest and by the start of the 1700 English Bare Knuckle is a sport.

The only other figure who could be considered more important is maybe Onomastos because Onomastos wrote the first rules and is the man Dover was mimicking as far as rule....but Ono did not create the Olympic itself and Dover was also very interested in the political aspect of sports. A first creator of boxing is not named, a people are, Sparta is said to have created boxing. So I guess one could give honor to Sparta as a whole. But, I think boxing had run its course without Dover's revival. I do not believe it was just a matter of time. I believe boxing could very well have gone the way of ancient religion. No one prays to Apollo anymore, we know all about him, but hardly anyone is interested in reviving that religion, I very much feel like without Dover boxing would be more like that. Known, but not truely revived.

Jim Jeffries is your first belt gatherer. Sullivan failed to and drew the English champ. Jeffries toppled the Anglo, the Colored, the pretense, the former, and the current on his rise up. Corbett caused the pretense, and Fitzs failed to settle it. Jeffries unified the lineal claims.


That's it from me. I think Marciano's only 0 is important, but that's probably more a personal thing. These are my six I reckon all fans should honor.

Good post; nice education for me.

[GhostofDempsey]

In no particular order:

John L. Sullivan: America's first big sports celebrity. At a time when legend was often the bigger story than the truth, he cast a huge shadow across the nation.

Jack Dempsey: First international superstar of boxing, launched it's popularity and paved the way for modern boxing as we know it. Biggest gates and purses of his era. Was the biggest sports star of his era, even eclipsing Babe Ruth in popularity.

Jack Johnson: First black HW in an era that was extremely dangerous and hostile to be one.

Ali: Resurrected boxing's popularity during a time when fans started tuning out and small clubs were dying off due to televised fights. Love him or hate him he was a polarizing figure.

Joe Louis: Americans had a hero to rally behind during the rise and fall of the **** regime. Recognized by President Roosevelt as a national hero to all.

Mike Tyson: another polarizing figure who was larger than life and got fans to notice boxing again after the lull in fan interest during the Holmes reign as champion. He picked up where Ali left off, and brought an entire audience of casual fans into the sport, for better or worse. Tyson quickly became a household name and generated a lot of revenue.

Rocky Marciano: Carried the HW division on his back during the 1950's. Fans love knockouts and he provided many, often the smaller fighter in the ring. He demonstrated heart, grit, and determination. Like it or hate it, his undefeated record became a measuring stick for generations to follow.

Ray Robinson: considered to be one of the P4P greatest boxers of all time, it was sportswriters who coined that term and title based upon the career and fighting prowess of Robinson. He would be the original "Sugar" with a smooth style both in and out of the ring that would later inspire Ray Leonard, De La Hoya, Mosley, Roy Jones and others. He is the fighter who all others are measured against when the topic of greatness comes up.

Oscar De La Hoya: An Olympic sensation who was an instant success when he turned pro. Charming and charismatic, he handled the spotlight brilliantly. He attracted and introduced an entire new fan-base to modern boxing--women! He was a mainstream celebrity which brought a lot of positive outside media attention to boxing.

Kim Duk-Koo: Many of you remember him as the Korean fighter who was killed in the ring versus Mancini in 1982. I watched that fight on live television. It was the loss of his life which paved the way for many changes in boxing that put an emphasis on the safety of boxers. After the fight, they introduced standing 8-counts, urged referees to stop fights before a boxer took too much punishment, and championship fights went from 15 down to 12 rounds. New pre-fight medical procedures would soon follow to ensure fighters were entering the ring without any pre-existing brain injuries.

Those are ten that I can think of for now. I read an article once that credited Chuck Wepner as one of the most important figures in boxing, since the Rocky films were inspired from his back story after his fight with Ali. Thought that was an interesting perspective.

[Willie Pep 229]

In no particular order:

John L. Sullivan: America's first big sports celebrity. At a time when legend was often the bigger story than the truth, he cast a huge shadow across the nation.

Jack Dempsey: First international superstar of boxing, launched it's popularity and paved the way for modern boxing as we know it. Biggest gates and purses of his era. Was the biggest sports star of his era, even eclipsing Babe Ruth in popularity.

Jack Johnson: First black HW in an era that was extremely dangerous and hostile to be one.

Ali: Resurrected boxing's popularity during a time when fans started tuning out and small clubs were dying off due to televised fights. Love him or hate him he was a polarizing figure.

Joe Louis: Americans had a hero to rally behind during the rise and fall of the **** regime. Recognized by President Roosevelt as a national hero to all.

Mike Tyson: another polarizing figure who was larger than life and got fans to notice boxing again after the lull in fan interest during the Holmes reign as champion. He picked up where Ali left off, and brought an entire audience of casual fans into the sport, for better or worse. Tyson quickly became a household name and generated a lot of revenue.

Rocky Marciano: Carried the HW division on his back during the 1950's. Fans love knockouts and he provided many, often the smaller fighter in the ring. He demonstrated heart, grit, and determination. Like it or hate it, his undefeated record became a measuring stick for generations to follow.

Ray Robinson: considered to be one of the P4P greatest boxers of all time, it was sportswriters who coined that term and title based upon the career and fighting prowess of Robinson. He would be the original "Sugar" with a smooth style both in and out of the ring that would later inspire Ray Leonard, De La Hoya, Mosley, Roy Jones and others. He is the fighter who all others are measured against when the topic of greatness comes up.

Oscar De La Hoya: An Olympic sensation who was an instant success when he turned pro. Charming and charismatic, he handled the spotlight brilliantly. He attracted and introduced an entire new fan-base to modern boxing--women! He was a mainstream celebrity which brought a lot of positive outside media attention to boxing.

Kim Duk-Koo: Many of you remember him as the Korean fighter who was killed in the ring versus Mancini in 1982. I watched that fight on live television. It was the loss of his life which paved the way for many changes in boxing that put an emphasis on the safety of boxers. After the fight, they introduced standing 8-counts, urged referees to stop fights before a boxer took too much punishment, and championship fights went from 15 down to 12 rounds. New pre-fight medical procedures would soon follow to ensure fighters were entering the ring without any pre-existing brain injuries.

Those are ten that I can think of for now. I read an article once that credited Chuck Wepner as one of the most important figures in boxing, since the Rocky films were inspired from his back story after his fight with Ali. Thought that was an interesting perspective.

Thank you for posting. Interesting take, especially on Kim Duk Koo.

That's funny, Chuck Wepner. The only way that holds up is if the Rocky films can be shown to have appreciably increased interest in the fight game. I suspect those movies created more WWE fans than boxing fans.

[Anthony342]

In no particular order:

John L. Sullivan: America's first big sports celebrity. At a time when legend was often the bigger story than the truth, he cast a huge shadow across the nation.

Jack Dempsey: First international superstar of boxing, launched it's popularity and paved the way for modern boxing as we know it. Biggest gates and purses of his era. Was the biggest sports star of his era, even eclipsing Babe Ruth in popularity.

Jack Johnson: First black HW in an era that was extremely dangerous and hostile to be one.

Ali: Resurrected boxing's popularity during a time when fans started tuning out and small clubs were dying off due to televised fights. Love him or hate him he was a polarizing figure.

Joe Louis: Americans had a hero to rally behind during the rise and fall of the **** regime. Recognized by President Roosevelt as a national hero to all.

Mike Tyson: another polarizing figure who was larger than life and got fans to notice boxing again after the lull in fan interest during the Holmes reign as champion. He picked up where Ali left off, and brought an entire audience of casual fans into the sport, for better or worse. Tyson quickly became a household name and generated a lot of revenue.

Rocky Marciano: Carried the HW division on his back during the 1950's. Fans love knockouts and he provided many, often the smaller fighter in the ring. He demonstrated heart, grit, and determination. Like it or hate it, his undefeated record became a measuring stick for generations to follow.

Ray Robinson: considered to be one of the P4P greatest boxers of all time, it was sportswriters who coined that term and title based upon the career and fighting prowess of Robinson. He would be the original "Sugar" with a smooth style both in and out of the ring that would later inspire Ray Leonard, De La Hoya, Mosley, Roy Jones and others. He is the fighter who all others are measured against when the topic of greatness comes up.

Oscar De La Hoya: An Olympic sensation who was an instant success when he turned pro. Charming and charismatic, he handled the spotlight brilliantly. He attracted and introduced an entire new fan-base to modern boxing--women! He was a mainstream celebrity which brought a lot of positive outside media attention to boxing.

Kim Duk-Koo: Many of you remember him as the Korean fighter who was killed in the ring versus Mancini in 1982. I watched that fight on live television. It was the loss of his life which paved the way for many changes in boxing that put an emphasis on the safety of boxers. After the fight, they introduced standing 8-counts, urged referees to stop fights before a boxer took too much punishment, and championship fights went from 15 down to 12 rounds. New pre-fight medical procedures would soon follow to ensure fighters were entering the ring without any pre-existing brain injuries.

Those are ten that I can think of for now. I read an article once that credited Chuck Wepner as one of the most important figures in boxing, since the Rocky films were inspired from his back story after his fight with Ali. Thought that was an interesting perspective.

What about Holyfield, who was a warrior in the ring and followed the Tyson era? Or Lennox Lewis, international heavyweight champion dominant throughout most of the 90s, who won two gold medals, had a lot of knockouts, avenged both of his losses and cleaned out the heavyweight division?