Was Lennox Lewis set up to lose against Vitali Klitschko?

[PRINCEKOOL]

The Oceans 11 scene was filmed with Vlad Klitscho during the fight week of Hamed vs Barrera as that fight was held in Vegas. Lewis lost to Rahman afterwards, hence Larry Merchant's quote of "...he (Lewis) just drowned in Oceans 11." seconds after the fight was ended by Rahman.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lennox...man#Background

Lennox Lewis at the 21 minute mark and on wards, explains that HE WAS working on set of Oceans 11.

[Mario040481]

Lennox Lewis at the 21 minute mark and on wards, explains that HE WAS working on set of Oceans 11.

Here's something contemporary at 7:56. But, as I think about it now, the footage filmed at the Hamed vs Barrera fight, that technically is considered as being "on set" for that film

[Naps]

Lewis was huffing and puffing, near death. Vitali wasn't making the necessary adjustments, but he was continuing to press the fight.

The stoppage absolutely was conspicuously convenient.

Lewis packed on extra weight SPECIFICALLY for that fight. He was coming off two of his best career performances. He was a 4-1 favorite.


Vitali was a still a few years off from his prime. And Lewis realized, if he had to fight Vitali, he'd need to pull the wool over his eyes.

When it almost backfired the referee intervened.

Lewis was fat, out of shape, and I agree he was huffing and puffing.

The goal in a boxing match is to either win on points, or mash up the other fighter. Vitali got mashed up, his face was falling off his skull.

Fat **** Lennox mutilated him.

Vitali being ahead on points before being disfigured by Lennox Lewis is his claim to fame. His biggest 'win' was a loss.

[TonyGe]

Will

It sounds like you were picking up on the anti-Lewis sentiments that were part of Lewis' career from the get-go. I don't know about the sheenanigans in this fight to get Vitalie in there, but will say this: Lewis felt that by taking on all commers, even avoiding mandatory defenses that were nonsense like John Ruiz, and fighting guys percieved as a threat like Michael Grant, would show he was the "best heavyweight on the planet" (his words).

By the time this fight rolled around Lewis probably felt he had shown his mettle, and had a difficult time, having prepared for a very weak opponent, not being in shape...and pulling out a game situation, taking everything Vitalie threw in the process. Now here is where it gets sad to me...

Lewis was expecting after this fight to have a kind interview, to be shown some respect and compassion by the media. Instead these sentiments came to a head. Lewis learned a valuable lesson, one that Ali had internalized years back: most people in the media are not your friend, not kind, not understanding, they are sycophantic to the interests of a narrative.

When it was Ali the narrative was, those who refused to fight were cowards, and very few toed the line, Cosell (RIP Howard) was one of them, which is why a Muslim convert (Ali) respected Cosell, a jew.

With Lewis he was immediately attacked for his performance. Lewis was taken aback and lost it. If you listen to the interviews that night you can see that something died in Lewis. He seemed to realize the chimera he was faced with and lost his own reticent breeding in the process. He sounded horribly defensive and like a sore winner, but if one really examines why, one can see that Lewis was attacked by the media. This is a man who was given maybe one gift decision (Mercer) and avenged all his defeats in the ring, and fought many young lions coming up, and those percieved as the top fighters of his era.

And no, lewis did not duck Tyson, as some here maintain... and he did not duck Bowe, but it often seems that many ducked him.

Well said...... Lennox was a great champion and carried himself fittingly.

[QueensburyRules]

Well said...... Lennox was a great champion and carried himself fittingly.

- -Lennox the Lion was exceedingly faint hearted in the first Field fight and it only got worse.

He promised the rematch and then reneged a year later after making Vitali jump thru hoops.

He'll always be Mary's little lamb.

[TonyGe]

- -Lennox the Lion was exceedingly faint hearted in the first Field fight and it only got worse.

He promised the rematch and then reneged a year later after making Vitali jump thru hoops.

He'll always be Mary's little lamb.

Well that's a different take on the situation.. interesting....

[QueensburyRules]

Lewis was fat, out of shape, and I agree he was huffing and puffing.

- -U fat again?

Lewis had an 8 week training camp on top of a two week pretraining camp with Manny 3 months before the aborted fight with Johnson.

Vitali tapped on 3 wk notice to fill in for Tyson who pulled out of the copromoted undercard of their Proposed rematch.

Vitali tapped as replacement on two weeks notice.

Yeah, we know U still nursing on mommy back then, but no more excuses for not knowing the details now.

Lewis had 5 more fights planned killed by Vitali.

[Willie Pep 229]

Tony Ge and Billeau2's interaction made me go back and watch the Merchant interview (I am assuring that is the interview being addressed.)

All that Billeau2 suggests about the interview seems correct, in spades, (really obvious when Lewis grabs the microphone leaving poor Larry to hold on to it like a child struggling with an adult).

But I am going to argue that it was Lewis who blew-up the interview and turned it into an argument. All he needed to do was throw Vilali a bone, make some respectful noises early on and Merchant would have backed off.

Merchant saw blood in the water and moved on it.

Billeau2 argues that the problem is systemic to modern journalism, and while there is no doubt a truth to that, I believe had Lewis made the right noises upfront, from the get go, Merchant would have backed off.

Also their argument quickly degraded into apples and oranges; with Merchant trying to force Lewis to say something "respectful," the apples. With Lewis believing he was being challenged regarding the legitimacy of the stoppage, the oranges. The two were talking pass each other.

I don't feel there is a legit comparison to Ali. Ali was never given a fair shot, anything he said was going to be considered wanting and unacceptable, Lewis wasn't in such a tough spot, a little less swagger and a little more "being a mensch" would have gotten the job done.

In short: Lewis could of diffused the entire event with just a few upfront kind words for Vitali; Ali was never in such a position.

But again, I would like to repeat, I think Lewis misunderstood how he was being challenged and mistakenly became defensive regarding the stoppage. After that it snowballed, with Merchant trying to bait Lewis with phrases like "you're still saying he has no heart"

(Merchant was trying to bully Lewis, as he often does; Lewis was reacting to the Boos, although he claimed he wasn't.)

God I loved seeing Merchant desperately trying to hang onto his microphone; Score: Fighters 1, Announcers 0.

[billeau2]

- -Lennox the Lion was exceedingly faint hearted in the first Field fight and it only got worse.

He promised the rematch and then reneged a year later after making Vitali jump thru hoops.

He'll always be Mary's little lamb.

Let me guess: Wilt would kick his a s s right?

[billeau2]

Tony Ge and Billeau2's interaction made me go back and watch the Merchant interview (I am assuring that is the interview being addressed.)

All that Billeau2 suggests about the interview seems correct, in spades, (really obvious when Lewis grabs the microphone leaving poor Larry to hold on to it like a child struggling with an adult).

But I am going to argue that it was Lewis who blew-up the interview and turned it into an argument. All he needed to do was throw Vilali a bone, make some respectful noises early on and Merchant would have backed off.




Merchant saw blood in the water and moved on it.

Billeau2 argues that the problem is systemic to modern journalism, and while there is no doubt a truth to that, I believe had Lewis made the right noises upfront, from the get go, Merchant would have backed off.

Also their argument quickly degraded into apples and oranges; with Merchant trying to force Lewis to say something "respectful," the apples. With Lewis believing he was being challenged regarding the legitimacy of the stoppage, the oranges. The two were talking pass each other.

I don't feel there is a legit comparison to Ali. Ali was never given a fair shot, anything he said was going to be considered wanting and unacceptable, Lewis wasn't in such a tough spot, a little less swagger and a little more "being a mensch" would have gotten the job done.

In short: Lewis could of diffused the entire event with just a few upfront kind words for Vitali; Ali was never in such a position.

But again, I would like to repeat, I think Lewis misunderstood how he was being challenged and mistakenly became defensive regarding the stoppage. After that it snowballed, with Merchant trying to bait Lewis with phrases like "you're still saying he has no heart"

(Merchant was trying to bully Lewis, as he often does; Lewis was reacting to the Boos, although he claimed he wasn't.)

God I loved seeing Merchant desperately trying to hang onto his microphone; Score: Fighters 1, Announcers 0.

There is a backstory also. Vitali and Lewis were bitter towards each other. Lewis had felt disrespected from the start by both brothers. It become somewhat personal.

Unfortunately because of the way the fight was stopped, there was not an opportunity, as often happens, for both men to drop the grudge... Even a bad decision in a close fight usually does not stop two guys from letting it go after hitting each other in the face for twelve nice rounds lol.

So there were a few incidentals that created that whole situation. It is sad to me. I actually like Larry Merchant. I put him in a similar position that I put Cosell. Both men could be cow's butts lol, but were principled. Cosell stuck by Ali and his decision... Merchant was consistent.

Bad way to leave the sport... Quite unfortunate.