AMAZING! James Corbett and Gene Tunney demonstrating tactics.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Because processed food and the lack of manual labor make stronger athletes. The main scientific break throughs in sports are also still considered illegal even though they make them stronger and faster. I would still rate the harder work and real food diet old timers had over these scientific break throughs.

Well you would be wrong. There's a reason records are being constantly being broke in the Olympics, boxing, baseball, soccer and every other sport. Because athletes are getting bigger, stronger and faster.

A man in the 1930's was running 12 second 100 meter times. Now women run that.

[New England]

1. You claim that your knowledge of boxing is such that it validates your opinion.
2. Other people who also know about boxing disagree with your opinion. Thereby invalidating a claim that it should be obvious to anyone who knows about boxing that your opinion is correct.
3. You also demonstrate that you know nothing about martial arts and are willing to spew an opinion. I can vouch for that fact. I mean....yu have countless martial arts experts who saw the value of Lee, guys who worked with him, and then you have your opinion. Even people who generally undermine Lee's fighting ability (like myself for example) do not share your opinion that Lee was a snake oil salesman.
4. The issue of Lee while seemingly unrelatd to the Tunney tape sheds light on the issue of credability. it shows that you have little to none.

Does that make sense? heres an example if it still does not: I tell you that the first 500 pound heavyweight will be the most evolved fighter and make all previous fighters look like unskilled midgets....then I turn around and say that Brock Lessnor was the best MMA fighter ever. Well you think I am an idiot regarding the first opinion but....as a trainer who has worked with MMA guys you KNOW I am an idiot regarding the second opinion....so naturally you make a connection. So now you also have a hypothetical example as well

this is you toning down the rambling?


i think i get it. you took it personal when i called bruce lee an actor.

here's the great bruce lee in all his glory on the heavybag. you can't fake heavy bag. you either know how to punch, move, balance yourself, or you do not. bruce lee does not.



bruce the technician.

[RINGG]

Well you would be wrong. There's a reason records are being constantly being broke in the Olympics, boxing, baseball, soccer and every other sport. Because athletes are getting bigger, stronger and faster.

A man in the 1930's was running 12 second 100 meter times. Now women run that.

And we know track stars are clean.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

And we know track stars are clean.

Before the influx of steroids in sports, records where being broken. Evolution alone, and the contributing factors have shown people to become bigger and stronger.

I was in a WWII museum once and the one thing that stood out to me was how small humans were back then. If I lived in that time, I would be considered a big dude, I'm only 5'11" and am a little big bigger than avg by today's standards.

Rocky Marciano was HW champ of the world and was 5'10" and didn't even weight 190lbs, Klitchko is 6'7" and is 245lbs of solid muscle.

Yet boxing hasn't changed though...lol

[RINGG]

Before the influx of steroids in sports, records where being broken. Evolution alone, and the contributing factors have shown people to become bigger and stronger.

I was in a WWII museum once and the one thing that stood out to me was how small humans were back then. If I lived in that time, I would be considered a big dude, I'm only 5'11" and am a little big bigger than avg by today's standards.

Rocky Marciano was HW champ of the world and was 5'10" and didn't even weight 190lbs, Klitchko is 6'7" and is 245lbs of solid muscle.

Yet boxing hasn't changed though...lol

I am not saying boxing hasn't changed and I am not saying athletes haven't gotten faster and bigger. Records are constantly broken but since the development of hormones, records have fallen at an unprecedented pace. To suggest Golovkin or Cotto would beat Ray Robinson because the advances in
in sports science carries no weight with me. I know you did not suggest this, but it is the common ground used in here by members to compare their favorite to the all time greats.

On a side note. I read a recent study about since fast food was introduced to Japan, the youth are taller and bigger than previous generations.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

I am not saying boxing hasn't changed and I am not saying athletes haven't gotten faster and bigger. Records are constantly broken but since the development of hormones, records have fallen at an unprecedented pace. To suggest Golovkin or Cotto would beat Ray Robinson because the advances in
in sports science carries no weight with me. I know you did not suggest this, but it is the common ground used in here by members to compare their favorite to the all time greats.

On a side note. I read a recent study about since fast food was introduced to Japan, the youth are taller and bigger than previous generations.

Again, Ray Robinson is a great fighter regardless of era. I was speaking in generalizations because there are some who don't think boxing has changed at all, that's simply not factually true.

Look at the difference between N. Korea and S. Korea. One is flourishing, people are living longer, are bigger, stronger and happier and the other is a disaster.

Technology, nutrition, and science makes a difference.

[ShoulderRoll]

Athletes today might be bigger but the actual know-how of boxing has not necessarily improved.

James Toney admits that a lot of his technique came from watching film of Ezzard Charles in the '40s and '50s. Thanks to being clued in on what to look for by Pops Miller.

[RINGG]

Again, Ray Robinson is a great fighter regardless of era. I was speaking in generalizations because there are some who don't think boxing has changed at all, that's simply not factually true.

Well judging by my last post and yours we have settled somewhat.

Look at the difference between N. Korea and S. Korea. One is flourishing, people are living longer, are bigger, stronger and happier and the other is a disaster.

Technology, nutrition, and science makes a difference.

I point to my previous mention of Japan. I also mention other countries where like most of the modern world there is the presence of steroids in the meats and natural foods are rapidly replaced by processed foods. Do these modern diet achievements mean bigger people, yes. Does the technology, and science they necessary mean advancements in nutrition. I guess it is a matter of opinion.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Athletes today might be bigger but the actual know-how of boxing has not necessarily improved.

James Toney admits that a lot of his technique came from watching film of Ezzard Charles in the '40s and '50s. Thanks to being clued in on what to look for by Pops Miller.

Don't you think that's the definition of evolution? I agree with Toney, but take the shoulder roll for example, it's changed a lot. It's evolved and the way Mayweather uses it, it's not the way it was classically shown.

[Ray Corso]

Funny how the "heart" hasn't grown with all this size differences. Maybe that's why non of these modern fighters fight hard through their 12 round bouts. Afraid of tiring? With all the "modern" training techniques these days how come no one is TIRED at the end of a fight?

Size of the fight IN the dog is what counts not just the size of the dog.

You better have your big man small man techniques in order!

Marciano 5'11" 191lbs I know, I met the man shook his hand and I personally know 3 men who fought him. To all of you he is on old film at horrible shutter speed and a picture in the boxing history book.

You learn about someone when you meet them in person. Especially in boxing!

Ray