Where does Roy Jones rank?

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Whitaker was well on his way out too when Oscar fought him. Quartey and Trinidad were much bigger theats. That's why Oscar was favored to win. I won't even get into how Oscar waited until Quartey was inavtive for 18 months after a shaky performance.

Chavez was well on his way too. Praising Oscar for those fights while criticizing Jones for opponents such as Johnson, Hill, or Mccallum is inconsistent.


Do you have a list of fighters in the 90's that fought and beat better fighters than Jones?

Your not confronting my points.. Chavez and Whittaker while past prime were still world class fighters, especially whittaker.. Guys like mccallum and hill were way past it...

Just name Roy's best ten wins, or his great wins between toney and ruiz?

As for fighters that beat better opponents, I will just use superstars that were on the same level as roy jones in the 90s

Lennox, holyfield, and bowe took on more challenges IMO
Oscar was fighting jeff mayweather in his fifth fight right around the time roy fought hopkins.. Then the next year roy fought toney, and that was it till ruiz, while Oscar fought genero, ruales, molina, leija, chavez twice, pernell, Ike, oba, tito,
Roy was fighting guys similar in caliber to oscars Camacho.. A name, decent fighter, but not really a threat ie REGGIE, del Valle, merqui Sosa, paz, lucas, etc

I would also think that toney took more challenges in the 90s with Roy, montel twice, mccallum twice, nunn, Barkley, prince

One could even make the case for the small guys like carbajal, tapia, etc taking more risks than roy,,

I just don't see how one can argue that roy wasn't in cruise control for most of his prime and really didn't take challenges again until his hbo deal ran out, then it was ruiz, tarver 3 times, tito, calzaghe, lacy, hopkins 2, lebedev...
Roy took on tons of big names once he was done milking hbo

[IronDanHamza]

I'm not saying take out his best 2 wins.. My point is that jones from the toney fight didn't really fight a great schedule until ruiz almost a decade later.. Compared to other greats of the era or Oscar, lennox, etc, Roy's run is very shallow..
He has two big wins early vs hopkins and toney,l
Hopkins was jones' test at the top level in preparation for an eventual toney showdown..
Toney was Roy's gateway to PPv and stardom, and more importantly an hbo contract.. Once he got the contract he put it in cruise control until it expired and then all of a sudden he has 3 straight PPv fights and is taking challenges..

Remember when roy was trying to fight a fat buster douglas? For real, roy was set in cruise control for most of his prime.. whereas if you look at other greats of the 90s they fought a much better list of overall opponents..

How is that not what you're saying? It's literally exactly what you're saying.

"Outside of Toney and Hopkins" why outside of them? What reason is there to not include them?

Outside of Holyfield and Klitschko what are Lewis' opponents?

Outside of Hearns, Hagler, Duran and Benitez, who did Leonard beat?

It's ridiculous.

Even outside of those two which are better than anything Lewis did, it's still comparable.

[IronDanHamza]

name all these great wins roy has besides toney n hopkins...

All you roy huggers spouting off about great wins, but all of you have refused to name Roy's ten best wins, or even acknowledge the fact that his prime run before and after toney was lackluster at best

Oscar gets criticized for fighting old chavez and pernell, but at least those guys were belt holders, still champs, and pernell was still on p4p lists.. But not a peep about roy fighting a 42 year old jr mid, over an over the hill virgil hill who had just been beaten by DM..
Reggie johnson was a good middleweight in the early 90s, at light heavy 8 years later he was nothing more than a crap paper titlist..
Montel was decent, but nothing special
Tate never really did anything
Del Valle was about as mediocre as you can get

Roy was even fighting the same day as he played basketball.. Lmao yeah he was really taking threatening fights...

Bryant Brannon but not Frankie liles.. Lmao

Remember when roy was fighting off duty cops.. Lmao


Please name all these great wins roy had besides toney and hopkins..
Like I said before, Roy's resume is top heavy and very shallow..

So please name his top 10 wins during his prime

Ok so Reggie Johnson was a crap paper Titlest.

But you say Roy should have fought John David Jackson in 1993.

You say Roy should have fought "The champions" at Middleweight instead of Hopkins.

But then he had all of the belts at 175 but that was "cruise control".

Oh of course while this was going on Lennox Lewis was fighting top competition like Hasim Rahman, Oliver McCall and Frank Bruno.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

How is that not what you're saying? It's literally exactly what you're saying.

"Outside of Toney and Hopkins" why outside of them? What reason is there to not include them?

Outside of Holyfield and Klitschko what are Lewis' opponents?

Outside of Hearns, Hagler, Duran and Benitez, who did Leonard beat?

It's ridiculous.

Even outside of those two which are better than anything Lewis did, it's still comparable.

Your missing my point...


I'm talking about post toney, pre ruiz,, from November of 94-May of 03, roy took no really threatening fights, or even major fights.. That's was his prime years for the most part and he didn't deliver a major fight for over 9 years..

So yes, I do think out of all the true superstars of the 90s, roy had the easiest schedule, by far.. Even compared to today's superstars like floyd, manny, etc.. Roy fought a weak schedule for a superstar..

Rick frazier was basically rod salka,, a guy having no business on hbo, let alone with the top p4p guy in the sport..

That 9 year run in his career is highly uneventful, and if roy didn't have an exciting style he wouldn't have the accolades he does

[IronDanHamza]

Your missing my point...


I'm talking about post toney, pre ruiz,, from November of 94-May of 03, roy took no really threatening fights, or even major fights.. That's was his prime years for the most part and he didn't deliver a major fight for over 9 years..

So yes, I do think out of all the true superstars of the 90s, roy had the easiest schedule, by far.. Even compared to today's superstars like floyd, manny, etc.. Roy fought a weak schedule for a superstar..

Rick frazier was basically rod salka,, a guy having no business on hbo, let alone with the top p4p guy in the sport..

That 9 year run in his career is highly uneventful, and if roy didn't have an exciting style he wouldn't have the accolades he does

Do you have any reason for it to be "post Toney"?

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Ok so Reggie Johnson was a crap paper Titlest.

But you say Roy should have fought John David Jackson in 1993.

You say Roy should have fought "The champions" at Middleweight instead of Hopkins.

But then he had all of the belts at 175 but that was "cruise control".

Oh of course while this was going on Lennox Lewis was fighting top competition like Hasim Rahman, Oliver McCall and Frank Bruno.

I'm just saying there was plenty of options to go for a mw belt and roy decided for the vacant vs an espn fighter, rather than an established champ...


Who were these champions at 175??

If you think old mccallum, montel, del Valle, reggie are threatening opponents to roy and credible champs then your wrong.. These guys were at very best just paper champs that would never doing anything after their short run with a title..

So yeah, I think roy was on cruise control.... If these other 175 champs were actually top level, they would have been big PPv fights like the tarver and toney fights... How come they weren't ppv,,,, because they were cherrypicks and not legit big fights

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Do you have any reason for it to be "post Toney"?

Yes,,, we are talking about his resume, and how it's shallow, top heavy but shallow compared to other superstars

Yes toney was a great win, it established a young roy jones as the p4p top guy, but then he has basically coasted off that win the rest of his career until the ruiz fight 9 years later...

When judging roy jones resume, you can't discount the fact that for 9 years of his prime, he basically had mismatched opponents...

[IronDanHamza]

I'm just saying there was plenty of options to go for a mw belt and roy decided for the vacant vs an espn fighter, rather than an established champ...


Who were these champions at 175??

If you think old mccallum, montel, del Valle, reggie are threatening opponents to roy and credible champs then your wrong.. These guys were at very best just paper champs that would never doing anything after their short run with a title..

So yeah, I think roy was on cruise control.... If these other 175 champs were actually top level, they would have been big PPv fights like the tarver and toney fights... How come they weren't ppv,,,, because they were cherrypicks and not legit big fights

Right, yes, he should had fought established Champions at MW like John David Jackson instead of Hopkins.

But at 175, the champions weren't good enough.

You just named Griffin for Toney, but then for Roy it's not a good opponent.

And Joseph has already told you Hopkins was the fight to take.

I'm sure if Roy fought John David Jackson you'd be including that in his good opponents, maybe even up there with "Prime Oliver McCall"

[IronDanHamza]

Yes,,, we are talking about his resume, and how it's shallow, top heavy but shallow compared to other superstars

Yes toney was a great win, it established a young roy jones as the p4p top guy, but then he has basically coasted off that win the rest of his career until the ruiz fight 9 years later...

When judging roy jones resume, you can't discount the fact that for 9 years of his prime, he basically had mismatched opponents...

So no reason then?

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Right, yes, he should had fought established Champions at MW like John David Jackson instead of Hopkins.

But at 175, the champions weren't good enough.

You just named Griffin for Toney, but then for Roy it's not a good opponent.

And Joseph has already told you Hopkins was the fight to take.

I'm sure if Roy fought John David Jackson you'd be including that in his good opponents, maybe even up there with "Prime Oliver McCall"

The champs at 175 were not great... Why were none of them a big fight..

Montel is a decent win, so is Harding, and probably gonazlaez.. The rest were pretty overmatched opponents.. And none were even remotely a big fight..

So no reason then?

Nice cop out...

So your gonna ignore that roy had a 9 year break between big fights.. And had exactly one big fight before that stretch.. That's pretty lame for the "fighter of the 90s"

Floyd has a better resume at 154 than roy does at 175 in terms of opponents..
Cotto, canelo,mand Oscar are way better than del Valle, old mccallum, reggie, Otis, montel, etc....

9 years is twice as long as the manny/floyd saga... I don't know any other superstar fighter that doesnt have a big fight in over 9 years.
But I guess people fall in love with all the fantastic highlights of roy vs inferior opponents and forget who he was actually fighting...

Name another superstar that went 9 years without a big fight