The Physiology of Punch Resistance

[them_apples]

The only thing I feel confident in is that huge heads seem to be able to absorb punches better. I don't know if its shape is important too.

The challenge is to find us a pinhead who can really take a punch. Are there some? I don't think so, but I don't know either. Maybe I would get surprised.

First of all, a large skull is supposed to be thicker. On the other hand, why waste material and make a tiny skull thick.

My conjecture is that modern tiny human skulls are naturally thinner too. This is similar to a mathematical conjecture: you only need to find one counterexample to prove the conjecture wrong.


Please help me find such a pinhead boxer, will you, or prove me wrong?

always thought Holmes had a small head. He could take a shot. His neck was thick though

oliver mcall had an iron beard, his head seemed small and his neck wasn’t that big either

thats it though, its rare

[them_apples]

The only thing I feel confident in is that huge heads seem to be able to absorb punches better. I don't know if its shape is important too.

The challenge is to find us a pinhead who can really take a punch. Are there some? I don't think so, but I don't know either. Maybe I would get surprised.

First of all, a large skull is supposed to be thicker. On the other hand, why waste material and make a tiny skull thick.

My conjecture is that modern tiny human skulls are naturally thinner too. This is similar to a mathematical conjecture: you only need to find one counterexample to prove the conjecture wrong.


Please help me find such a pinhead boxer, will you, or prove me wrong?

Skulls def got thinner. I know kids that get concussions from anything. Tried to box = instant concussion

[Bundana]

Skulls def got thinner. I know kids that get concussions from anything. Tried to box = instant concussion

Do you mean since stone age man - or over the last 100 years?

[them_apples]

Do you mean since stone age man - or over the last 100 years?

Over the past 100 years. Eugenics is a real thing. Already been multiple generations growing up in front of screens doing nothing all day.

the romans used to say the Germanic barbarians across the rhine (the spooky forest germans) grew very large and strong due to living lawlessly and fighting with eachother constantly. Why do you think you can’t just take a cub and domesticate it - it takes multiple generations to get a baby safe animal.

[Bundana]

Over the past 100 years. Eugenics is a real thing. Already been multiple generations growing up in front of screens doing nothing all day.

the romans used to say the Germanic barbarians across the rhine (the spooky forest germans) grew very large and strong due to living lawlessly and fighting with eachother constantly. Why do you think you canât just take a cub and domesticate it - it takes multiple generations to get a baby safe animal.

I'd like to see the actual scientific studies, that you base this on.

[billeau2]

First of all, Bone density is a genetic trait, one that has a lot to do with SIZE, and one that does not always correlate with weight... No one compares a Pitbull's weight regarding its ability to fight with other dogs. Pitbulls are built dense, their actual weight nonwithstanding. I hate dog fighting... just want to make that crystal clear. Marciano weighed light for his fights but his skeletal structure could easily support a weight over 200 pounds, I think when he made the Ali tapes he was walking around at 220? and did not look fat.

Archeologists that studied nutrition used the formation, development and density of the Mandible part of the jawbone. The Scandinavian countries and a few other nations with a primary supply of seafood were the apex of physiological development, followed by meat eaters, dairy eaters, and starting to be comprimised with vegetarian based, primary sourced diets.

Julio Caeser Chavez was once given a skull X-ray where upon the X-ray had problems because of his unusual skull density. As an aside? I once had a leg X-ray back in my martial arts days and was told my leg bone was very dense and the X-ray had to be redone. My point, not touting my wooden leg lol, but bone density is real! James Toney probably has a very thick skull which is a good reason he could fight very big guys.

Traditional Chinese martial arts have many procedures designed to strengthen the bones... Some of these border on unbelievable, like cultivating bone marrow Chi through breath, to effective and emprically validated, like gently creating microfractures in the hands to make them tougher.

My own opinion, we should make a distinction between training muscles like the neck (Sonny Liston!) and the genetic trait of bone density. I do believe we can build bone density but it is not easy, and all the muscle in the world is not a substitute.

[billeau2]

Do you mean since stone age man - or over the last 100 years?

It is important to qualify this because we are talking about two distinct things: HUman physiology in general, which has remained constant with modern humans, and a genetic trait that probably shows itself with considerable variation in different populations.

The variability for this trait is considerable! Growing up, we climbed on metal bars with cement floors, kids did crazy things like fall off swings trying to jump and grab the fence... some kids could take quite a fall, others broke bones fairly easily. My son had a friend, a kid, who had a small fall off a bike and broke her leg... It was a very minor fall.

So within modern human physiology and genetics I think there is quite a range, especially when we add in variables like diet, and genetic traits., this despite no evolutionary processes that changed human physiology.

[kara]

Over the past 100 years. Eugenics is a real thing. Already been multiple generations growing up in front of screens doing nothing all day.

the romans used to say the Germanic barbarians across the rhine (the spooky forest germans) grew very large and strong due to living lawlessly and fighting with eachother constantly. Why do you think you canât just take a cub and domesticate it - it takes multiple generations to get a baby safe animal.

Apples will have me reading stuff tonight

[Slugfester]

I believe Apples meant epigenetics, not eugenics. Doesn't really matter though. No human is evolving more or thicker bones in just a hundred years according to any science. I am waiting for him to say that is not what he meant. Stand by. He does quite well for an autodidact, but never studied genetics at all, I'll bet my house. And he can start a hella thread. But his conjectures are presented as fact and stray into territory where he is blind.

Several people brought up Hagler, and Apples brought up Holmes, which seems to refute my conjecture. As I remember those boys might well have been pinheads. Hearns too, who could not take it.

Because it could be wrong is why something is called a conjecture not a fact. I still don't know if I am wrong, but it is not looking rosy for my conjecture. Thick bone may not usually accompany large heads nor thin bone small noggins.

[billeau2]

I believe Apples meant epigenetics, not eugenics. Doesn't really matter though. No human is evolving more or thicker bones in just a hundred years according to any science. I am waiting for him to say that is not what he meant. Stand by. He does quite well for an autodidact, but never studied genetics at all, I'll bet my house. And he can start a hella thread. But his conjectures are presented as fact and stray into territory where he is blind.

Several people brought up Hagler, and Apples brought up Holmes, which seems to refute my conjecture. As I remember those boys might well have been pinheads. Hearns too, who could not take it.

Because it could be wrong is why something is called a conjecture not a fact. I still don't know if I am wrong, but it is not looking rosy for my conjecture. Thick bone may not usually accompany large heads nor thin bone small noggins.

Of course not. But there is considerable variation for certain human traits. I mean comparing how many people will have different amounts of toe, finger digits, if we consider this a trait that is rarely variated, to something like eye color, it gives us a range. Size, density, and specifically bone density are traits that have considerable variation, there need not be any mechanism for evolution to see the appearance of variation in a population.

If we look at Charles Darwin's Theory of Evolution correctly, first of all: It is apparent that big changes that cause evolutionary jumps take a very long time... But the mechanism for how different traits develop is often poorly understood. The environment never creates a trait: The environment subtracts traits by eliminating the organisms that are produced with certain traits. So, if we have a society of fishermen who have to do dock work... The most successful dock workers will create more offspring, gradually dock workers with less bone density, muscle mass, will no longer be produced. These weaker workers will die out earlier, and not reproduce with the same frequency.