jr2122

Really he wasn't? Were you watching boxing closely during those times? D He may not have been "shot", but his career had definetely peaked already. His hands were not as fast, and therefore his counter-punching and that powerful left hook were not always on target. And mexican fighters are not the biggest fans of defense. So when it came to pacquiao, he had a hard time with his head movement and his punches. But, mainly from a business point of view if you're trying to build a fighter, you're not gonna put him in with a super star in his prime.

ducked williams, cotto, clottey, tsyzu, freitas, margarito ,pacquiao and now , bum ass mathew hatton ummm well, pacman ducked foreman (so in that matter woulda ducked williams, paul wanted to fight him too), mosley, campbell, cassamayor, raheem, marquez for a rematch.. and above all, mayweather j.k clottey is tough competition but too easy for pacquiao's style and as we saw he had a hard time with him, a very good counter-puncher with average power and great defense. Mayweather is a great counter-puncher, above-average power and great defense.

Uhhhh I don't know where you were, But many people thought it was stupid for him to take on Manny Pacquiao at that point in his career, Many well Mostly every reporter in Mexico advised him not to do it. In my hometown where he's from, Mostly everyone thought he was going to lose. Come on man please learn the facts before you try to make it seem as in Erik Morales wasn't already at the end of his career.Yep, morales couldnt even make weight at that point of his career.

You don't hate Pacquiao, hence the thread. lol. If you like Mayweather's boxing skills, as I do, or just boxing in general, then you should make threads about that. It contributes more to the scene. Because, if you don't really care for Pac, love or hate, why the hater thread? Because it makes you feel good to express your hate towards Pac, yeah? Let it out, bro. Just admit it. You can't stand Manny's rise to the P4P rankings and it's eating away at you. You can question a lot of things about his rise to the top, but to generalize it as just plain cherrypicking is foolish. If you examine all other fighters' career, you can almost say that they cherrypicked at one point. But this thread is directed towards your need to feed your hate for Manny Pacquiao and it makes you feel good. That's fine if you believe that he's on PEDs, but c'mon "roiding bastard", that's pure hate, SONNY! Just admit it, people will respect you more. And just to address your hater thread, no, he doesn't get a pass. Especially, when we have posters like you around. Both PBF and PAC get the same love and hate around here, but I can't stand people who have no balls to admit it.Why is it "hating"? last time i checked this was a forum to talk about boxing. Now, im all for an exciting boxing match, so i dont care about their personal lives. But i do get where he's coming from about how mayweather gets critisized too much for so called "ducking" fighters. IMO, when you're on your way to the top, it's human to cherry-pick. Every fighter does it to some extent. The reality is you cant fight every fighter out there. And as dangerous as the sport is, i guess you have to take the fights that make the more business-sense. But like i said its my opinion. And it makes for a great build-up for a future fight lol

You guys are really getting carried away. This is the same guy that got blitz by Floyd, beating twice by pacquaio, and was behind on the scorecards when he landed the luckiest punch since Martinez knock out Williams. Rio vs Alvarado is still fight of year. Which Mayweather? Oh, u mean the Mayweather that made a lightweight come up to a catch weight of 144 and had no intention of making that weight. That Mayweather? And beaten twice? sounds like a whiping, when in reality there were no victors, only 2 stalemates. And lastly the fight I saw showed two great fighters going back and forth, with the Filipino coming in way too aggressive, the KO was inevitable. Give the man credit where credit is due!

NO Mang !! ONE more fight, no one needs to be afraid that Pac will do the same thing to JMM that he did to Pac,,,,,its only right, I mean Mang, Hey , JMM went to the P.'s and made mockery begging for a fight the least JMM should do is give Pac that last fight. IF he KO's Pac again he nails the coffin, but if his face is beat to S### then what?? just so you know I pull for JMM when he is not fighting Pac. I think JMM is a P4P fighter, a Mexican GREAT !!!! I just want to see him do that again,,,,,,,,,if he can The "fans" forget Marquez is 39 years old, if it was up to pacquiao fans they would fight until he finally gets his KO, so what does that say about their fighter? How much glory is there really from knocking out a 40 year old man that already knocked out your fighter? Just saying... It was a great victory but, IMO, Marquez is fighting on borrowed time, he's not a defensive fighter like Hopkins.

you say pac is taking on any and all? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaha pac has ducked far too many fighters and gets away with it. he will only fight one style of fighter. and even then he will ask for the fight at a catch wt. as for devon "taking" from floyd, devon is a very respectable young man he has a relationship with floyd and they share mutual admiration. the sport needs more of that thank you! every fighter has to reject certain fights. thats the way its always been. manny pacquiao's rise to stardom was a list of names who were also handpicked. And even miguel cotto, and im a big cotto fan, but when they saw how margarito took him apart (handwraps or no handwraps) they saw he had sum holes in his game versus heavy punchers. Even so, im not denying pacman's skill (speed&power) but that was all premeditated.

Some people would prefer boxers wearing cement shoes so they can't move around and have every fight end in blood and sweat. I still can't believe that first judge refused to score the final round, especially after Lederman hyped him up as being the best of the 3 judges there. Scoring it 10-10 even though it was only 26 seconds long was taking the easy, non-confrontational way out. I thought that was the best way to score that final round. Neither of the two did anything conclusive to win that round. And to sway a whole round to one side for 26 seconds seems silly.

You clowns all act like you know more then you really do. This guys doing just fine for his age and where he's at. Everything seems to be tip top. It's obviously a little early for the top guys but he's definetly a natural talent and has the smarts to be a champion.Totally...

saul alvarez is picking a puertorican he knows he can beat!he needs to fight a real puertorican whos a real threat like kenny galarza!all these mexican always choose which puertoricans they fight,because there scared to fight a good puertorican fighter!i hope he dont fight jm cotto.i dont want him to use a pr fighter as a scape goat for his career!when a mexican fights a pr,fighter,he should fight someone with talent not a limited fighter just so he can look good.kenny galarza 12-0-12kos is the future of the welterweights!Ok so your bashing on a 19 year old who has over 30 fights under his belt. And throw in a name (well actually a no-name as of yet) that barely has 13 fights. Sorry to break it to you but in boxing age he should be coming into his prime at the age of 24 and he's not even ranked in the top 50. Canelo was 12-0-1 (11KO's) in his first 13 fights at the age of 17 and is ranked among the top 15 best welterweights. So you sir, are a dumbass. No offense :bs2:

Canelo deserves a shot at Floyd/Cotto/Martinez but Lara/Kirkland/Molina don't deserve a shot at Canelo? How does that work? :thinking: What has Canelo done that those 3 haven't? Maybe they should fight JWWs and beat up little Solis. :dunno: Posted from Boxingscene.com App for Android First off, Kirkland had his shot. First it was an injury, then the money wasn't right, who knows. And then the rest of the division just falls under the "high risk low reward" label which he has that luxury to avoid because he sold out stadiums in his own country already.

I was a big fan, but he is being protected for a reason, those match makers and trainers have been doing this for 20 and 30 years. They know that something is amiss with his skill set, they knew it with Chavez but wanted the money and couldnt duck any more with out looking bad. Canelo was looking good and then he started fighting little guys or old shot fighters. I would like to see him with new trainers and work on some things and fight some one good before he fights one or two of the best p4p fighters in the world if you're comparing him to chavez i would agree with you, but the reality is that chavez sucks. He has no tools working for him; lack of footwork, lack of anyting but hooks and having to be set to throw a punch, and lastly not a boxer's IQ. Canelo is a way diff fighter; he's a bigger puncher, crisper combos, ok footwork, very good reflexes, and intelligent in the ring. OH and he's only 22 so while he is gonna get better, he's ready for the big leagues.

It's most experts, and oddsmakers. It's really easy to google for this, don't make me do it for you. Oddsmakers mean to boxing what Donald trump means to politics, not a damn thing. Need I remind you PAC was a landslide favorite against Marquez.

I have never heard anyone call Williams slow, pre Martinez Williams II. Cintron when he was relevant was not slow, and dont tell me that was a draw, that was a KO and he was robbed of it.Serhiy Dzinziruk is not slow. The only true slow guy was Chavez, but being 200 pound might have somehting to do with that. Tell Jermain Taylor that Pavlik is slow I wasn't denying the caliber of opposition he's faced but Williams was all offense, all the time, he telegraphed his attacks and Martinez took advantage. Pavlik, in addition to his trouble making weight, couldn't get off first and was just too big and slow for Martinez. The same goes for Chavez, as much as the lack for any boxing skills. Cintron, IMO, thought he got head butted and could've made the count, but Martinez did beat him. Dzinzurik was content with trying to counter and waited til he made a mistake. On the other hand, Canelo is fresh, some might make the argument that he's too fresh. He has good boxing skills, very good power, and could fight both inside and out. His chin has yet to be tested at the major league level and he's never been in a war but that's why they fight, to see what happens.

lol.. your lack of boxing knowledge amuses me. the punch that marquez knocked him out with is the single most effective punch for marquez throughout the entire rivalry. a right hand straight down the pipe as pacquiao is coming in. even if that wasnt the case the punch was still clearly not a lucky punch, you could tell he timed pacquiao as he was coming in. even leaning to his left to get out of position for whatever punch pacquiao might have thrown. he walked pacquiao into the punch, how is that luck? if you read the article you would know nacho was suprised bcuz he didnt think marquez had the power to knock him out cold like that with just one punch. who did? he said marquez is a good puncher but not a great puncher and hurts ppl by throwing accurate combinations, not by exploding with a single bomb. Nah, that was an overhand right, the same punch that put him down earlier. That's where the extra muscle helped, which he didn't look excessively bigger like ppl claim. But I think they worked on overhand counter rights a lot. As far as the KO goes it was the culmination of perfect timing and horrible positioning by pacquiao, which proves no matter what PAC does against Marquez, he will always be bested. Had a better shot popshotting like the last fight. But it definitely surprised us all, I jumped out my seat with disregard to my surgically repaired knee lol :boxing:

thats why this fight will be so one sided, this is a fight for saul to get credibility on a small o.k name(j. cotto-due to his bro) so saul can get recognition on a overmatched opponentHe actually fought at light welter past couple fights, but it is a build up fight. With that being said, its a move up on the level of fighters he's gonna be taking on in the future

It is plainly obvious from your post that you know nothing whatsoever about boxing. 1.) Mayweather did not " drain " Hoya, he fought him at 154 2.) Cotto did not " drain " Margarito, because cheato was not a JMW You are a fkn idiot kid, grow up or fuk off..... " i won't indulge this crock of shhhh "..... you wouldnt have a clue moron. Answer me this..... If " Cotto wouldn't have won that fight at 147, 150, or 154 " then why was Plankiao too scared to fight him at those weights? Pacquiao was too scared to fight Cotto at 154 OR 150, despite Cotto being the current JMW champ..... WBO welterweight champion Manny Pacquiao (54-3-2, 38KOs) advised the Manila Bulletin that he would not fight Miguel Cotto (37-2, 30KOs) at any weight above 147-pounds. Pacquiao stopped Cotto in the twelfth round in 2009. That match was fought at a catch-weight of 145-pounds. http://www.boxingscene.com/pacquiao-not-fight-miguel-cotto-above-147-pounds--48569 You fkn idiot, why was the catch-weight a sticking point that nearly killed the fight if 2 pounds made no difference? Manny was going to walk away unless Cotto agreed to fight at 145..... Cotto: I Will Not Sacrifice My Body Again For Pacquiao..... http://www.boxingscene.com/cotto-i-not-sacrifice-my-body-again-pacquiao--48928 Plankiao intentionally tried to weight-drain Cotto, just like it says here..... Pacquiao Admits Catch-Weight Is Crucial To Outcome With Cotto http://www.thesweetscience.com/news/articles/7397-pacquiao-admits-catch-weight-is-crucial-to-outcome-with-cotto Yeah, sometimes you gotta feel for Cotto because his camp/promoters made bad decisions for him. He probably had no alternative in fighting pacquiao because PAC wouldn't of fought him at any other weight. Also the marg fight they didn't send anybody to supervise the hand wraps, so that was another mistake. And the most recent, he had no business fighting Trout, a slick and naturally bigger fighter, which even if he had won there wasn't much glory in the win. But I guess he wants to fight the best and you could never question that. He's one of those fighters that you can't dislike no matter how hard you try.

Martinez is the worst beating on that list with out question, too strong, Canelo has expericance with Welters and Jr Welters like Floyd, He aint getting in the ring with a guy that fights monsters and beats the wheels off of them Martinez is a great athlete, but I feel he can be somewhat neutralized with a good jab and quickness. While canelo has not gone to war yet, I believe he has the tools to make it a competitive fight with Martinez. If you notice the fighters he demolished were slow and come forward fighters (Pavlik, Williams, Chavez)

I cant belive anyone thinks Canelo has a chance here, Martinez will beat the living daylights out of him. He will take it to him pot shotting him with the jab moving around him for a few rounds then KTFO of the guy, He wont even stand a chance, this is one of the best fighters in the world against a guy who is not even in the top 40 in the world. Canelo hasnt even beat a real 154 pounder and he wants to fight the best 160 pounder in the world bar none.. This is complete and utter insanity if you you think he has a snowballs chance in hell. He will require radical reconstructive facial surgery after the bout, he would probably lose to Dzinsiruk if he fought him. He losses to any middle weight in the top 50. i hope thats a joke and you dont seriously believe that. First off, it may be true he hasnt faced the best but the opposition he has faced he didnt only beat, he pretty much destroyed em. It's a new age where every ticket seller is gonna get brought up slowly, he's only 22 and already in line for the best. Now, as far as a fight with Martinez, it will definetly be a competitive fight. I wouldn't go as far as to say he would beat him but he has a punchers chance, catching martinez with that pretty left hook when he lunges in.

Pacquiao locked his lead foot against JMM's lead foot and careened forward with his head up in the air right at the moment the finishing right connected. Call it a phenomena. At that point it was inevitable, nothing could save him, that punch was gonna land wether he stepped inside Marquez's foot or tripped over it. It was a phenomena because everything came together at the same time, everything that coulda gone wrong for PAC did and Marquez wasted no power at the position it landed, it was like bench pressing pacquiao's face LOL

JMM has every reason to rejoice, and he should enjoy it while it last. After all he got what he was dreaming for, for a long time and fair enough for him. There should be no more 5th fight if I were JMM because he might not end up in his favor next time around and will retire in disappointment. I say so because Pac dominating the action before that flashed right hook, and that well placed hit was been there, laid down to kill Pac in their previous 3 fights but only this time hit the mark perfectly. Partially, because of Pac admittance that he was been careless this time and paid the price. But I believe on Pac that the punch in R3 that put him down was expected only a little bit too late for him to react. And the impact of course is different from the one he did not notice at all in R6. If you don't understand that then you don't know much ***** about boxing. And the way you reacted seems there's rivalry bet. Phils and Mex. Some few Pac fans called him Mexecutiner, yet he doesn't like him to be called like this. Because for him there wasno rivalry at all, just so happened that Mexico produced much of the quality boxers that Pac needed into the ring. His lost is not at all personal to him but that's what the sport evolved. To JMM despite of anything, a very big congratulations and you deserves all the accolades of defeating Pac in a very convincing fashion. No room for any negative comment this time. But with your age at 39 and progressing to 40 next year is old enough in boxing. I think it's time to hang up your gloves and retire as champion with a smile in your face. You will always be remembered as one ot the ATG in our time, Champ!:boxing: Good post. But the notion that pacquiao was dominating is a little far fetched. It was a 1 point differential in the scorecards and it is now obvious that Marquez had a plan for when pacquiao got overly aggressive. Also, they weren't the same punches as the previous fights, they were over hands with more mustard on em; he wanted to hurt pacquiao and hurt he did. But I agree with u that a rematch wouldn't mean he's gonna do it again, he's been in many wars already and is only getting older even though his style plays to his age. But there's no more glory to be had, he got his decisive victory, and finally closure.

Teddy Atlas also thinks Lomachenko is the second coming of Jesus Christ putting him above Ward and Crawford. Listen 118-110 was bad but the end result was not. Being the loudest in the room doesn't make Atlas a genius, everyone knows there has been and will be questionable scoring in the sport but sh1ting where he himself eats makes the sport look bad. All ESPN analysts are a joke

I think Marquez definitely tops Chavez as Mexico's greatest fighter. When you compare Marquez's performances against Pac to Chavez's fights with Taylor and Whittaker, you'd have to give it to Marquez. I also think he should win fighter of the year regardless of what Donaire does to Arce. Quality should beat quantity. I won't refute that. I think it's very possible, for the meer fact that he's doing it so late in his career. But I think that's in part due to the fact he's been shadowed by pacquiao for so long that he was still hungry and dedicated. Chavez's latter portion of his career was clouded by his ", well documented, drug and alcohol abuse. But either way, their both great fighters and Marquez is the best p4p out right now, other than Mayweather, and that's only because they're stylistically similar and May is the bigger and faster man.

I really hope Marquez grants Manny the possibility of a rematch. However, I think it's unlikely. Marquez no longer seems interested judging by his post interviews. I think that's a dick move considering Manny granted him not one but two rematches. Regardless, I would still like to see Pacquiao fight Mayweather and Marquez fight Bradley. Are you serious? So Marquez should be thankful? When all their fights have been pretty much even and Marquez took a lesser purse last night but the punishment was the same, earning another broken nose for his trouble. IMO, Marquez doesn't need to fight again let alone GRANT anything to pacquiao. I don't have any personal connections with the man but u gotta feel bad for him that he's been doing it for just under a decade at the elite level and its barely now that he gets his props.

Freddie Roach is the Mike D'antoni of boxing, all offense.

Nobody that's any good loses 120-107 to Santa Cruz. Casa was once a great fighter, everyone has an expiration period, see Mosley. Casa is about the same age as Marquez and was still a threat when they fought. Weather he lost that fight it doesn't really mean much, upsets happen all the time. He came back and KO katsidis next, given that katsidis was winning but knocking katsidis out is no easy feat.

Wishful thinking Pac must win by KO The judges will rob again Don't tell yer fighter he is winning so he can coast Nacho mang He got critized for telling Marquez he was winning but every trainer, specially nacho with marquez, knows his fighter. On every fight marquez asks him if he's winning because it helps him. And the fact of the matter is marquez is no spring chicken, he didnt have much in the tank the last couple rounds. But i still think pac didn't do enough to win that last round conclusively

f0ck em...maniac is ok in my book but pissboy fans annoy the f0ck out of me when it comes to pac....bunch of cyrababies just like pissboy ..and i favor pissboy to win this time... i understand why tho , it's coz marquez only has pacquaio to brag about , nothing else... No it's because pacquiao knows that marquez is the only one that took him to school. Roach even acknowledged it and didn't want the 3rd or 4th fight. PAC is just banking that he gets old overnight because let's be honest PAC got schooled by a 39 year old man. It kills him inside

"He's too young/inexperienced" will be the go-to excuse if Canelo loses to Mayweather/Cotto. Well it's not an excuse if its true, he is young. The experience is there, so far, and even if he were to lose against Cotto, I think it would be a war. Against Mayweather it's another story because no matter how much experience one has, his style and skill set is unique.

Or like Baldomir, Ryan Rhodes, Cotto's brother, Mosley and M. Hatton? Not only shot but smaller too. :lol1: Seriously, Canelo fans should refrain from posting ironic posts such as this one. Posted from Boxingscene.com App for Android Name another 22 year old cash cow, in this era of promoters, with a better resume. This Trout fight has been made at the right time; no shame in canelo's resume thus far.