If Foreman fought a different against Ali, would he have won?

[Abe Attell]

Speed can be offset with a good jab, Foreman didn't fight his fight, he barely used his jab.

[Dockers_ABC]

without the delay and with different tactics,foreman would have mauled him,but ali was one of the best ever and that fight proved it.Anyone who can defy their world class trainers and come up with a strategy to beat a beast like foreman all on their own has something special

[K-DOGG]

thank about it, if he wasn't swinging so much and just box, the way he did against Frazier, could he have beaten Ali. I say yes and no, cause Ali still had some speed even at time, and could outbox Foreman, but Foreman could knockdown if he caught him good, and could've ended in a possible KO for Foreman, but it's not very likely. your thoughts?

Truthfully, I can't see it. Foreman, if he hadn't charged after Ali, would have been boxing with him; and he's not going to win a boxing match with Muhammad. Even if the fight had taken place on the original date, I don't see him winning. Ali was at 206 supposedly the day the fight was supposed to have come off; he was at his dancing weight. And whoever said Foreman would have killed him without the delay probably said he would have killed Ali even with the delay.....everybody but Ali thought Foreman would win because of how he destroyed both Frazier and Norton, two fighters whose styles don't even remotely resemble Ali's. Also, in retrospect, I can say that Foreman couldn't have knocked out Ali because Ali's chin was pure granite.

So, no. If Foreman had fought at a more measured pace the only difference would have been Ali winning by UD over 15 instead of KO in the 8th.

...at least that's my opinion.

[Dockers_ABC]

Truthfully, I can't see it. Foreman, if he hadn't charged after Ali, would have been boxing with him; and he's not going to win a boxing match with Muhammad. Even if the fight had taken place on the original date, I don't see him winning. Ali was at 206 supposedly the day the fight was supposed to have come off; he was at his dancing weight. And whoever said Foreman would have killed him without the delay probably said he would have killed Ali even with the delay.....everybody but Ali thought Foreman would win because of how he destroyed both Frazier and Norton, two fighters whose styles don't even remotely resemble Ali's. Also, in retrospect, I can say that Foreman couldn't have knocked out Ali because Ali's chin was pure granite.

So, no. If Foreman had fought at a more measured pace the only difference would have been Ali winning by UD over 15 instead of KO in the 8th.

...at least that's my opinion.

Ali's chin wasnt that good,foreman was completely thrown off by the fight date being changed,but of coarse thats not the best excuse ever.Foreman was a great boxer,but his style of going out there to kill was exactly what Ali needed,but even HE knew he was in danger of foremans killer digs.I think if foreman had a better strategy he would have a great chance of winning,even in a boxing match.

[SABBATH]

Foreman had the optimum conditions to win the fight. A 16 foot ring with Ali right in front of him, immobile and on the ropes and he couldn't seal the deal.

It's Ali's masterpiece because he used the other guy's strength against him.

[K-DOGG]

Ali's chin wasnt that good,foreman was completely thrown off by the fight date being changed,but of coarse thats not the best excuse ever.Foreman was a great boxer,but his style of going out there to kill was exactly what Ali needed,but even HE knew he was in danger of foremans killer digs.I think if foreman had a better strategy he would have a great chance of winning,even in a boxing match.

1. I completely disagree with your assessment of Ali's chin. He was never knocked out, not even close; and was dropped legitimately three times, two of which happened while he was a kid who bounced on his toes alot and he came back and won those fights. In his third knock-down by Frazier, he was up at the count of two and I can't think of too many man who would have gotten up at all in the 15th round of such a grueling fight after being caught with a punch like that.

2. I see no evidence that Foreman was ever a "great boxer". He did some things very well. He cut off the ring well, he had a good, strong jab, and he had very good power; but that does not make him a "great boxer". He was no where near the league of a Joe Louis or a Gene Tunney or even a curren James Toney. His defense was his offense and many of his punches were amateurish. The only reasons Foreman became such a force in the division was due to his inposing size in the day, his incredible strength, his raw power, and his indomidable will....which was more the tale of his success in his second career. A "Great boxer" he was not.

[Dockers_ABC]

you have to take more than a few punches to have a great chin.Cabbage coreira in ufc for example,has a great chin

Foreman destroyed and put the fear of god into everyone he faced,he outboxed frazier(even though foreman was **** scared of him)he killed norton,and he gave ali all he had.And those are the GOOD fights he had,not all of the guys he murdered within three rounds.And if you honestly believe foreman had never beaten anyone bigger or stronger than him in his MANY fights then you must be smoking something strange.Saying foreman only won because of his strength is like saying ali only won because of his speed.Foreman wasnt the only big guy to go out and try to kill his opponent,but he was the best.WHY?because he was a great boxer

[K-DOGG]

you have to take more than a few punches to have a great chin.Cabbage coreira in ufc for example,has a great chin

Foreman destroyed and put the fear of god into everyone he faced,he outboxed frazier(even though foreman was **** scared of him)he killed norton,and he gave ali all he had.And those are the GOOD fights he had,not all of the guys he murdered within three rounds.And if you honestly believe foreman had never beaten anyone bigger or stronger than him in his MANY fights then you must be smoking something strange.Saying foreman only won because of his strength is like saying ali only won because of his speed.Foreman wasnt the only big guy to go out and try to kill his opponent,but he was the best.WHY?because he was a great boxer

In the 1970's Foreman was an unusually big heavyweight. Now a man at 6'4" 220 is considered small; but at the time Foreman was bigger than those men. And I'm not saying he couldn't box, I'm saying he wasn't a "great boxer". He beat Frazier because Joe was tailor-made for his style. Joe was short and aggressive; he walked right into Foreman's uppercuts, which is George's best punch, IMO. It was a huge upset because of Joe's win over Muhammad and the fact that George hadn't really fought anyone up until that point; but styles make fights. Norton, on the otherhand was what I like to call "an aggressive counter puncher"; he couldn't fight going backwards...and Foreman was pure unadulterated pressure. Now, I will say the Norton fight is probably Foreman at his best; but he was as effective as he was partially because of Norton's style and weaknesses.

And when I say Ali had a great chin, all I have to do to back it up is list some opponents he fought:

1. Sonny Liston: in the 5th round when Ali was blinded, Liston landed some monster hooks and Sonny was a huge puncher.

2. Joe Frazier: the first fight between these two as well as the third are very good examples of Ali's chin whisker strength. Joe's hook was no cupcake and Ali ate plenty.

3. George Foreman: argueably the hardest punching heavyweight champion ever and he nailed Ali several times until his tank ran dry, even putting Ali in "the dream room" as Ali termed it, yet, Ali didn't go down and rallied back.

4. Ron Lyle: while it is true that Ron boxed more in this match than slugged, he did catch Ali from time to time; and it was Lyle who had Foreman, who also has a pretty good chin, just this side of O-U-T one year later.

5. Earnie Shavers: argueably the hardest punching "one-punch puncher" who has ever donned gloves. He fought Ali when Ali was nothing but a shell of who he had once been and no longer had even a hint of elusiveness and took this man's punches all night for 15 rounds.....and was never dropped.


Ali had a great chin.

[Heckler]

Watch that fight over. Whenever Foreman slowed, and tried to pace himself Ali picks him apart. With his capabilities at the time he did exactly what he should of done. He had the qualities of a devestating slugger and he used them accordingly. He drove Ali to the ropes where Ali's ability to excersise his boxing skills are limited and he tried to rip his head off. Foreman did not have the capacity to sucessfully pick his shots, he didn't have that speed and natural sharpness that the likes of Louis and Dempsey had and thus when he did try to pace himself later in his first career against the likes of Jimmy young he looked ****. Saddler trained him in such a way and developed a style that accentuated Foreman's natural physical gifts. Unfortunately Foreman met a man with the correct combination of physical and mental qualities required to defeat him.

If Foreman tried to pace himself pawing out that left jab whilst lumbering forward in a rematch i am certain Ali would rip him to shreds.

[Heckler]

Foreman was NEVER a great boxer. He didn't posess ring generalship, he didn't posess handspeed, he didn't posess that ability to read and dictate a fight like Ali and Holmes could, he didn't have a great sense of timing nor ability to judge range. Trying to BOX Ali would only result in embarassment. He was only sucessful because of his god given power and courage in the ring.