Yet another way to Understand the Lineal

[billeau2]

I want to show how the Lineal can exist while being implicit and not explicit. This will answer the question: "Why aren't people screaming from the rooftops regarding the Lineal if it exists?

Contracts are often implicit. No contract can exist with no "consideration", something of value to exchange for the goods and/or ,services offered in a contract. You do not sign a contract when a plumber comes over... It is "Implicit" understood that you will pay a fee for your pipes being fixed. Nobody has to make it explicit right?

Cus Amato allegedlly told Mike Tyson that "A Boxing Ring is the only place homicide is legal." As citizens of America, with inalienable rights, we cannot simply construct a magical boxing ring and declare homicide legal... Just as we do not have to make explicit our rights when we exorscize them, an actual boxing match has obligations that go along with the right to suspend what would otherwise be a capitol offense against another citizen. Again, imagine you have an argument with a neighbor and both of you decide to construct a ring and claim you were "boxing" if anyone dies... How far would that get you in a court of law?

Boxing comes from Duels and THIS IS KEY to understanding the lineal: Duels had implicit rules to be followed. Nobody had to tell participants, you cannot ambush your opponent the night before the duel, you cannot show emotional outbursts, you cannot dress like a tramp, you cannot use a weapon that gives you an unfair advantage... etc, etc. Nobody would claim that these rules did not exist because they were not stated! On the contrary, the rules that were stated were just an adjunct, made to ultimately reinforce that which was implicit.

A duel was, a social contract. Citizens all enter into such a contract, which is alas, implicit as well. In return for the roads, policing power of government, I pay taxes and act accordingly... If I lose my life in a duel, my status is never the less retained due to the implicit purpose of the duel...

Boxing as understood in the West came from this social tradition. The difference was, it came to be understood that a fighter was essentially a stand in, a champion representing the people who supported him. No boxers ever were allowed to step in a boxing ring with the express purpose of killing another man. Homicide, as a consequence was purely allowed as part of a contract....at least eventually when boxing was allowed as a sport.

Boxers were competing for Titles. Titles are status, they only retain their power, in so far as they are recognized by others! Isn't this why we lampoon fools like Charlie Z? Who created his own title, Belt? The truth is: These belts mean nothing without a contract with some group that recognizes the Titles. We call this group "boxing fans."

The Lineal is, in a sense, a social contract that permits a man to literally kill another, provided he enters into an implicit contract, a social contract recognized by the state as legitimate. The other part of this contract is the reason for the fighter's activity. A fighter does not go into the ring for blood lust, rather there is a mutual respect for fellow fighters, and it is understood that the fight is for glory... Glory as our own Marchegiano has researched, comes form Greek ideals related to the Olympics... Fans are absolutely necessary to recognize Glory, because without fans there can be no Glory.

Boxing replaced a system where maintaining status, the original ideal behind duels, was replaced by fighting for the aprobation of the public, the fans. And it has always been IMPLICIT that the consideration (contract) in a boxing match was a chance to fight to be the best as recognized by? Those bestowing glory upon the fighters.

The lineal is the social contract that is always in force. It provides consideration, a service, and a process to determine to whom the winnings go.

Finally: Why is the lineal not cited? If I get pulled over for a traffic stop and a cop is polite, I have no reason to cite my rights. I know some i d i o t s behave otherwise... But a normal intelligent person, when a cop is not violating a right, generally do not preface the social contract governing police power and citizens... Does not mean the contract is not in force now does it? The lineal only needs to be explicit at times when it is violated, or needs to be interpreted. The lineal alone obligated that, at least in the Heavyweight division, there be an undisputed champion at some point, who got there beating the best contender. And the basis for this authority is our implicit contract as fans, with the fighters who compete for our approval.

[Coverdale]

Great post, unfortunately some people are incapable of accepting abstract arguments.

[billeau2]

Great post, unfortunately some people are incapable of accepting abstract arguments.

That is true and ok... I hope everyone strives to be knowlegable and compassionate. After all, before the term was coopted for political warfare, a ******* was a well educated, compassionate individual.

[billeau2]

Intersting aside and example: I studied Confucian Chinese Ethics and the whole idea behind language and ritual in Confucian Chinese terms is our innate ability to learn. When we respond with a series of gestures, like a handshake, handing a glass of beer down a line in a ballpark and knowing the money for the beer will be delivered down that same line to pay for that beer, these actions cannot really be learned, or taught... They have to be internalized because they are so many components to these actions it would be impossible to teach them all. Same with language, it cannot be taught from the environment because the actual rules of grammer are substantial. A child is born understanding syntax and language structure.

In a ballpark, even a thief would not take the money, or the beer because they understand they are part of a set of actions that demand a proper response (pass the money and beer down the line), that is part of human nature.

So when we discuss the implicit aspects of status and how the lineal achieves such, in many respects it is not natural to deconstruct such a process. Human nature is such we want glory and status. The lineal merely describes what that status looks like and how it is to be attained.

[Marchegiano]

Approved but I won't have time to type much until tomorrow.

[billeau2]

This is my final effort. People are alas entitled to believe what they wish. I do think it is important we know why things exist... Or if they are in fact a mere chimera.

So here is a little ditty: The Catholic Priest asked the Aboriginal about Heaven and God and the Lineal title... The Priest said "My champion is the man who beats the best, thus he becomes the best boxer! My God gives us eternal life in heaven! What does your champion and your God do?

The Aboriginal, we will call him kafkod smiled and said "Wow! let me meet your God and champion! what a magnificent group they must be!" The Priest thinking for a moment said "Wellll you really cannot see my God any more than you can see the belt on my Lineal champ... But he is there!" To which the Aboriginal then pointed in two directions and said "You see all those boxers flailing about? they all have a clan and are clan champions! we do not even have contenders we are all so good!" The priest shook his head in approval for this fine group of champions! after all who needed to beat the best anyway with so many champs? The second place the Aboriginal pointed was over the hills wence he said "And as for my God? I can tell you with absolute certainty he will rise in the East in exactly two hours, and set in the West at an exact time as well!"

And so it was established that only that which is explicit can be said to exist. Belts, Sashes... Governing bodies. And alas the sun and the moon is what we can know...

[kafkod]

I want to show how the Lineal can exist while being implicit and not explicit. This will answer the question: "Why aren't people screaming from the rooftops regarding the Lineal if it exists?

Contracts are often implicit. No contract can exist with no "consideration", something of value to exchange for the goods and/or ,services offered in a contract. You do not sign a contract when a plumber comes over... It is "Implicit" understood that you will pay a fee for your pipes being fixed. Nobody has to make it explicit right?

Cus Amato allegedlly told Mike Tyson that "A Boxing Ring is the only place homicide is legal." As citizens of America, with inalienable rights, we cannot simply construct a magical boxing ring and declare homicide legal... Just as we do not have to make explicit our rights when we exorscize them, an actual boxing match has obligations that go along with the right to suspend what would otherwise be a capitol offense against another citizen. Again, imagine you have an argument with a neighbor and both of you decide to construct a ring and claim you were "boxing" if anyone dies... How far would that get you in a court of law?

Boxing comes from Duels and THIS IS KEY to understanding the lineal: Duels had implicit rules to be followed. Nobody had to tell participants, you cannot ambush your opponent the night before the duel, you cannot show emotional outbursts, you cannot dress like a tramp, you cannot use a weapon that gives you an unfair advantage... etc, etc. Nobody would claim that these rules did not exist because they were not stated! On the contrary, the rules that were stated were just an adjunct, made to ultimately reinforce that which was implicit.

A duel was, a social contract. Citizens all enter into such a contract, which is alas, implicit as well. In return for the roads, policing power of government, I pay taxes and act accordingly... If I lose my life in a duel, my status is never the less retained due to the implicit purpose of the duel...

Boxing as understood in the West came from this social tradition. The difference was, it came to be understood that a fighter was essentially a stand in, a champion representing the people who supported him. No boxers ever were allowed to step in a boxing ring with the express purpose of killing another man. Homicide, as a consequence was purely allowed as part of a contract....at least eventually when boxing was allowed as a sport.

Boxers were competing for Titles. Titles are status, they only retain their power, in so far as they are recognized by others! Isn't this why we lampoon fools like Charlie Z? Who created his own title, Belt? The truth is: These belts mean nothing without a contract with some group that recognizes the Titles. We call this group "boxing fans."

The Lineal is, in a sense, a social contract that permits a man to literally kill another, provided he enters into an implicit contract, a social contract recognized by the state as legitimate. The other part of this contract is the reason for the fighter's activity. A fighter does not go into the ring for blood lust, rather there is a mutual respect for fellow fighters, and it is understood that the fight is for glory... Glory as our own Marchegiano has researched, comes form Greek ideals related to the Olympics... Fans are absolutely necessary to recognize Glory, because without fans there can be no Glory.

Boxing replaced a system where maintaining status, the original ideal behind duels, was replaced by fighting for the aprobation of the public, the fans. And it has always been IMPLICIT that the consideration (contract) in a boxing match was a chance to fight to be the best as recognized by? Those bestowing glory upon the fighters.

The lineal is the social contract that is always in force. It provides consideration, a service, and a process to determine to whom the winnings go.

Finally: Why is the lineal not cited? If I get pulled over for a traffic stop and a cop is polite, I have no reason to cite my rights. I know some i d i o t s behave otherwise... But a normal intelligent person, when a cop is not violating a right, generally do not preface the social contract governing police power and citizens... Does not mean the contract is not in force now does it? The lineal only needs to be explicit at times when it is violated, or needs to be interpreted. The lineal alone obligated that, at least in the Heavyweight division, there be an undisputed champion at some point, who got there beating the best contender. And the basis for this authority is our implicit contract as fans, with the fighters who compete for our approval.

You have a talent for writing interesting posts while, at the same time, fundamentally misunderstanding what a lineal champion is supposed to be!

Lineal champions in boxing are not a development of the chivalric honour code which spawned duels.

Duels were fought by aristocrats, military officers and wealthy elites who aspired to the military/chivalric ideal. Those same elites enjoyed watching, staging and betting on fist fights between husky men from the "lower orders" - farm labourers, blacksmiths, etc, and, in the US, black slaves.

Boxing, as we know it today, developed from those prizefights between poor working class whites and black slaves, not from the duels fought by the elites who staged and bet on those prizefights.

[billeau2]

You have a talent for writing interesting posts while, at the same time, fundamentally misunderstanding what a lineal champion is supposed to be!

Lineal champions in boxing are not a development of the chivalric honour code which spawned duels.

Duels were fought by aristocrats, military officers and wealthy elites who aspired to the military/chivalric ideal. Those same elites enjoyed watching, staging and betting on fist fights between husky men from the "lower orders" - farm labourers, blacksmiths, etc, and, in the US, black slaves.

Boxing, as we know it today, developed from those prizefights between poor working class whites and black slaves, not from the duels fought by the elites who staged and bet on those prizefights.

I know your reading comprehension lacks, but if you could read and understand what was written you would notice how I made a solid historical connection to the working class. You embarass yourself when you have such an oversight. It is in the threads and very clearly articulated... Unfortunately for you.

Everything comes from something... Traditions develop... We have no Zoology with no Aristotle, No Einstein with no Ptolemy. Boxing made inroads to the poor through channels and these are described in detail... Don't believe me, don't read my posts, do your own research.