Jack Johnson backed out of signed contract to rematch Langford

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  • billeau2
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    #51
    Originally posted by GhostofDempsey
    The following Harry Wills quote is an excerpt from pages 360-361 of Joe Botti's book about Joe Jennette:

    "Jack Johnson was the meanest of the lot. Jack was a smart fellow in many ways, but in others he showed no sense at all. He got so stuck on himself he had the idea everyone should fall down and worship him. Johnson always wanted to show off. He wanted to attract attention all the time, and he didn't care much how he did it. As long as he made people talk about him he was happy, and he never stopped to think that he was doing himself more harm than good.

    "If you were a young fellow trying to get along, Johnson would not show you anything. He would rather show you up instead. Take the way he treated me when we were training to fight Jim Flynn in Las Vegas. I was a young fellow then who didn't know much, but anxious to get somewhere.

    "Jack Curley, who was promoting the match and looking after Johnson, offered me a job as sparring partner. I was glad to take it because I needed the money and thought I might learn something from the champion. There was a big crowd looking on the day we put on the gloves. From the start, Johnson tried to make me look silly so he could laugh at me in front of the crowd. Remember, at this time, although I was broke, I had something of a reputation, earned through hard fighting , and a boxer's reputation is his only asset.

    "Anyone but Johnson would have thought of that and acted accordingly. All Johnson
    could think of was his desire to make me look foolish."

    "Of course I expected to be hit and hit hard. I would not have minded that, for I was strong and tough, and it is all in the game. But when Johnson stopped straight boxing and tried to make me look bad, I got kind of sore. Johnson was very proud of his strength. He thought there was no one in the ring his equal in that respect or in any other, for that matter. One of his favorite tricks was to grab your arms, waltz you around and laugh, and then suddenly let you go and uppercut you.

    "Well, after he tried that on me a few times, laughing and kidding with the crowd at my expense, I decided I'd see which was the stronger of the two. The next time he grabbed my arms to shove them back, I set myself and threw him across the ring. That wiped the grin off his face in a hurry, for the crowd began to laugh at him instead of with him, something that makes a big difference to these babies who like to show off. Having lost his goat, Johnson began to slug. That was playing right into my hands, for I was tougher and a harder hitter. After mixxing it for a few moments he began to get the worst of it so he clinched and held on, meanwhile trying to laugh it off.

    "That was the only time I boxed with Johnson. He told Curley to pay me off and let me go. He didn't want anyone in his camp he could not handle as he pleased. That incident is typical of Johnson's whole career. He never cared how he hurt other peoples' feelings as long as he could make himself look big. Showing off was the cause of all his troubles. At the same time I would like to say right here that if Johnson did not act right when he won the title he was made to pay dearly. Although he could have avoided the trouble that came his way, he was not treated fairly either. I think that all intelligent persons will agree with me that neither Johnson nor the people that undertook to run him out of boxing have any reason to be proud of the way they acted."
    From The Baltimore Afro-American. June 13, 1931. Page 14.
    Very Important: The Afro American has been one of the countries most respected Newspapers. So this should be considered a respectable source. I don't know if they are still around, but even in modern times they were always considered a well respected paper.

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    • ShoulderRoll
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      #52
      Originally posted by GhostofDempsey
      I don't buy it. He clearly moved the goal post on Langford after winning the title. Langford traveled by ship all the way to London to fight him. It was about money and not wanting to risk his title against a much improved fighter.

      He conveniently avoided the likes of Langford, McVea, Jeannette, Wills, etc once he became champion. His excuse was there wasn't enough money in it and no one would want to see two black fighters competing for the title. They all accused him of such and it wasn't just a Mann Act.

      Johnson fought Langford, McVea and Jeannette while they were all up and coming, never at their best. Didn't want any part of Wills either. That's a long story of it's own, I'll post here.
      There's nothing for you to buy. It's a fact that Johnson signed to fight Langford in Australia.

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      • GhostofDempsey
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        #53
        Originally posted by ShoulderRoll
        There's nothing for you to buy. It's a fact that Johnson signed to fight Langford in Australia.

        You keep ignoring questions that aren't rhetorical.

        No, he signed to fight him while enroute to Australia to fight Burns, that fight was to take place in London. I don't know of any other legit attempt Johnson made to fight Langford after 1909.

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        • billeau2
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          #54
          Originally posted by GhostofDempsey
          You keep ignoring questions that aren't rhetorical.

          No, he signed to fight him while enroute to Australia to fight Burns, that fight was to take place in London. I don't know of any other legit attempt Johnson made to fight Langford after 1909.
          Hear about the Polish philosophy professor who was fired? He kept ducking rhetorical questions!

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          • billeau2
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            #55
            Originally posted by QueensburyRules
            - -Not to put too fine a point on it, but Johnson admitted to transporting $ across state lines via his former mistress to set up a cathouse.

            Need to check out prominent men of that era charged. Mann Act still in force today, the whole reason ***** a lawyer with 2 daughters refused to pardon him.
            Interesting point. Of course the normal rejoinder is to the claim Johnson just wanted to have a relationship with many white women at the same time. Trafficking laws were/are there to protect those being trafficked.

            One gets the sense, from various accounts, that Johnson was not well liked outside his circles.

            Spike Lee had a situation a few years back... The director of "Boys in the Hood" apparently expected Lee's support and encouragement when his film was succesful and he got anything but! Who is anyone to assume that any person, a member of a race, a group, automatically is a good, virtious and supportive individual?

            Maybe Johnson thought he was dealing with shifty individuals...though by all accounts Wills was a very decent guy.

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            • ShoulderRoll
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              #56
              Originally posted by GhostofDempsey
              You keep ignoring questions that aren't rhetorical.

              No, he signed to fight him while enroute to Australia to fight Burns, that fight was to take place in London. I don't know of any other legit attempt Johnson made to fight Langford after 1909.
              Jack Johnson agreed to fight Sam Langford prior to becoming champion of the world. After becoming champion he demanded more money, which was well within his rights to do.

              But what I am referring to is Johnson accepting promoter Hugh McIntosh's offer in 1912 to fight Langford in Australia. He signed for the bout but then McIntosh withdrew the offer once the racially-motivated Mann Act charges were brought against him.

              (Lucille Cameron, who was allegedly kidnapped by Johnson, had been in Chicago 3 months before even meeting him. And she wouldn't even testify against him. )



              JACK JOHNSON SIGNS.; Negro to Get $50,000 for Bouts with Langford and McVey.
              CHICAGO, Oct. 12. -- Jack Johnson tonight announced that he had accepted the offer of $50,000 to fight Sam Langford and Sam McVey in Australia, made by Hugh D. McIntosh. He will leave Chicago on Oct. 25 for Australia and train there. He will fight Langford on Dec. 26.

              https://www.nytimes.com/1912/10/13/a...gford-and.html
              Last edited by ShoulderRoll; 04-03-2020, 06:17 PM.

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              • QueensburyRules
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                #57
                - -Harry seems to have been one of the earliest vegetarians and also practiced fasting sessions.

                I'd guess he had a decent education enough to be exposed to those unusual ideas to adopt to his career and how that affected him. Plenty of vegetarians return to omnivorous. I've always thought he'd be interesting to to know in the day.

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                • Rusty Tromboni
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                  #58
                  Originally posted by travestyny
                  Tyson Fury outweighed Cunningham by more than Johnson outweighed Ketchel.

                  What say you about that?


                  And if that doesn't tickle your fancy, go check out your boy John L. Sullivan's professional career and come back and say the same about him that you said about Jack Johnson
                  So you admit Johnson is the only one of the three to have fought a bone fide Middleweight. That's a flaccid response even by your standards.

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                  • travestyny
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                    #59
                    Originally posted by Rusty Tromboni
                    So you admit Johnson is the only one of the three to have fought a bone fide Middleweight. That's a flaccid response even by your standards.








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                    • travestyny
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                      #60
                      Originally posted by GhostofDempsey
                      I don't buy it. He clearly moved the goal post on Langford after winning the title. Langford traveled by ship all the way to London to fight him. It was about money and not wanting to risk his title against a much improved fighter.

                      He conveniently avoided the likes of Langford, McVea, Jeannette, Wills, etc once he became champion. His excuse was there wasn't enough money in it and no one would want to see two black fighters competing for the title. They all accused him of such and it wasn't just a Mann Act.

                      Johnson fought Langford, McVea and Jeannette while they were all up and coming, never at their best. Didn't want any part of Wills either. That's a long story of it's own, I'll post here.
                      And besides what was already shown about Langford and McVea, you also can't ignore that he signed to fight Jeannette and the fight was scrapped by the commission. This is documented and I know I've shown it to you before, so I'm not sure why you keep on this way.









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