Better middleweight - Hagler or Hopkins?

[them_apples]

I used to pick Hopkins but i'm leaning towards Hagler these days.

Hagler had a ton of skill that nobody even sees at first glance.


h2h im not sure who wins, could go either way. Considering WW gave Hopkins the trouble he did, I expect fellow southpaw Hagler to do much better. I know Hopkins apparently does well against SP's, but I think it's more that he does better than other orthodox fighters.

[Silencers]

Hagler to me.

[Obama]

Hagler.

I actually think it can go either way H2H, as both of them are two of the most well-rounded fighters you'll find, but Hagler has the superior resume at middleweight, particularly with his pre-title opposition.

Back when the B level Philadelphia Boys took him to school? Hopkins on the other hand happens to be an A level Philadelphia fighter.

Anyways, their resumes are pretty tight if you ask me. I already got a MW resume drawn out for Hopkins, someone match it up with Hagler's best opponents:

Dennis Milton
Lupe Aquino (Post-Prime)
Action Jackson (Over the hill)
Glen Johnson [Undefeated]
Simon Brown (Over the hill)
Robert Allen x2
Antwun Echols x2
Keith Holmes
Felix Trinidad [Undefeated]
Carl Daniels
William Joppy
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman

15 MW wins against credible opposition, no defeats between the first and last. Hagler's win over Hearns sits on top of Trinidad, but 1 fight doesn't represent a man's full resume.

[Squabbles94806]

I think Hagler might have been a little better. Particularly his style. I think Marvin was way stronger than Hopkins. He just looked tough. Hopkins is tough too, but i just don't think he's rougher than Hagler.

[Obama]

I think Hagler might have been a little better. Particularly his style. I think Marvin was way stronger than Hopkins. He just looked tough. Hopkins is tough too, but i just don't think he's rougher than Hagler.

He isn't, but he's a hell of a lot smarter. If you talk to fighters about how much of boxing is mental, they always give you a number over 50%. So I'd say Hopkins being the more cerebral of the two is a more important factor to look at.

[StarshipTrooper]

Dennis Milton
Lupe Aquino (Post-Prime)
Action Jackson (Over the hill)
Glen Johnson [Undefeated]
Simon Brown (Over the hill)
Robert Allen x2
Antwun Echols x2
Keith Holmes
Felix Trinidad [Undefeated]
Carl Daniels
William Joppy
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman

Tommy Hearns is better than that entire list COMBINED.

PS. You forgot to mention that De La Hoya was pretty much washed up when Hopkins fought him.

Poet

[Obama]

Tommy Hearns is better than that entire list COMBINED.

PS. You forgot to mention that De La Hoya was pretty much washed up when Hopkins fought him.

Poet

No...just not how things work. Hearns isn't above being capable of losing to guys on that list, he did lose to Iran Barkley twice after all. You could claim Hearns worth is 2 Barkleys, but no more than that.

And DLH was in his prime, just not at his best weight. The Sturm fight cannot be used to gauge where he was in his career. He was over weight and took Sturm lightly. Prior to the Sturm fight he fought Mosley and most people thought he won. So clearly he was at a good weight for Mosley, and only weighed in 1 lb heavier against Hopkins.

DLH didn't become a part time fighter until after Hopkins beat him.

[Stoppage]

No...just not how things work. Hearns isn't above being capable of losing to guys on that list, he did lose to Iran Barkley twice after all. You could claim Hearns worth is 2 Barkleys, but no more than that.

And DLH was in his prime, just not at his best weight. The Sturm fight cannot be used to gauge where he was in his career. He was over weight and took Sturm lightly. Prior to the Sturm fight he fought Mosley and most people thought he won. So clearly he was at a good weight for Mosley, and only weighed in 1 lb heavier against Hopkins.

DLH didn't become a part time fighter until after Hopkins beat him.

I agree about the first thing you said. The second, kinda.

I'd compare the DLH win to Hagler's win of Duran. Both came from around the same weight class (SFW/LW) to challenge for the title. So it wasn't their natural fighting weight.

I'd compare the Hearns win to Trinidad.

[StarshipTrooper]

No...just not how things work. Hearns isn't above being capable of losing to guys on that list, he did lose to Iran Barkley twice after all. You could claim Hearns worth is 2 Barkleys, but no more than that.

And DLH was in his prime, just not at his best weight. The Sturm fight cannot be used to gauge where he was in his career. He was over weight and took Sturm lightly. Prior to the Sturm fight he fought Mosley and most people thought he won. So clearly he was at a good weight for Mosley, and only weighed in 1 lb heavier against Hopkins.

DLH didn't become a part time fighter until after Hopkins beat him.

Yeah right. De La Hoya fought all of TWICE in 2004 (apparently fighting twice in a year instead of once makes a fighter not part-time)and hadn't been considered "in prime" since 2000-2002. This is like claiming Lewis beat a prime Holyfield

Poet

[TheGreatA]

Back when the B level Philadelphia Boys took him to school? Hopkins on the other hand happens to be an A level Philadelphia fighter.

Anyways, their resumes are pretty tight if you ask me. I already got a MW resume drawn out for Hopkins, someone match it up with Hagler's best opponents:

Dennis Milton
Lupe Aquino (Post-Prime)
Action Jackson (Over the hill)
Glen Johnson [Undefeated]
Simon Brown (Over the hill)
Robert Allen x2
Antwun Echols x2
Keith Holmes
Felix Trinidad [Undefeated]
Carl Daniels
William Joppy
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman

15 MW wins against credible opposition, no defeats between the first and last. Hagler's win over Hearns sits on top of Trinidad, but 1 fight doesn't represent a man's full resume.

I wouldn't say Hagler was taken to school. The only Philadelphia fighter that can truly claim a win over Hagler is Willie Monroe and he did get crushed in two rematches.

Hagler's MW record:

Thomas Hearns
Roberto Duran
John Mugabi (undefeated)
Alan Minter
Vito Antuofermo
Mustafa Hamsho x2
Juan Roldan
Bennie Briscoe (over the hill)
Tony Sibson
Fully Obel (undefeated) x2
Mike Colbert (undefeated)
Wilford Scypion
Eugene Hart
Sugar Ray Seales (undefeated) x2
Loucif Hamani
Willie Monroe x2
Bobby Watts
Kevin Finnegan