Marvelous Marvin Hagler, Where do you rate him?

[wmute]

Why do you say that?

Round 1-4 of the Leonard fight are enough of a reason IMO.

He did not show the ability to adapt during a fightm which the top echelon of ATG usually shows. His stamina was so good and he was so tough that he usually won late rounds regardless.

For someone with that dedication, skills and bag of tricks, he was not very smart.

It is my belief that he could have been actually even better, if there was more IQ from him and from his corner.

[Toney616]

Round 1-4 of the Leonard fight are enough of a reason IMO.

In fact that was quite the opposite, he was trying to be too smart, which is why he decided to fight orthodox for the first 4 rounds. He should of known that Ray wasnt going to stand and trade with him though and should of tried to get him out of there as soon as possible

[wmute]

In fact that was quite the opposite, he was trying to be too smart, which is why he decided to fight orthodox for the first 4 rounds. He should of known that Ray wasnt going to stand and trade with him though and should of tried to get him out of there as soon as possible

I don't think there was anything smart in fighting orthodox against Leonard.

[Toney616]

I don't think there was anything smart in fighting orthodox against Leonard.

He must of assumed that Ray would of been expecting him to fight out of the southpaw stance, so he was fighting orthodox thinking it would confuse him. Ray must of thought it was his birthday or something, because according to what I read he was having fits sparring with his southpaw training partners.

[JAB5239]

well I havent seen those fights but from what I have seen he looked very slow and his jab didnt look anywhere near as hard and accurate as haglers did.why would you not rate robinson above them?

To inconsistent at 160. He was still great, but past his best and with to many losses to fighters neither Hagler nor Monzon would have lost to. Ray probably wouldn't have either at his best, but we can only go by what actually happened.

[wmute]

He must of assumed that Ray would of been expecting him to fight out of the southpaw stance, so he was fighting orthodox thinking it would confuse him. Ray must of thought it was his birthday or something, because according to what I read he was having fits sparring with his southpaw training partners.

That's a possibility (and it would not have been a smart plan), but if Marvin (and his corner) were smarter, they would have changed plan in less than 4 rounds.

Having the wrong gameplan is not smart.

Taking 4 rounds to make a very simple change (going back to what you do best) is also not smart.

I love Hagler, and note I am not saying that he is a dumb come forward kind of fighter. All I am saying is that when I compare him with those I consider at the top, I see shortcomings in strategy and ability to adapt.

[blaze778]

I put Hagler in the top 20. He would be top 15 if he would have beaten Leonard. Before Leonard, he was champ for 7 years, took on all comers, avenged both losses and both draws.

He let his ****iness get the best of him in the first four rounds against Sugar Ray. If he would just boxed and took Leonard seriously in the beginning, he would have won on the scorecards.

[HaglerSteelChin]

People assume that Hagler loss the first four rounds, but Round 3 was close, and could have gone either way, i always scored it even to be fair to both fighters. Round 9 another round that could have gone either way, Hagler landed the heavier blows but SRL captured the drama by getting out of the ropes with flurries.