Was Lennox Lewis set up to lose against Vitali Klitschko?

[PRINCEKOOL]

This fight polarizes people, it is one of "those."

Lewis habitually fought all commers. He took on young lions instead of stupid manditories while the Klits fought crap. Thats a fact to remember.

lewis was preparing for a scrub, thats a fact.

Vitalie had a chance to assert the fact that he was better, he couldn't. His face was torn to shreds, he was starting to fade, and in fairness Lewis was not looking great himself. But Lewis took Vitalie's shots, and vice versa. vitalie certainly had the right to say he handled himself, and so did Lewis.

If Lewis decided to retire, does it matter why? What if he was afraid of a fight with vitalie? Should he have went on and fought others...or taken a fight he was in no position to go into? We have to count what we have about this fight, not Allegations about a second fight.

Vitalie was not a green fighter. He was in many respects highly underrated, i always thought he was better than vlad, by a long shot.

Lewis may have been frightened off if anyone wants to believe that... But it did not prevent him from taking massive firepower from Vitalie and delivering it back in spades. we can see what happened by the appearance of both men after the fight. Neither guy flinched, and both had their moments...Great fight while it lasted.

Lennox Lewis's only weakness was sometimes his complacency, this was a fighter who? At times would fall asleep before his fights in the dressing room 'He was also on the set of Ocean's 11 filming, before he fought Vitaili Kiltschko'.

You have to take your chances at heavyweight and in my opinion 'Vitaili Kitschko did not capitalize' Lennox Lewis was clearly out of shape, but even still he was bullying Kiltschko.

Bullied him and beat him up, just through his share brute strength 'If Lewis was in condition, the fight would of looked similar to Lennox Lewis vs Michael Grant'.

[Mario040481]

...'He was also on the set of Ocean's 11 filming, before he fought Vitaili Kiltschko'.

...

The Oceans 11 scene was filmed with Vlad Klitscho during the fight week of Hamed vs Barrera as that fight was held in Vegas. Lewis lost to Rahman afterwards, hence Larry Merchant's quote of "...he (Lewis) just drowned in Oceans 11." seconds after the fight was ended by Rahman.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lennox...man#Background

[Rusty Tromboni]

This fight polarizes people, it is one of "those."

Lewis habitually fought all commers. He took on young lions instead of stupid manditories while the Klits fought crap. Thats a fact to remember.


Vitalie had a chance to assert the fact that he was better, he couldn't. His face was torn to shreds, he was starting to fade, and in fairness Lewis was not looking great himself. But Lewis took Vitalie's shots, and vice versa. vitalie certainly had the right to say he handled himself, and so did Lewis.

It was a terrible cut, but this is a contact sport. We've seen fighters overcome worse. I get it, it's been decades since Boxing has allowed blood to be a feature of the game. But in an epic fight, where an unprepared challenger was making a case for his place atop the mountain, and in no danger of being stopped, they stopped it.

Who was close to being stopped? The gassing champion, who'd been KO'd before. When much fresher than at the point in the Klitchko fight. Exhaustion DOES lead to finishes. I get it, Klitchko wasn't making the necessary adjustments to figure out that jab, but he was leading on the scorecards and the fresher fighter.

Lewis fighting all-comers is a bit of a stretch. He saw his butt-hole pucker against Mercer. He was less than dominant against Holyfield. When did he look dominant? Against fighters who were D.O.A.: Ruddock, Golota, Tyson, Tua. If you didn't have a chance against Lewis, there was a great chance you'd be facing down one of the finest Heavyweights to ever lace them up. if you had something to offer, and refused to go down, The Lion became the Pus.sy

Vitalie was not a green fighter.

How not!?

Lewis may have been frightened off if anyone wants to believe that... But it did not prevent him from taking massive firepower from Vitalie and delivering it back in spades. we can see what happened by the appearance of both men after the fight. Neither guy flinched, and both had their moments...Great fight while it lasted.

You can't have it both ways. I am not saying you specifically, Billeau, but the clowns soooo desperate to defend Lewis.

The younger Lewis couldn't take those punches. Sure, he moved faster, probably had more stamina, and was much more explosive offensively. But he couldn't absorb Vklitchko-level power -- at least he didn't believe he could.

Outboxing Tua and Tyson, avenging his loss the Rahman - everyone was talking about Lewis as if he were at his absolute best. Interviews from the time show that Lewis was foremost among them.

lewis was preparing for a scrub, thats a fact.

I have too high an opinion of you to believe you have actually fallen for Lewis' scam. We all know what he was doing.

That's probably the best part of all of this: watching the con-job blow up in his face.

Just like guys like Tank and Rigo today, he didn't have it in him to fight someone with the skill and heart of a Ukrainian. Regardless of the outcome of the fight, we know who the better fighter AND better man was.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Lennox Lewis's only weakness was sometimes his complacency, this was a fighter who? At times would fall asleep before his fights in the dressing room 'He was also on the set of Ocean's 11 filming, before he fought Vitaili Kiltschko'.

You have to take your chances at heavyweight and in my opinion 'Vitaili Kitschko did not capitalize' Lennox Lewis was clearly out of shape, but even still he was bullying Kiltschko.

Bullied him and beat him up, just through his share brute strength 'If Lewis was in condition, the fight would of looked similar to Lennox Lewis vs Michael Grant'.

Ding! Fwies are done!

[billeau2]

It was a terrible cut, but this is a contact sport. We've seen fighters overcome worse. I get it, it's been decades since Boxing has allowed blood to be a feature of the game. But in an epic fight, where an unprepared challenger was making a case for his place atop the mountain, and in no danger of being stopped, they stopped it.

Who was close to being stopped? The gassing champion, who'd been KO'd before. When much fresher than at the point in the Klitchko fight. Exhaustion DOES lead to finishes. I get it, Klitchko wasn't making the necessary adjustments to figure out that jab, but he was leading on the scorecards and the fresher fighter.

Lewis fighting all-comers is a bit of a stretch. He saw his butt-hole pucker against Mercer. He was less than dominant against Holyfield. When did he look dominant? Against fighters who were D.O.A.: Ruddock, Golota, Tyson, Tua. If you didn't have a chance against Lewis, there was a great chance you'd be facing down one of the finest Heavyweights to ever lace them up. if you had something to offer, and refused to go down, The Lion became the Pus.sy



How not!?




You can't have it both ways. I am not saying you specifically, Billeau, but the clowns soooo desperate to defend Lewis.

The younger Lewis couldn't take those punches. Sure, he moved faster, probably had more stamina, and was much more explosive offensively. But he couldn't absorb Vklitchko-level power -- at least he didn't believe he could.

Outboxing Tua and Tyson, avenging his loss the Rahman - everyone was talking about Lewis as if he were at his absolute best. Interviews from the time show that Lewis was foremost among them.



I have too high an opinion of you to believe you have actually fallen for Lewis' scam. We all know what he was doing.

That's probably the best part of all of this: watching the con-job blow up in his face.

Just like guys like Tank and Rigo today, he didn't have it in him to fight someone with the skill and heart of a Ukrainian. Regardless of the outcome of the fight, we know who the better fighter AND better man was.

Rusty

when I said Lewis was preparing for a "scrub" you do know I was referring to Kirk Johnson, the small fat heavyweight he was training to fight, not Vitalie. Johnson was an eay opponent.

Also: I never said Lewis was dominant. In fact that is one of my big knocks against him... Holly had wise words when Lewis complained of being robbed the first fight. Something to the effect of: "He should have put me down and left nothng to the judges if he was that on top of it." It showed a side of Lewis that was not aggressive enough, similar to when he fought Briggs.

I did say Lewis fought all commers. And you are singing the praises of tua? OK to me he looks one dimensional, no footwork whatsoever.

Again DOA maybe against a few fighters but your taking so many fights and none of these fighters were considered DOA at the time. Most people thought Ruddock would win, including the pundits. I just cringe from this type of analysis. When do we get two fighters in the ring, Mom watching the kids with cookies in the oven, wife happy, content...Corner motivated, perfect camp, fighter all ready and crackin, against a similar opponent? It does not happen Rusty! It is a sports event, more and more these days...But it is a fight also. It is getting jumped when you have to take a piss, with a bad hip....It is finding a way to work through it and let an instinct take over... You cannot just wipe out so many opponents because they had problems coming into the ring...

Lewis also had problems coming into the ring and went to war with vitalie. It works both ways. And Lewis and Vitalie both showed plenty of heart that fight.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Rusty

when I said Lewis was preparing for a "scrub" you do know I was referring to Kirk Johnson, the small fat heavyweight he was training to fight, not Vitalie. Johnson was an eay opponent.

Also: I never said Lewis was dominant. In fact that is one of my big knocks against him... Holly had wise words when Lewis complained of being robbed the first fight. Something to the effect of: "He should have put me down and left nothng to the judges if he was that on top of it." It showed a side of Lewis that was not aggressive enough, similar to when he fought Briggs.

I did say Lewis fought all commers. And you are singing the praises of tua? OK to me he looks one dimensional, no footwork whatsoever.

Again DOA maybe against a few fighters but your taking so many fights and none of these fighters were considered DOA at the time. Most people thought Ruddock would win, including the pundits. I just cringe from this type of analysis. When do we get two fighters in the ring, Mom watching the kids with cookies in the oven, wife happy, content...Corner motivated, perfect camp, fighter all ready and crackin, against a similar opponent? It does not happen Rusty! It is a sports event, more and more these days...But it is a fight also. It is getting jumped when you have to take a piss, with a bad hip....It is finding a way to work through it and let an instinct take over... You cannot just wipe out so many opponents because they had problems coming into the ring...

Lewis also had problems coming into the ring and went to war with vitalie. It works both ways. And Lewis and Vitalie both showed plenty of heart that fight.

1) Lewis definitely brought a different level of focus and intensity when he knew he could beat a fighter. It was like the last miles of the race: the faster I run, the quicker this is over. He was less dominant when he feared his opponent.

2) Lewis knew what he was doing. And he knew he'd get an unprepared Klitchko.

[Anthony342]

This fight polarizes people, it is one of "those."

Lewis habitually fought all commers. He took on young lions instead of stupid manditories while the Klits fought crap. Thats a fact to remember.

lewis was preparing for a scrub, thats a fact.

Vitalie had a chance to assert the fact that he was better, he couldn't. His face was torn to shreds, he was starting to fade, and in fairness Lewis was not looking great himself. But Lewis took Vitalie's shots, and vice versa. vitalie certainly had the right to say he handled himself, and so did Lewis.

If Lewis decided to retire, does it matter why? What if he was afraid of a fight with vitalie? Should he have went on and fought others...or taken a fight he was in no position to go into? We have to count what we have about this fight, not Allegations about a second fight.

Vitalie was not a green fighter. He was in many respects highly underrated, i always thought he was better than vlad, by a long shot.

Lewis may have been frightened off if anyone wants to believe that... But it did not prevent him from taking massive firepower from Vitalie and delivering it back in spades. we can see what happened by the appearance of both men after the fight. Neither guy flinched, and both had their moments...Great fight while it lasted.

The crap Lewis gets for not rematching Vitali reminds me of the same crap I've been hearing Floyd getting recently for not coming out of retirement to rematch Canelo, even though he's now 42. People's arguments are Floyd's still in shape and fighting exhibitions. As much as I like to sometimes criticize Floyd for his resume, I can't really jump on this bandwagon. This just seems kind of ridiculous and another excuse for his haters to hate him. Probably the same thing Lennox Lewis haters did back then. Haters gonna hate.

[Mario040481]

The crap Lewis gets for not rematching Vitali reminds me of the same crap I've been hearing Floyd getting recently for not coming out of retirement to rematch Canelo, even though he's now 42. People's arguments are Floyd's still in shape and fighting exhibitions. As much as I like to sometimes criticize Floyd for his resume, I can't really jump on this bandwagon. This just seems kind of ridiculous and another excuse for his haters to hate him. Probably the same thing Lennox Lewis haters did back then. Haters gonna hate.

Is that really happening a lot? I admittedly am a Canelo fan, I enjoy watching him fight. I also at times enjoyed watching Floyd fight. It doesn't always require blood and guts to entertain me, although it usually helps. Anyhow, I've not really seen a lot of that personally. I can't blame Canelo for answering over the yrs that he'd welcome that fight, I mean, the guy beat him soundly. It's the answer fighter in that position usually should be giving when getting asked that. But any person following the sport enough to know how age, and lack of competing professionally, especially throwing that age ingredient into the equation, is a stupid, stupid thing to even entertain. Anyone doing so is obviously just that thirsty to see Floyd beaten up and likely couldn't give a rat's a s s who it is attempting give the beating. What I have seen, and same goes for them as well, is those who scream for Floyd to do the Manny rematch. If Floyd still fought competitively then, hell yeah. He don't so, what is the point?

[billeau2]

The crap Lewis gets for not rematching Vitali reminds me of the same crap I've been hearing Floyd getting recently for not coming out of retirement to rematch Canelo, even though he's now 42. People's arguments are Floyd's still in shape and fighting exhibitions. As much as I like to sometimes criticize Floyd for his resume, I can't really jump on this bandwagon. This just seems kind of ridiculous and another excuse for his haters to hate him. Probably the same thing Lennox Lewis haters did back then. Haters gonna hate.

Oh Anthony really now... You have a long career where you fight the most threatening opposition consistently, you try to reach out to fan base....Have One gift decision (compare that to Floyd and many other great fighters). Shame on you for thinking after a tough fight you would get some sympathy...sorry merchant wasn't feeling it that day, too bad ole chap.

So after you are forced to look like a sore loser, questioned on issues of integrity, asked to say a kind word about a guy who you really dislike... A guy who has an infantile relationship to his little brother, a guy who has annoyed you from day one... A guy who did not look like he wanted to shake hands. WHAT!!!??? Your not feeling the love? humph! sore loser...

So your supposed to go back in, to such a grateful bunch of well whishers, risk a tough fight that could cause you permanent injury when you still have your wits about you. Because Larry was on the offensive, because haters have always been around your base, because Vitalie thinks he deserves it. Yeah thats what Lewis ought to have done...some people don't care what you do and they don't pay attention either:

When Holyfield rightfully critisized Lewis after the first fight, a fight Lewis obviously won, Lewis actually became very aggressive. He manhandled Grant, Went after Tyson with Steward begging him not to do so... Avenged Rahman with a big punch...Which brings us to the caution first fighter that went into the ring against Vitalie that night.

Lewis took Vitali's best punches, and dished out his own, hardly backing up at all... Proving that he could go on piss and vinegar with the best of them. And people also never credit him with the punch that opened up Vitali's face, it was a legal punch!

So yes my dear friend haters hate, and they seldom look carefully at anything that contradicts their position. I am a fan of Merchant but the way he conducted himself that night angers me to this day... He was a real bastard, unwilling to give a break to a great champion who went through the fires of Prometheus to show that Vitalie could be dealt with. And while people do not like it, the fact remains that Lewis was getting better that last round and was targeting vitali like he should, causing Vitali to get hit with two gigantic uppercuts.

[Mario040481]

Nice 720p version, likely the best on youtube, certainly that I have come across. German commentary though. https://youtu.be/PQoQuuI3YK4