Louis's Resume Greater Than Ali's Resume Of Wins, Can It Be Justified?

[them_apples]

Ok! I finally am able to write out a response to this post! As I said before it's a well thought post that deserves more than a flippant answer.




But again, Ali was past-prime for the second Chuvalo fight. He no longer had the legs or reflexes to avoid punches the way he did pre-exhile. And for the record, in the FIRST fight Chuvalo took a lopsided beating from a prime Ali.




I say Ali's prime was PRE-exhile (64-67) with his prime ENDING with his ban from boxing. Would those years he missed have been a continuance of his prime? Yes, probably, but chose not to speculate. What I DO know is when he came back he no longer had the reflexes footspeed he had before the ban hence the reason he was tagged more frequently and was forced to change his style of fighting.




Louis did indeed lose those years to the Army but I think everyone will agree he wasn't the same fighter anymore when he returned to the ring. Prime for prime would be a pre-Army Louis against a pre-ban Ali.




Even the best defensive fighter gets hit in every fight, even such masters as Pep and Whitaker. Despite what his demented fan-bois claim even Mayweather gets hit cleanly in every fight. So it's not a question of whether he would get hit or not. The real question is would he get hit often enough for his opponent to win? To my mind no. Ali never got tagged frequently enough in his prime for an opponent to outpoint him, not even Patterson who had nearly as fast hands as Ali was able to do it. Certainly no one was knocking Ali out: His chin was about as good as any I've seen in 35 years of watching boxing. Maybe guys like Cobb had a better one but then Cobb wasn't human anyway. Ali also took it to the body flat out better than anyone I've ever seen.




But again that's moot since Ali was past-prime for the first Frazier fight. I would also point out that ATG great Heavyweights usually don't have the opportunity to fight other in-prime ATG Heavyweights. If they did then most certainly they would pick up an L here and there as one's chances of taking an odd loss here and there go up with a tougher schedual. A past-prime Ali fought and in-prime ATG Heavyweight in Foreman.....and won.




It wasn't Norton's jab and parrying that caused Ali problems it was his awkward crab-like style that gave ALL slick boxers fits. There's no way Louis is going to emulate THAT.




While it may be more desirable to take matters out of the judges hands to be on the safe side, ultimately a dominant win is a dominant win regardless of how it ends. To me, Lewis' lopsided win over Tua was more impressive than Foreman's KO win over Moorer since Lennox dominated the fight while George was BEING dominated up until the KO.

Ultimately KO rates are a function of number of factors but the one that always is brought up is punching power. Punching power is in my view the LEAST important of the major traits that make up a fighter. Chin, defense, stamina, ect. ect. are more important. This is why slick boxers with average power have been able to consistantly win championships. It wasn't because there weren't any punchers around at the time, it was because punching power is only ONE of the major traits and not the most important one at that. Look at Willie Pep. He was by any measure an ATG fighter. Certainly one of the three best ever at Featherweight. Pep couldn't break an egg with a hammer. Look at HIS KO%.....is Pep any less a great because he KOed a smaller percentage than Ali did?

Poet

I agree with the bit on Norton. He gave boxers fits because he was awkward and applied pressure. Boxers like to use accuracy, so when they can't figure out where they want to put their punches they won't pull the trigger for fear of missing. Norton had subtle head movement and used a combination of parrying etc to approach Ali. Nothing I've seen Louis really do as he was known to take punches throughout his career.

Louis could hurt Ali if he landed, but no more so than that beast of Joe Frazier that showed up in the first fight or Earnie Shavers.

[dde91]

Ali was the and still is the Greatest when it comes to level of competition and resume. His Resume is no joke and is 2nd to none.