Monzon & Hagler

[SABBATH]

Unfortunately for Roldan his heart was less than his chin.

I re-watched Hagler-Roldan and Roldan took many hard and solid punches throughout the fight and stood up well to Hagler's best shots. A third round thumb to the right eye had Roldan wincing and retreating to the ropes where he didn't actually hit the floor but went down low into the ropes and took a mandatory eight count. After the 9th round and with his eye swollen completely shut, Dr. Romeo asked Roldan if he wanted to continue to which he replied "Si, Si". Anyway a last ditch effort by the exhausted Roldan got him nothing and after a couple of stiff punches by Hagler, Roldan appeared to willingly go down to a sitting position, shook his head 'no' during Tony Perez's count then rose at around 7, walked back to his corner and quit by telling Perez he did not want to continue.

Watching that fight and the number of clean hard punches he took did re-confirm my respect for his chin though.

It was very much unlike the Hearns KO which occurred when Roldan was relatively fresh, still actively throwing bombs and appeared still dangerous (after stunning Hearns moments earlier) before being 10 counted from a very clean and hard right hand power shot which dropped him face-down. I highly doubt Roldan could have gotten up from that shot. Roldan who rolled over onto his back around the 10 second mark was still spread eagled and being attended to while Hearns,his entourage and the usual masses were in the ring celebrating. Unlike the Hagler and Nunn fights, it was more a case of a clean and convicing KO, than a beaten fighter who knew he couldn't win and no longer wanted to engage.

[wmute]

Yogi,

if you ever dig out the burley footage again. I would die to see it

Yogi, Sabbath

thanks for the enlightenment

[hhascup]

Yogi,

if you ever dig out the burley footage again. I would die to see it

Yogi, Sabbath

thanks for the enlightenment

Try this one:

file:///K:/Burley-Smith-1946%5B1%5D.avi

[wmute]

Try this one:

file:///K:/Burley-Smith-1946%5B1%5D.avi

thank you man,

but that would work only if I had a K: hard drive with the file on it!

good k on your way anyway!

[QueensburyRules]

- -Marv a pro for 5 years during the last years of Carlos reign.

Never arrived at that point of a challenge...just saying...

[Willie Pep 229]

Monzon UD 15

Monzon is the Middleweight GOAT -- even over Greb.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Monzon UD 15

Monzon is the Middleweight GOAT -- even over Greb.

Wow!

That's pretty impressive.

Monzon never dared fight anyone bigger than himself, let alone some of the absolute greatest Light Heavyweights of all time. In fact, Monzon looks like the RC Cola answer to Loughran's Classic Coke.

We don't have footage of the Walker-Greb fight, but we have footage of Walker. He's better than anyone Monzon ever fought, and probably better than Monzon himself. While reports indicate it was competitive (maybe Greb's most competitive below Light Heavyweight), Greb clearly won.

Monzon didn't CLEARLY win against Valdez or Griffith.


I'd say the berth between Greb and Monzon is pretty wide. I would actually slip Walker, and possibly Robinson, in between them.

[Willie Pep 229]

Wow!

That's pretty impressive.

Monzon never dared fight anyone bigger than himself, let alone some of the absolute greatest Light Heavyweights of all time. In fact, Monzon looks like the RC Cola answer to Loughran's Classic Coke.

We don't have footage of the Walker-Greb fight, but we have footage of Walker. He's better than anyone Monzon ever fought, and probably better than Monzon himself. While reports indicate it was competitive (maybe Greb's most competitive below Light Heavyweight), Greb clearly won.

Monzon didn't CLEARLY win against Valdez or Griffith.


I'd say the berth between Greb and Monzon is pretty wide. I would actually slip Walker, and possibly Robinson, in between them.

I would be hard pressed to challenge you on Greb and Walker, so I won't, not sure I buy SRR (as a MW) though.

It took SRR literally 60 rounds of fighting to finally show a one round dominance over (a ring worn) LaMotta; I don't see LaMotta in Monzon's league.

Anyway check out this wonderful Greb/Walker story, from a biography on A. Rothstein. Classic Greb!

(Please excuse their typo: 14 rounds ???)

[HOUDINI563]

Untrue concerning Monzon vs Valdez.

I watched both of their bouts live and was a big Valdez fan. I sat there round after round watching Monzon control the bout with his jab and beautiful combinations with little to cheer about aside from singular blows and a flash knockdown that Valdez could not follow up upon. In the end of both fights there was no hope that Valdez would win the decision. I’ve never read of anyone from that time scoring the bouts for Valdez. Can you list all those that did and include their scoring?

[Rusty Tromboni]

Untrue concerning Monzon vs Valdez.

I watched both of their bouts live and was a big Valdez fan. I sat there round after round watching Monzon control the bout with his jab and beautiful combinations with little to cheer about aside from singular blows and a flash knockdown that Valdez could not follow up upon. In the end of both fights there was no hope that Valdez would win the decision. I’ve never read of anyone from that time scoring the bouts for Valdez. Can you list all those that did and include their scoring?

The only scorecards that count are the judges'. They had it as a close fight. You've demonstrated less than normal comprehension abilities, so while you are welcome to share your opinion, don't expect it to be taken too seriously. I would agree, it wasn't as close as the scorecards suggest, and Monzon showed sublime skill and poise. But it was competitive. Clancy himself felt the turning point was when his fighter cut. Walker wasn't that mentally weak, even if he was a much less experienced fighter than Valdez - who was very seasoned, and fighting Monzon a second time.

Forget squabbling over a single adjective. Watch the fight again. Then watch the footage we have of Walker vs. Loughran, you tell me (and HOW) that Monzon beats the guy who stuck to Loughran like gorilla glue. We KNOW that Greb did it.