Ranking of the 1940-1960 lightheavyweights

[frankenfrank]

Go on showing your ignorance of bosing in general, and Marciano in particular...

Prime Marciano weighed in at 185.

His training regime (No weights...) indicates it would be very hard for him to shed more weight.

His fighting style (15 rounds of constant pressure) would make it a horrible idea to dehydrate himself.

As I said , he wouldn't have had to dehydrate much if any.

He could have made 175 in our days (12 round fights, same day weigh in), but he could not in his days. And in fact he never did. Hence he is *not* a lhw.

Keeping on repeating that Toney once lost 15 lbs 30 hours before a fight in which he looked like ****, is not a very good argument to convince anyone that Marciano could lose 10lbs in 6 hours, and be a succeful fighter.

Toney lost 16 for that fight , but Marciano would have to lose a mere 8 , we are discussing 175 and not 168 , and you can add the fact that Marciano never tried to trim fats , which he would not have even to lose very much .
7-8 lbs is very doable , even for Marciano's time.
Archie Moore was a bigger man than Marciano and was a LHW.

[wmute]

As I said , he wouldn't have had to dehydrate much if any.

Toney lost 16 for that fight , but Marciano would have to lose a mere 8 , we are discussing 175 and not 168 , and you can add the fact that Marciano never tried to trim fats , which he would not have even to lose very much .
7-8 lbs is very doable , even for Marciano's time.
Archie Moore was a bigger man than Marciano and was a LHW.

1) Prime Marciano did not weigh 182-183. He weight 184.5-189. That's not losing 7-8 lbs. that's losing 9.5 to 14lbs.

2) toney looked like **** because of dehydration, and he certainly was not a great fighter in that fight. So why would you bring him as an example of how great a dehydrated Marciano could have been?

3) name me ONE fighter who fought 15 rounds at marciano's pace who rehydrated 10 lbs in the same day weigh in era (about 6 hours), than you have an argument, otherwise shut up.

[frankenfrank]

1) Prime Marciano did not weigh 182-183. He weight 184.5-189. That's not losing 7-8 lbs. that's losing 9.5 to 14lbs.

192.5 was Marciano's highest ever weight , 178 was his lowest . bigger men than him fought at LHW , Bobo Olson cut lots of weight to make 160 , we are speaking of making 175 here not 160 .

2) toney looked like **** because of dehydration, and he certainly was not a great fighter in that fight. So why would you bring him as an example of how great a dehydrated Marciano could have been?

Because Marciano would not have had to lose as much as Toney did , and you said yourself you know of examples of fighters who lost even more than Toney did , and I am speaking of losing less than Toney did .

3) name me ONE fighter who fought 15 rounds at marciano's pace who rehydrated 10 lbs in the same day weigh in era (about 6 hours), than you have an argument, otherwise shut up.

I said Marciano would not have to lose all the over 175 excess through dehydration , in fact he could have lost the most of it without dehydration through simple dieting .

[wmute]

192.5 was Marciano's highest ever weight , 178 was his lowest . bigger men than him fought at LHW , Bobo Olson cut lots of weight to make 160 , we are speaking of making 175 here not 160 .

Like I said prime marciano's weight is above 184.

Because Marciano would not have had to lose as much as Toney did , and you said yourself you know of examples of fighters who lost even more than Toney did , and I am speaking of losing less than Toney did .

Toney and the others I mentioned had 30 THIRTY hrs to gain that weight, and then proceed to looking like **** in the ring. In your dreams Marciano would have 6 hrs to gain his weight back, and proceed to be the best LHW of his era.

I said Marciano would not have to lose all the over 175 excess through dehydration , in fact he could have lost the most of it without dehydration through simple dieting .

OOOOHHHHHH, we have a training guru here... So tell us how would Marciano proceed to cut his weight to be able to fight at 175.

Better come up with some more precise argument than "simple dieting" (ludicrous, considering his body was already around 5% fat.)

The burden of proof is on you, not me.

It seems obvious to everyone else that Marciano was not a LHW, and in fact he never fought at LHW.

You claim he could make 175, despite being unable to provide examples (Olson is not a good example, as he stopped winning fights at 160 already, and shortly afterwards was unable to make weight, all of this before turning 30...), and it's obvious why you cannot find them, because there are not any.

[frankenfrank]

Like I said prime marciano's weight is above 184.



Toney and the others I mentioned had 30 THIRTY hrs to gain that weight, and then proceed to looking like **** in the ring. In your dreams Marciano would have 6 hrs to gain his weight back, and proceed to be the best LHW of his era.



OOOOHHHHHH, we have a training guru here... So tell us how would Marciano proceed to cut his weight to be able to fight at 175.

Better come up with some more precise argument than "simple dieting" (ludicrous, considering his body was already around 5% fat.)

The burden of proof is on you, not me.

It seems obvious to everyone else that Marciano was not a LHW, and in fact he never fought at LHW.

You claim he could make 175, despite being unable to provide examples (Olson is not a good example, as he stopped winning fights at 160 already, and shortly afterwards was unable to make weight, all of this before turning 30...), and it's obvious why you cannot find them, because there are not any.

What's so hard to understand ? Marciano just like Charles , was a LHW who wanted and could afford himself the luxury of fighting almost at his everyday weight because the rest of the top of his division were his size and actually Moore whom was a LHW was bigger than him.
Marciano would not have needed even Moore's techniques of making weight . Marciano did not have to diet b/c he didn't want to make 175 anyway. he could have weighed 175 even without dehydration at all.
he actually weighed 178 for one of his fights , and it was without dieting at all , Marciano could have either weigh in below 175 through dieting , or weigh some 178 and lose the 3lbs via dehydration and then gain them comfortably in the 6 hours , no problem , he just did not need to because Charles was his size and Moore was somewhat bigger.

[wmute]

What's so hard to understand ? Marciano just like Charles , was a LHW who wanted and could afford himself the luxury of fighting almost at his everyday weight because the rest of the top of his division were his size and actually Moore whom was a LHW was bigger than him.
Marciano would not have needed even Moore's techniques of making weight . Marciano did not have to diet b/c he didn't want to make 175 anyway. he could have weighed 175 even without dehydration at all.
he actually weighed 178 for one of his fights , and it was without dieting at all , Marciano could have either weigh in below 175 through dieting , or weigh some 178 and lose the 3lbs via dehydration and then gain them comfortably in the 6 hours , no problem , he just did not need to because Charles was his size and Moore was somewhat bigger.

Thanks for digging your own grave.


1) At the age in which Marciano was able to make weights below 180, Charles was able to make weights below 170. Guess what's the difference between the two? Charles was a LHW in his prime, Marciano was not.

2) You talk about Marciano being the best at 175... Then it better be the prime Marciano, who is able to make the weight. Prime Marciano weighs 184 and above, not 178.

What's so hard to understand? Marciano was not a lightheavy. Maybe in his early years as a pro he could have made 175, the same way Charles made 160. Just like Charles could not have been a career middleweight, Marciano could never have been a career lightheavyweight.

[frankenfrank]

Thanks for digging your own grave.


1) At the age in which Marciano was able to make weights below 180, Charles was able to make weights below 170. Guess what's the difference between the two? Charles was a LHW in his prime, Marciano was not.

2) You talk about Marciano being the best at 175... Then it better be the prime Marciano, who is able to make the weight. Prime Marciano weighs 184 and above, not 178.

What's so hard to understand? Marciano was not a lightheavy. Maybe in his early years as a pro he could have made 175, the same way Charles made 160. Just like Charles could not have been a career middleweight, Marciano could never have been a career lightheavyweight.

Moore was more massive than both of them and guess what ? he is considered a top 5 at 175 by many , and he really could not have been a career LHW , unlike Marciano.

[wmute]

Moore was more massive than both of them and guess what ? he is considered a top 5 at 175 by many , and he really could not have been a career LHW , unlike Marciano.

Moore, like Charles, WAS a career LHW. In fact he was able to make weight in his 40s. Marciano was NOT.

Moore, like Charles, was weighing in below 170 in his 20s.

Do you realize that Marciano was fighting at HW already in the few amateur fights he had?

[frankenfrank]

Moore, like Charles, WAS a career LHW. In fact he was able to make weight in his 40s. Marciano was NOT.

Moore, like Charles, was weighing in below 170 in his 20s.

Do you realize that Marciano was fighting at HW already in the few amateur fights he had?

And Frazier weighed 260 as an amateur or a teenager , so what ?
And you're right , Moore weighed in 175 for his LHW title defenses , so it just enforces my claim Marciano could have made 175 , because whenever Moore fought at HW through all his LHW title reign , he actually weighed in more than Marciano did for his HW fights , which just explains why Marciano could have made 175 easier than Moore did. Marciano had less weight to lose than Moore had , and Moore was able to make it , so what does it show ?

[wmute]

And Frazier weighed 260 as an amateur or a teenager , so what ?
And you're right , Moore weighed in 175 for his LHW title defenses , so it just enforces my claim Marciano could have made 175 , because whenever Moore fought at HW through all his LHW title reign , he actually weighed in more than Marciano did for his HW fights , which just explains why Marciano could have made 175 easier than Moore did. Marciano had less weight to lose than Moore had , and Moore was able to make it , so what does it show ?

Moore and Charles weighed all the way from 160 to 200. Marciano between 180 and 190. It shows Moore and Charles were able to fight at those weights, not that Marciano could.

In fact, Marciano was not making 175 as an amateur, when he fought 3-4 rounds. Imagine the chances of him making 175 when he weighed 185-190 after training for 15 rounds...

I am out of here, you can keep your opinion, I will stick to facts.