Ranking of the 1940-1960 lightheavyweights

[GJC]

A decision lost against Cream.

Errr think you are going to have to do a lot more than printing boxers real names to show knowledge.
Personally I think anyone calling SRR Walker Smith Jr say shows themeself to be pretentious rather than clever, his family excepted of course

[GJC]

Bivins is a reasonable choice to put in the list but who would you pull out of it to make place for him ?

Well lets start with the HW Marciano he wasn't a LHW.

Charles and Moore are probably the best 2 LHW's in history so those wins Bivins had against them are not too shabby

Conn can go if we are just going on your 1940-1960 time frame.
Fantastic fighter Conn but you could put a case that Bivins best wins at LHW cerainly equal Conn's

Personally I rank Bivins above Maxim, he didn't have a great record against Charles or Moore either btw.

Johnson is a coin toss with Bivins IMO when he beat Bivins it wasn't exactly prime versus prime.

As Jabs pointed out John Henry Lewis didn't even fight between 1940 and 1960

If you rate Fox above Bivins then I give up. I guess those 2 wins against Walcott are swaying you, though in that era Walcott was not prime. Again he doesn't fit into your 40-60 time frame.

Lesnevich would rank below Bivins

Lloyd Marshall was a great fighter and doesn't belong at the bottom of that list. You know Bivins beat him right?

[frankenfrank]

Well lets start with the HW Marciano he wasn't a LHW.

Charles and Moore are probably the best 2 LHW's in history so those wins Bivins had against them are not too shabby

Conn can go if we are just going on your 1940-1960 time frame.
Fantastic fighter Conn but you could put a case that Bivins best wins at LHW cerainly equal Conn's

Personally I rank Bivins above Maxim, he didn't have a great record against Charles or Moore either btw.

Johnson is a coin toss with Bivins IMO when he beat Bivins it wasn't exactly prime versus prime.

As Jabs pointed out John Henry Lewis didn't even fight between 1940 and 1960

If you rate Fox above Bivins then I give up. I guess those 2 wins against Walcott are swaying you, though in that era Walcott was not prime. Again he doesn't fit into your 40-60 time frame.

Lesnevich would rank below Bivins

Lloyd Marshall was a great fighter and doesn't belong at the bottom of that list. You know Bivins beat him right?

Marciano made 182 without dehydration so if James Toney whom had higher fat percentages which make dehydration harder could lose 16 lbs from 183 to make 168 , then Marciano could have made 175 from the 182 he had , very simple.
Maybe it should have been 1934-1957 or something.
Joey Maxim was stopped only once in his career , despite facing tremendous opposition himself , I assume you are familiar with his achievements , but maybe you should remind them.

[wmute]

Marciano made 182 without dehydration so if James Toney whom had higher fat percentages which make dehydration harder could lose 16 lbs from 183 to make 168 , then Marciano could have made 175 from the 182 he had , very simple.
Maybe it should have been 1934-1957 or something.
Joey Maxim was stopped only once in his career , despite facing tremendous opposition himself , I assume you are familiar with his achievements , but maybe you should remind them.

Incorrect. No one seems to agree with you. I wonder why.

[GJC]

Marciano made 182 without dehydration so if James Toney whom had higher fat percentages which make dehydration harder could lose 16 lbs from 183 to make 168 , then Marciano could have made 175 from the 182 he had , very simple.

Maurice Blocker was tall so we put 40 lbs on him and call him potentially a HW?
Also Duran was one of the greatest if not the greatest LW of all time. He beat one of the great WW of all time. So that therefore makes him one of the greatest light welters of all time? Only problem was he didn't fight at that weight.

Maybe it should have been 1934-1957 or something.

Still wouldn't get Fox, Lesnevich and Maxim rated above Bivins IMO.

Joey Maxim was stopped only once in his career , despite facing tremendous opposition himself , I assume you are familiar with his achievements , but maybe you should remind them.

Maxim was a good fighter, didn't say he wasn't and I'm more aware of his achievements than you are How good his chin was isn't the be all and end all of how good a fighter was or else Chuvalo and McCall would be rated higher.

[frankenfrank]

Incorrect. No one seems to agree with you. I wonder why.

What incorrect ? Did you see Jones-Toney ? keep disagreeing , i don't care.

[frankenfrank]

Maurice Blocker was tall so we put 40 lbs on him and call him potentially a HW?
Also Duran was one of the greatest if not the greatest LW of all time. He beat one of the great WW of all time. So that therefore makes him one of the greatest light welters of all time? Only problem was he didn't fight at that weight.

Maurice blocker should be rated where he fought because he weighed as he weighed and it is the reason why he doesn't belong at higher weights.
The same for Marciano : he weighed less than many LHWs weigh in the ring , so he could definitely make 175 , he just didn't have to because almost every fighter in the elite of the HW division of his time was about his size , they were lightheavies whom refused to make the 175 limit because they could fight each other at their most comfortable weight.
and regarding duran :exactly. Duran is one of the greatest LWWs.

Still wouldn't get Fox, Lesnevich and Maxim rated above Bivins IMO.

I might change my opinion about this.

Maxim was a good fighter, didn't say he wasn't and I'm more aware of his achievements than you are How good his chin was isn't the be all and end all of how good a fighter was or else Chuvalo and McCall would be rated higher.

McCall is extremely underrated. He wasn't a brilliant fighter. good. the same works for Louis , Liston and Holyfield . Look at how many former and past "champions" McCall beat. look at how many he faced.
McCall is a top10 all time HW like it or not , so is Tua.
Chuvalo however was stopped twice although on his feet . he was helpless , McCall got to this situation only when he had rehabilitation problems which should have canceled the fight in the first place.

[wmute]

What incorrect ? Did you see Jones-Toney ? keep disagreeing , i don't care.

I have seen fighters gain more weight than that overnight... cazares, guzman, mayorga, and the list goes on.

That does not change the fact that, unlike all the guys we mentioned Marciano weighed in on FIGHT NIGHT.

[frankenfrank]

I have seen fighters gain more weight than that overnight... cazares, guzman, mayorga, and the list goes on.

That does not change the fact that, unlike all the guys we mentioned Marciano weighed in on FIGHT NIGHT.

And James Toney weighed in on fight night at 183.
Marciano never tried to make 175 , which was my point , had he tried , he would have made it , he wouldn't have even had to lose all the 7lbs through dehydration , he could have lost at least 5 through dieting , 175 was easy for him.

[wmute]

And James Toney weighed in on fight night at 183.
Marciano never tried to make 175 , which was my point , had he tried , he would have made it , he wouldn't have even had to lose all the 7lbs through dehydration , he could have lost at least 5 through dieting , 175 was easy for him.

Go on showing your ignorance of bosing in general, and Marciano in particular...

Prime Marciano weighed in at 185.

His training regime (No weights...) indicates it would be very hard for him to shed more weight.

His fighting style (15 rounds of constant pressure) would make it a horrible idea to dehydrate himself.

He could have made 175 in our days (12 round fights, same day weigh in), but he could not in his days. And in fact he never did. Hence he is *not* a lhw.

Keeping on repeating that Toney once lost 15 lbs 30 hours before a fight in which he looked like ****, is not a very good argument to convince anyone that Marciano could lose 10lbs in 6 hours, and be a succeful fighter.