Jack Dempsey or Harry Greb?

[mickey malone]

yes i agree that Greb could well go the distance with Dempsey..

Holmes in no way replicates Gene Tunney, it is my opinion that Holmes was a far greater fighter when fighting flat-footed than he was on his toes trying to imitate Muhammad Ali, Holmes often got levelled when on his toes (Tyson Shavers).. Dempsey would swarm all over Holmes and knock him out similar to his 4th round against Tyson yet more brutal and devastating.

here is a piece from boxing historian Eric Jorgenson:

With respect to Dempsey, there is an additional "biasing factor" relating to films. The film clip most people see is the second half of his first round against Jess Willard, when Dempsey had Willard reeling around the ring and ready to go. Yes, he looks wild, perhaps even "crude", as The Ring's editor-n-chief Nigel Collins contends, but pretty much every fighter looks that way in such circumstances. Anyone troubling himself to view the second and third rounds of that fight, when Dempsey was catching his breath after his premature victory celebration following his apparent 1-round win had left him a bit winded, would have to concede that Dempsey appears highly skillful
bouncing nimbly beyond Willard's reach, deftly slipping punches, etc.

In fact, Dempsey was an extremely skilled and versatile fighter all around, more along the lines of a heavyweight Roberto Duran than a prehistoric version of Marciano and Frazier (as many today seem to believe). He had the same granite jaw, remarkable stamina, and indomitable will that Marciano and Frazier had, but was quicker, a much better boxer, and, consequently, much harder to hit than either one of them. Also, he neither cut like Marciano nor swelled like Frazier. Finally, whereas Marciano and Frazier tended to wear their opponents down over the course of a fight, Dempsey had one-punch power in both hands (indeed, he was one of the very few fighters in heavyweight history who hit equally hard from each side). He demolished big, modern-sized heavyweights (Willard, Carl Morris, Fred Fulton, and Luis Firpo, among others) in record time. And, whatever their merits as overall fighters (and I submit that they have been underappreciated by boxing historians), those fighters were tough and strong, and these fights demonstrate that Dempsey's power would have proven effective against today's heavyweights. Dempsey possessed an extraordinary combination of skills which allowed him to handle any style he encountered.

But he couldn't handle the styles of Tunney and Meehan, and for Jorgenson not to even mention that, he must be a 'nuthugger'

Have you got any of Meehan's fights?

[sonnyboyx2]

But he couldn't handle the styles of Tunney and Meehan, and for Jorgenson not to even mention that, he must be a 'nuthugger'

Have you got any of Meehan's fights?

no i have nothing of Willie Meehan on film

[StarshipTrooper]

But he couldn't handle the styles of Tunney and Meehan, and for Jorgenson not to even mention that, he must be a 'nuthugger'

Have you got any of Meehan's fights?

In fairness though Dempsey was past it AND inactive when he faced Tunney. Too busy living the Hollywood life at that point.

Poet

[mickey malone]

In fairness though Dempsey was past it AND inactive when he faced Tunney. Too busy living the Hollywood life at that point.

Poet

He was 32 and past it?... Is there any footage of Meehan?
Dempsey was about 25 when he lost to him and had struggled to draw twice and outpoint him once in 3 previous meetings, so Meehan must have had something.

[sonnyboyx2]

He was 32 and past it?... Is there any footage of Meehan?
Dempsey was about 25 when he lost to him and had struggled to draw twice and outpoint him once in 3 previous meetings, so Meehan must have had something.

Meehan was a bum who resembled Tony Galento, he was nicknamed `Fat Boy` he never done any training whatsoever and fought from lightweight up to heavyweight as he got fatter and heavier

check him out on Harry Greb`s website

[boxing boy]

On my all-time p4p list i rank Harry Greb #2 only behind SRR.

Greb over Dempsey anyday of the week and twice on Sunday.

[Jim Jeffries]

He was 32 and past it?... Is there any footage of Meehan?
Dempsey was about 25 when he lost to him and had struggled to draw twice and outpoint him once in 3 previous meetings, so Meehan must have had something.

I think the over 3 years of inactivity hurt him more than his age.

But I can name a ton of fighters that were shot or on the decline before their 30th birthday. Fernando Vargas, Juan Diaz, Jermain Taylor, Kelly Pavlik, Wilfred Benitez, Ricky Hatton, Ruslan Chagaev, Mike Tyson, etc.

Greb's the better fighter though, much better resume, and even though he was a MW, had a fair number of opponents in common with Dempsey, who should have fought him.

[louis54]

greb may have been the best middle ever. dempsey may have been the best havyweight ever. p4p i guess greb, but not by too much as dempsey didnt weigh much more. if greb fought dempsey, i doubt hed go too far abit like carentier, if he lasted hed be well beaten up.

[sonnyboyx2]

In fairness though Dempsey was past it AND inactive when he faced Tunney. Too busy living the Hollywood life at that point.

Poet

well said poet.. we will never know just how great Dempsey was or could have been

[mickey malone]

Meehan was a bum who resembled Tony Galento, he was nicknamed `Fat Boy` he never done any training whatsoever and fought from lightweight up to heavyweight as he got fatter and heavier

check him out on Harry Greb`s website

Yes, I just took a look at him, and he is a dead ringer for Galento..

Ok, Dempsey had quite a few draws and 6 defeats, most of which he avenged in brutal fashion, but the 1918 loss, sticks out like a sore thumb.. Only 2 months prior to this defeat, Dempsey had destroyed Fred Fulton in less than a round, and then 2 months after losing to Meehan, blitzed Battling Levinski in 3 which if Meehan was a bum, doesn't make a shred of sense.. All in all, Dempsey fought 20 rounds against this guy, and may have won 8 of them if he was lucky. How on earth could this have happened?