ATG's: Best technical pressure fighter of any era?

[Dynamite Kid]

Watch Chavez give Chap Rosario and merciless beating and you have your answer.

Chavez and Frazier are both extremely intense fighters when it comes to pressure fighting but at least you could actually hurt Joe Frazier, Chavez had a chin of stone.

Joe is probably tougher than Chavez though. I think Chavez had a bit of the bully about him to be honest.

[GJC]

I think Chavez had a bit of the bully about him to be honest.

I think they would call him a flat track bully in cricket, tough guy though seems to get a very mixed press.

[StarshipTrooper]

Watch Chavez give Chap Rosario and merciless beating and you have your answer.

Chavez and Frazier are both extremely intense fighters when it comes to pressure fighting but at least you could actually hurt Joe Frazier, Chavez had a chin of stone.

Joe is probably tougher than Chavez though. I think Chavez had a bit of the bully about him to be honest.

Chavez also turned out to be quite the crybaby too.

Poet

[Dynamite Kid]

I think they would call him a flat track bully in cricket, tough guy though seems to get a very mixed press.

Chavez also turned out to be quite the crybaby too.

Poet

Agree.

I think he is treated unfairly myself but to be honest i dont really care whether he is or not because i still like him.


Thats what i was referring to. Chavez did not know how to lose with grace thats for sure, but then again when you have had as many wins as he has had i dare say you get use to having things go your way, that is where a bit of the bully in him comes from imo, when he could not get his own way he ****** his thumb and threw a wobbler.

I still love watching the guy fight and im still a big fan regardless what other people think of him.

[RightCross94]

Frazier, Duran, Armstrong

[JAB5239]

Duran and Chavez stand out.

Hagler was not a pressure fighter for the great majority of his career.

I was scrolling through this thread waiting to see when JCC's name was going to come up. They're the two best technical pressure fighters thatb I've witnessed. Both were methodical in the way they stalked and broke down their opponents.

[talip bin osman]

I was scrolling through this thread waiting to see when JCC's name was going to come up. They're the two best technical pressure fighters thatb I've witnessed. Both were methodical in the way they stalked and broke down their opponents.

duran is on a level higher IMO...

he is a technically proficient pressure fighter with great offense and a brilliant defensive warrior too...

[Leakbeak]

Well the first fight was ridiculously close with Leonard fighting Duran's game flat footed.

I guess that even if a fully fit Duran came in second time round Leonard would at the very least have changed his style enough to sneek a close decision win in a return.

Duran didn't like movers and I honestly think Leonard would have prevailed by a close margin had he continued with the style he employed for the second fight. Maybe its just me but Duran looked fairly good in the return fight up to round six, he didn't look emaciated and didn't exhibit the usual weight drained, overtrained look that some fighters get. Granted he wasn't quite as good the second time round but Leonard's tactics were much better.

Remember, its not long after the Leonard fights that Duran lost to Benitez and Laing too. Weight cant be blamed for these losses too.

Duran had more great moments in the 80s.........Moore, Hagler and Berkley to name three but for me the 70s was his decade at lightweight.

You forget one thing. Duran MADE Sugar Ray Leonard box his kinda fight. He didn't let him do his fleet footed manouveres. There is times in the fight when he is trying to do just that, but the pressure is too intense and Roberto is working the angles all too well.

[Sugarj]

I dont know. I only watched the fight a few weeks ago, great performance by Duran, but no dancing by Leonard! It wasn't like Duran's pressure was ridiculously intense for all 15 rounds. Even in the rounds that Leonard won there was nothing fleet footed. It was a close fight remember. Leonard was overconfident, couldn't believe a blown up lightweight could be stronger than him. Insults to Leonard's wife probably stoked the fire too. Hell, Duran played Leonard like Van Halen played guitar, clever chap!

I'm no nuthugger, Duran deserved that first fight. I was so impressed with him. But Leonard's comments afterwards that he wanted to fight Duran in a return 'his way' indicated that he knew that he fell into the trap of a brawl with one of the best brawlers of all time (ha ha 'the brawl in Montreal'!). Leonard danced second time round for the vast majority of the fight. He didn't attempt this in the first fight.

If as you say Duran didn't let him do his 'fleet footed' work then I'm suprised it featured so prominently in Leonard's return fight strategy. Or what would Leonard have done, fight the same fight as the first time? Theres a good chance he'd have lost again. Leonard was no fool.

I do agree that Duran's lack of preparation contributed to his performance and retirement in the second fight. But I dont think a well prepared Duran would have been happy boxing a fleet footed Leonard, although I still think it would be another close fight.

[StarshipTrooper]

I dont know. I only watched the fight a few weeks ago, great performance by Duran, but no dancing by Leonard! It wasn't like Duran's pressure was ridiculously intense for all 15 rounds. Even in the rounds that Leonard won there was nothing fleet footed. It was a close fight remember. Leonard was overconfident, couldn't believe a blown up lightweight could be stronger than him. Insults to Leonard's wife probably stoked the fire too. Hell, Duran played Leonard like Van Halen played guitar, clever chap!

I'm no nuthugger, Duran deserved that first fight. I was so impressed with him. But Leonard's comments afterwards that he wanted to fight Duran in a return 'his way' indicated that he knew that he fell into the trap of a brawl with one of the best brawlers of all time (ha ha 'the brawl in Montreal'!). Leonard danced second time round for the vast majority of the fight. He didn't attempt this in the first fight.

If as you say Duran didn't let him do his 'fleet footed' work then I'm suprised it featured so prominently in Leonard's return fight strategy. Or what would Leonard have done, fight the same fight as the first time? Theres a good chance he'd have lost again. Leonard was no fool.

I do agree that Duran's lack of preparation contributed to his performance and retirement in the second fight. But I dont think a well prepared Duran would have been happy boxing a fleet footed Leonard, although I still think it would be another close fight.

As someone who is not particularly fond of Ray Leonard AND as a fan of Duran's I can say with all honesty that I agree with you: It wasn't Duran's pressure that stopped Leonard from fighting his fight. Duran performed a classic mind **** on Ray and had gotten Leonard into a toe-to-toe mindset before the fight even began. Maybe Ray would have gotten the nod if he hadn't fought Duran's fight, maybe he wouldn't. Either way Duran put on one of those special performances where he would have been tough to beat for any Welterweight ATG that night.

Poet