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  • #71
    Originally posted by clemenza View Post
    Queensburied, no smart asssss response on why the fighting marine Ken Norton didn’t get a rematch with the Legendary Larry Holmes ????
    I gave you the facts.
    And what does Tua vs Lewis mean.
    That fight was 10 rounds to 2.
    It was a joke, a sparring session.
    One fighter was a world class guy that night, the other guy was a meatball heavy bag.
    STOP REWRITING HISTORY.
    Your incorrect again !!!!
    If I have a third grade education, then you failed out of Pre school
    And that’s that
    - -Lar ducked the Norton rematch just like he ducked the Bobick rematch to go after Duane's lesser brother.

    Ken on the same card for Lars first defense against Evangelista. They both won by KO taking lesser $$$ than the immediate rematch, so now the stage was set for the rematch save King wanted Norton out of the picture because he was too popular and not subservient like Lar was.

    Thus match him against Shavers that we all knew by then was a death sentence for Ken. On the same card Lar took care of baby 11-0 Ocasio, and to insult a hungry pack of legit contenders, he took journeyman 19-8 Weaver for his 3rd def who had Lar in bukos trouble.

    I bet you suckers actually watched the Ali fight as well. I guess Lar was forced by the suits to take that fight, so the net take of this is boxing is utterly shameless in their overall history, or criminally worse in the King era, so it's always the fighters of every era that continues to drag boxing along in its failing business model.
    Last edited by QueensburyRules; 04-02-2019, 08:40 AM.

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    • #72
      Originally posted by QueensburyRules View Post
      - -Lar ducked the Norton rematch just like he ducked the Bobick rematch to go after Duane's lesser brother.

      Ken on the same card for Lars first defense against Evangelista. They both won by KO taking lesser $$$ than the immediate rematch, so now the stage was set for the rematch save King wanted Norton out of the picture because he was too popular and not subservient like Lar was.

      Thus match him against Shavers that we all knew by then was a death sentence for Ken. On the same card Lar took care of baby 11-0 Ocasio, and to insult a hungry pack of legit contenders, he took journeyman 19-8 Weaver for his 3rd def who had Lar in bukos trouble.

      I bet you suckers actually watched the Ali fight as well. I guess Lar was forced by the suits to take that fight, so the net take of this is boxing is utterly shameless in their overall history, or criminally worse in the King era, so it's always the fighters of every era that continues to drag boxing along in its failing business model.
      Finally no insults, you speak like a Gentleman Queensbury.
      You have to think that Ken Norton didn’t have anything left after the Holmes rugged 15 round fight.
      He was in some very physically demanding fight, even the Quarry fight was nasty until the stoppage.
      You probably right on getting Norton out of the picture.
      Good job Queensburied.
      I will always give credit where credit is justified.
      And That’s That

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      • #73
        Originally posted by clemenza View Post
        Mr Queensburry,
        Now you are going to get some fiction or facts from the cannoli eating Peter Clemenza.
        You want to say Larry was fighting journey men and not giving Norton rematch .
        How the heck could norton get rematch when he gets blown out in 1 round vs the heavy hitting Ernie Shavers.
        Kenny should’ve retired after the Shavers fight. 3 fights with Ali, and by the way he easily was 2-1 if not 3-0. I don’t know HBO guru Harold Lederman was a judge at the last fight in Yankee stadium and ruled in favor of Muhammad.
        That score alone should’ve disqualified him as a “ expert unofficial Judge “
        Kenny must’ve needed the money because he gets KO by Shavers he then if I remember struggles to a Draw with Scott Ledoux and then Tex Cobb ,
        Yes Tex Cobb gave him trouble.
        And of course the 1 minute execution at the Garden vs Gerry Cooney finally got Kenny to hang them up.
        So how was Larry going to give him a rematch.
        Did he deserve rematch????
        Please stop being a smart Ass to everyone here.
        Fiction or fact from Clemenza Almanac.
        And that’s that
        Dude I am so with you on Letterman! There are few that I dislike... But I dislike him because his decisions are so flawed it is really aggravating.

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        • #74
          Originally posted by clemenza View Post
          Queensburied, no smart asssss response on why the fighting marine Ken Norton didn’t get a rematch with the Legendary Larry Holmes ????
          I gave you the facts.
          And what does Tua vs Lewis mean.
          That fight was 10 rounds to 2.
          It was a joke, a sparring session.
          One fighter was a world class guy that night, the other guy was a meatball heavy bag.
          STOP REWRITING HISTORY.
          Your incorrect again !!!!
          If I have a third grade education, then you failed out of Pre school
          And that’s that
          Ouch thanks a lot...Now I will have to lay off Queenie cause that was some extreme ownage as the kids say these days.

          But alas...I want to address some of the kurfuffle about David Tua...I can actually remember threads in the general section comparing Tyson to Tua...Yeah yeah I know.

          Lets talk about one handed fighters, how they are made, how they succeed when they do... Lets bring in Razor Rudock. Rudock when he fought Tyson had become, by and large, a one handed fighter. But there are two things about Rudock that stand out: He was not Always a one handed fighter. Juggernaught and I defend Donovan often in this respect. Guy was a hell of a fighter. So what happened? Why? and what does it have to do with Tua!?

          If you look at the Tyson fights RR had a lot of success, almost winning both fights by certain measures. Most of his work was done inside, fighting Tyson where Tyson could not get leverage. Smothering the smaller man. Razor's legs were already going, he was not going to be able to get up on his toes and box Tyson with a jab. So in a very real sense he didn't need to be a two handed fighter to get to Mike the way he was proceeding. He almost won those fights in the later rounds by trying to drown Tyson in deep water. He used the hook to come in and trade inside and smother Mike.

          Tua never was a smart fighter. He never really was a two handed fighter and that is particularly dangerous because he did not have reach. Tua was never going to be able to fight and win at the top of the division with such limited faculties. In his prime he was strong enough and resilant enough to win some decent fights. But once guys figure you out, and your big gun(s) can be avoided... and especially when you slow down, you don't have the tools to fight at the top. Lewis embarrased Tua because he could use his reach to hit Tua at will.
          Last edited by billeau2; 04-02-2019, 12:34 PM.

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          • #75
            - -Bringing the discussion back to on topic, the Lewis and Foreman being discussed woulda Whooped both Lar and Kenny and done so easily.

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            • #76
              Originally posted by QueensburyRules View Post
              - -Bringing the discussion back to on topic, the Lewis and Foreman being discussed woulda Whooped both Lar and Kenny and done so easily.
              Queenie, Foreman busted up Kenny in like 2 rounds did he Not ???
              This one always puzzled me for some strange reason , Hear me out George never got in the ring with “ Irish Jerry Quarry.”
              He fought them all but not him.
              Supposedly that was a fight Quarry wanted badly.
              You would think that George would’ve stopped Jerry in the Early part of the fight round 6-7 probably because of cuts.
              Interesting though.
              Both men took on all fighters.
              Quarry was a much better fighter toward the end of his career with Gil Clancey as his chief second, very underrated fighter that had some good wins and some strange defeats.

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              • #77
                - -As I recall, on George's old website he ranked Joe Louis #1 and Quarry 2-3. Seems to have thought highly of him, but when I asked, he told me no, that he had never even sparred Quarry.

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                • #78
                  It’s funny you say that , I read somewhere Big George saying that Jerry Quarry was the best Heavyweight to never win the title in those days.
                  Ya know some of the “ Old Timers “
                  Thought Jerry was just to stubborn in his fighting ways. He was very skilled but at times he Brawled when he should’ve Boxed and boxed when he should’ve Brawled. His loss to Eddie Machen he should’ve boxed,
                  Then he brawls vs Jimmy Ellis when that was the time box.
                  But he did have some quality wins,
                  Mac Foster he KO Shavers in 1
                  Thad Spencer and Buster Mathis were good wins and so was Ron Lyle.
                  He should’ve hung up the gloves after the second Frazier fight at the Garden.
                  He beat Patterson.
                  If you get a chance YouTube the George Chuvalo fight.
                  Wild fight. Crazy ending.
                  Chuvalo was another Blood and guts fighter. He fought for 20 years a pro and he still is sharp as all Hell

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                  • #79
                    Originally posted by clemenza View Post
                    It’s funny you say that , I read somewhere Big George saying that Jerry Quarry was the best Heavyweight to never win the title in those days.
                    Ive heard many fighters say that.

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                    • #80
                      Originally posted by clemenza View Post
                      It’s funny you say that , I read somewhere Big George saying that Jerry Quarry was the best Heavyweight to never win the title in those days.
                      Ya know some of the “ Old Timers “
                      Thought Jerry was just to stubborn in his fighting ways. He was very skilled but at times he Brawled when he should’ve Boxed and boxed when he should’ve Brawled. His loss to Eddie Machen he should’ve boxed,
                      Then he brawls vs Jimmy Ellis when that was the time box.
                      But he did have some quality wins,
                      Mac Foster he KO Shavers in 1
                      Thad Spencer and Buster Mathis were good wins and so was Ron Lyle.
                      He should’ve hung up the gloves after the second Frazier fight at the Garden.
                      He beat Patterson.
                      If you get a chance YouTube the George Chuvalo fight.
                      Wild fight. Crazy ending.
                      Chuvalo was another Blood and guts fighter. He fought for 20 years a pro and he still is sharp as all Hell
                      - -Very ironic that both Quarry and Ali came down with Parkinson's in their 40s.

                      Or maybe due to the Irish genes they shared.

                      Yeah, that Chuvalo fight was bizarre. Def a knockdown and either the ref miscounted or Quarry was too confused to pick up the count. Something about Chuvalo's genetics and physiology made him immune from punch drunkeness. Helped that he was built like a tank, and he needed all that as he more than any other fighters has suffered multiple tragic family losses. He may be the only surviving member...God Bless...

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