styles makes fights.peterson is not slow like the hard punching maidana. plus peterson has good movement and won't be hit as easy as maidana did.this is a good fight and lamont can fight.peterson does need to be more busier and i hope he does. he's faster and sharper than maidana and can upset khan.
Peterson also has good fundamentals. another thing is he has a fairly good jab, possibly good enough to offset Amir's speed a bit. but the key for him to win, like you said, is to stay busy. he needs to put more combinations together. this is the only downside to both Peterson brothers. for some reason they can't seem to put their punches in bunches. if he fixes that problem i don't see why he can't take khan into deep waters and win. I like this match up from a technial stand point. It may not be exciting but i love technical fights.
What has berto done to deserve a fight against Cotto besides running from mosley a month before they were supposed to fight? Something tells me Berto will cancel the fight again and leave boxing fans with nothing like last time.
you're straight up hating. he is trying to fight the better guys in the sport and your hating him for doing so. so if he doesn't fight cotto or pac cuz he's "not deserving" according to you then who does he fight? collazo? (were he to rematch collazo he wouldn't prove much and i know you'd bash him for fighting collazo too). and he didn't cancel the fight on purpose, don't be ignorant! his family was hit with tradgic news emerging from the earthquake in haiti. get your head out of your ass. you wanna talk boxing then talk boxing but if your gonna talk s**t and non-sense then your with the Pacmonkeys, ignorant and don't know crap about the sweet science.
The real problem is that Paquiao on wants to fight for money. That means he fights names not champions. Not the best of any weightclass. It's a shame for fight fans who would only love to see the best fight the best. Marquez and Mayweather refuse to jump threw hoops for paquiao and take whatever leftovers they offer. I respect them for that. Paquiao only fights guys who will do anything to fight for big money. Fight at ridiculous catchweights take scraps and not demand a thing. It's big money corrupting boxing. Leaving real fight fans who have been watching boxing since we were kids and watch it for the love of the sweet science and not to root on one fighter and one fighter only because they share a common birthplace. 99 percent of paquiao fans no nothing of boxing and only follow one fighter. It's sad. Paq is a great fighter who fights sub par fighters at a weight that suits him. Emanuel steward put it best. Everyone is tired of the catchweight crap and it's played out! There is no doubt PAC is a terrific fighter but if u are a true fan of his it's time you demand he fight the best as well. I've watched PAC since he had blonde hair and wore no fear trunks with flames on them and dazzled us on undercards with his game boxing style. But his fame has tanted even his legacy. Let's not forget all the best fights of the recent past do not include paquiao. I watch boxing for the real fighters! Now adays if there is a fight on PPV you can bet it will be weak. Supports boxing.
Martinez,Williams,Marquez,Lopez,Bute,Ward,etc..
Couldn't have said it better myself. and by recent fights i'll assume you're talking about his last 4 or 5 fights. They've been nothing but garbage fights but before that Pac gave us some good fights, that was the Pac of old. the pac of new is Money Man Manny Pacquiao just a rockstar in boxing NOT a legend
I like Peterson and think he is a good fighter with a lot of heart. That being said his style of fighting is exactly the reason Roach wants him in addition to the fact that he has a win over Khan. Peterson does not let his hands go enough and is rarely 'first' when initiating action in the ring. That is exactly the style that suits Pac best in the ring just look at Clottey, Margarito, Mosley as recent opposition who fit that criteria. Cowardly move by Roach and team Pac if this goes through. They just keep showing their true colors of how Pac has been brought up through perfect match making. Wait for the Berto vs Ortiz winner or go after Bradley, team Pac needs to challenge themselves something that hadn't happened with Pac till JMM schooled him this November.
Obviously, Katsidis isn't as big a draw as Mayweather. But, I think you're missing my point. Regardless of what JMM's initial proposal was, and we've heard conflicting reports come from Arum's own mouth, if Team Pacquaio legitimately wanted the fight, they would have at least made a counter proposal. Them walking after an initial proposal without even making a counter tells me that they had no intentions of making the fight anyway and simply used JMM's first proposal as an out.
co-sign... that's what negotiating is all about offers and counter offers IF both parties are interested. JMM was interested Manny and Bobby Boy weren't ever interested.
Two things 1.Clottey got known because as everyone with two eyes seen he beat Cotto in the Garden..2.There are many belt holders at 147lb Berto is just one of the belt holders not the Champ..BTW he did not even earn his belt from a true opponent he fought a Latin singer come-on man..If he wants to be regarded with those great names he needs only one person and his name is not Berto..
I knew who clottey was. I remember when he was getting the best of Margarito till he hurt his hand. Boxing fans knew who clottey was b4 he faced cotto. I'm talking about the "mainstream" people the so called "important" ones who make most of the PPV buys. They had no clue who clottey was until they promoted his fight with Pac.
You got your opinion on Berto but don't bring up other belt holders @ 147lbs if you and I know they're not even worthy of talking about just yet so that argument is no good. And the WBC belt has been known as one of the most respected belts to have. Don't matter who he beat he has the belt and has defended it even though it's not against the better guys.
And no he doesn't need mayweather to cement his legacy he needs respectable legit opponents
It's Pac vs Marquez NOT Marquez vs clottey, cotto, or margarito. totally irrellevant with Pac vs Marquez. if you know anything about boxing i don't need to explain that, just remember styles and fighters make fights.
If you know boxing you know about Thomas Hearns, Roberto Duran, and Iran Barkley.
-Hearns lost twice to Barkley, one by KO
-Hearns beat Duran and knocked him the f**k out... does that mean Barkley would have beat Duran b/c he could beat Hearns and Duran couldn't? ...NOPE!
-Duran beat Barkley in the fight of the year.
this goes to show you can't compare Marquez vs cotto, clottey, and margarito cuz we're talking about Pac vs Marquez. Marquez may lose to cotto, clottey or margarito but that doesn't mean b/c he does that he'll lose to Pac only b/c Pac beat all those guys. Pac is smaller than cotto, clottey and margarito AND has a much different style than the three and a better style (Pac's) for Marquez to go against. Like i said flawed logic. Learn boxing and the history behind the sport then you'll make sense when you post.
This might look like a **** fight at first glance... But hey this is Ricardo ****in Mayorga, it's GONNA be exciting.
i concur. they're gonna wanna bang it out and make it entertaining. rubbish fight in terms of proving anything. but a damn good entertaining one it'll be. a lot of people will watch this just for the excitement and entertainment it'll bring. im curious to what s**t comes out of mayorga's mouth at the press confrences this guy is funny.
Arum save the bull s**t lies already. No one believes them, you are quoted on video saying Mosley is past his prime. Lying is something you have become known for and i bet now you'll say during the promotions that Shane is dangerous and he still has it. Sorry Bobby boy boxing fans ain't stupid. You been quoted as saying the you don't give a s**t what fans want. so, we don't give a s**t what you say.
Canelo just showed his age, he's just a kid...not an elite fighter yet. Not because he don't have tools to be a good but his team and GBP are rushing him way too fast!!! b4 people start w/ the hate comments cause I'm rican, I do like this kid, I think he's a talent but GBP and his team just put a huge bulls eye to this kid by giving him the green belt in a weight class which you got guys like Angulo, Margacheato, Cotto, Kirtland, even Cintron, P-Will, etc...which in my eyes all these guys have a very good chance to beat him now!!!
On the fight, he made a lot of mistakes:
1. Dropping the hands
2. Not ducking the chin
3. Loose composure (this is a big 1, w/ another referee he would've been disqualified)
4. Didn't setup punches
5. Bad defense, got hit way too many times by a class C at most fighter
6. No hip movement, no angles7. Didn't pivot when trowing the hooks or uppercuts8. Jumped in w/ hands down
9. Many others....
Angulo or Cheato will murder him
Cotto or Cintron will beat him easy by points by just giving him some angles.
Kirt will hurt him bad!!!
Best thing for the kid is to go back ww division and get a new corner and take the foot out of the pedal!!! just take your time!!! :boxing: :boxing: :boxing:
I agree with slowing down with this kids progress. He has so much potential and at his age he is very ring smart. Your mistakes list I agree with most but the ones i bolded i don't agree with. He provided nice angles throughout the fight and his angles of attack are nice to watch especially for someone his age. And I don't see a problem with his hooks and uppercuts, they're thrown nicely and with good technique (remember it's a fight not a mitt session so you can't always pivot like is desired the other guy just won't let you). He does conceals his punches very well I will add.
A lot of people are hating on this kid but he's ONLY 20! he'll grow with time and if he has the heart and mentality of a warrior the sky is the limit for him.
BTW I'd love to see him in there with Cintron. I think he can beat Cintron right now and he'll get great experience from a fight with him. Still young though and wouldn't mind if they slow him down and get him a better corner that will further develop him.
Hahahahahahaha if this goes down we can all officially agree that Manny Pacquiao and his team are an even bigger joke than they already are! F**K this BS! thank god we got a lot of talent out there in boxing to enjoy cuz this whole Pacman sagga is getting ridiculous. I think after Mosley then Pac should fight Tito Trinidad looks to be the perfect match for this circus that they're putting up. And to even think there are people supporting and defending Pacman is CRAZYYY!!! Idiots!
And all these people on these threads making excuse after excuse why Marquez or Berto don't deserve the fight. Mosley is done, unless he pulls a miracle out of his ass he gave boxing his best and I as a fan am grateful for what he has given the sport. But it's time for him to hang up the gloves. No ways to justify this fight with Mosley he does NOT deserve this fight with Manny.
And you peeps on here saying that JMM won't sell. Get the f**k out of here. Who said he won't sell. WE THE FANS DECIDE WHO WILL SELL AND WHO WON'T. We're the ones buying the PPVs not Freddie and not Arum, that's for us decide who will sell more PPVs.
It is a rubbermatch with bad blood between the two. Filipinos know who Marquez is they'll buy the fight, Mexicans will buy the fight, boxing fans will buy the fight, Pactards will buy any Manny fight, and the mainstream people will buy the fight with a bunch of promoting and media coverage. They were able to sell the John Doe of Joshua Clottey so they sure as hell can sell JMM without a problem. You people only listen to what Bob Arum says. All the BS he says and these Pactards buy into it like it is the word of God. The same Bob Arum who said he only goes according to what the Neveda Athletic Commission decides. But when NSAC says NO to license Margarito, instead of respecting their decision he goes off to Texas to see if they'll license Margarito instead. Slap in the face to NSAC decision and he just made himself a hyprocite and a liar (once again). Only time he follows the NSAC rules and decisions is when they benefit him. Bob Arum is a lying sack of s**t and i am blown away how these Pactards believe anything that comes out of his mouth. And Roach as good a trainer as he is, he is just as bad. And the worst of them all is Manny Pacquiao for letting all this happen. He had the chance to secure his name as one of the best, instead he takes fights against certain fighter, at certain weight division and at certain weights just for the money NOT legacy. Money comes and goes but a Legacy as a great fighter lives forever. And quite frankly Manny has NOT secured his legacy with the all time greats and TRUE UNBIASED boxing fans know this. F**k the 8 division title BS not even legit and worst of all he won't defend the title against true 154lbs without catchweights.
STANDARDS people! *True fans will always ask for the best and will not look for excuses why the best fight can't be made.* Hold Manny accountable just like you would any other fighter when it comes to selecting opponents. Nobody doubts Manny is a great fighter now and i respect his boxing abilities. when i see talent i acknowledge it. i just wanna see him put his talent against the best that's out there and challenge himself against technical fighters who have given him problems to prove he has improved and is a cut above the rest. Till he does that he will be in the category of the cherry-picker club and yes Mayweather can be added to that club aswell though i think he is the purist boxer and can beat the guys he supposedly "ducked".
Floyd's sitting at home waiting to go to court because of his idiotic actions outside of the ring. How is that called "running"? Did you forget that Manny was the one who was "running" around with all the excuses as to why he was afraid to do random OST in the first round of negotiations. Remember now? Mayweather agreed to everything in the first round of negotiations, Pac on the other hand didn't. Which resulted into no fight. Floyd went on vacation and to court the second round. Ironically Pac wanted to fight Mayweather in court and not in a ring in the first place.....
As for "everyone who steps to Manny gets beat" is false. Nobody "STEPS" up. Team Pac "select" who they want, at the weight class they want and the weight they WANT them at.
If what you say is true about "everyone who steps up" Pac would fighting Martinez AT 154 or JMM AT 140. Hell, he would have fought Cotto for the WW title AT 147 and not a catchweight when Cotto "stepped up" but was made to cut down. Pac had no problem fighting De La Hoya (a non ranked WW) AT 147. What you say is false, as nobody he has fought "stepped up". They where hand selected. The fighters that stepped up got shot down.
If picking and choosing certain fighters AT certain weight classes AT certain weights is what "stepping up" means, I don't know what to tell you.....
Nobody that has stepped up has gotten in the ring with Pac lately. Mayweather stepped up and AGREED to EVERYTHING pac demanded. Pac didn't return the favor.
-Mosley "stepped up" as THE #1 WW and begged for a fight from 141-147, Pac STEPPED down a few times saying he was "too good".
-Martinez "stepped up" and asked to fight for his OLD TITLE that Pac holds, Pac stepped down and said a 5'10 guy is "too big" (Margarito is 5'11).
-Berto stepped up and all we hear are excuse of... he wouldn't sell enough (like Clottey would right?)
-Bradley and Alexander would step up but would get the same excuse as they wouldn't sell enough.
-JMM has been begging since 2008. Now Pac demands to fight ONLY at 147 when JMM isn't a WW and Pac didn't even win his WW title AT 147, let alone his JMW title. When JMM agreed to fight AT 147, the excuse of "he's pricing himself out" came out.... lol right.......
So if picking and choosing certain fighters AT certain weight classes AT certain weights means..... "everyone who steps up gets beat" is just your opinion and is not what's really taking place. But you can believe what ever you want to believe. It still doesn't mean your right. Or validates Pac fighting Mosley in 2011 or even fighting JMM AT 147 when EVERYONE knows it should take place at 140 because BOTH make that weight easily. But just as pac didn't think he could beat Mosley when he was #1 or when pac thought he needed to demand tha Cotto come in at a catchweight for the WW title, he will want JMM to fight to take place AT WW..... I remember when this was so wrong when Mayweather did. My o my have the times changed and people flip the script.
All these names and options of people "stepping up", lets hope Top Rank/Pac chose wisely.
Mayweather AT 147
Martinez AT 154
Berto AT 147
JMM AT 140
Bradley/Alexander AT 140 or 147
The problem is none would happen, if they did they wouldnt happen at the weight classes or weights they actually fight in. Research Cotto and Margarito for validation.
AMEN! nice to see people finally seeing through this BS. He takes the easy way out and the way i see it is, he fought DLH at 147lbs but couldn't fight Mosley at that weight 2 years ago when Shane was begging for a fight. He fights Cotto at 145lbs at the catchweight, but doesn't need a catchweight with a much bigger Clottey at 147lbs. Why ask one guy for a catchweight and not the other, obviously it's not b/c of size? And how the hell can they sell Clottey and apparently not be able to sell Berto. Clottey was a nobody, he had no story line behind him to sell PPV but apparently that fight did around like 700k ppv buys. BS they can't sell Berto, they can!
That's how a fighter tarnishes a legacy. I just want Pac to retire if he does choose Mosley. Let the new up and comers, the actual hungry fighters who WANT to fight the best, let those guys take over the sport. We don't need Mayweather and Pacquiao and we sure as hell don't need the lying scum of Bob Arum and his Top Rank company. They're part of the reason the sport is struggling.
I said assuming.. meaning just for discussions... until Marquez did not release statement that oppose to Arums statement, then we can assume just for discussions. But if Marquez deny it, then that's different story and did I say on this thread that if arum is lying and Marquez gave a reasonable proposal, then I'm with other guys like you? Looks like you only have kindergarten reading comprehension.About the initial proposal, remember that this is the second time and (first is 50/50) if this second one is true (2x his highest payday and more than shane), how can you entertain absurd proposal while the other contenders are proposing very reasonable.... who would you entertain first? First you will entertain the proposal that have sense.. then if it fails, then they will go to next proposal? get it? or still blinded by hate?
Floyd vs Marquez - 1 Million PPV
Floyd vs. Shane - 1.4 Million PPV
Now, how the hell Marquez should have same or more payday than Shane?!! looks like your beyond stupidity.
Like I said dumbass you CAN'T assume don't go off of "IF". don't go off assumptions and little scenarios you play in your head cuz ain't no point in discussing stuff that ain't even true especially stuff coming out of Arum's mouth. And talk facts and talk boxing not s**t!
And Floyd vs Shane... FLOYD was the draw and the reason they had 400,000 more buys was everyone thought Mosley would beat floyd (JMM vs Mayweather everyone knew Mayweather would win that one) so people bought the fight to see FLOYD lose NOT watch Shane. man you are dumb. I'm a fighter i got a fighters mentality so i look to challenge myself against the best opposition and if a guy i fought 2 times (who many experts believe i lost to) called me out again, I would fight him PERIOD! especially when there is a lot of money there as is the case for Manny for every fight. but it seems Manny and Bobby are out there looking for the easiest fights and the facts are there! But your too stupid to understand that i see.
Why should Marquez have the same pay?... well lets see, watch JMM vs Manny Pacquiao 1 and 2 and that is your answer. He got the best of Pac in those fights. that's your answer he EARNED it! what has shane done "lately" to EARN that payday and fight. everyone knows he's a legend but his best days are over with.
And i don't hate i call it how i see it. If the p4p best fighter is not challenging himself and making a pattern of fighting lesser opponents then i'll call them out on that. i respect manny's skills NOT his opposition selection. people wanna use the excuse that it's a business decision well open your eyes and see Manny makes money no matter who he fights so the money ain't an issue it's the guy across the ring that is. so he avoids the best guys out there and I as a fan want only the best fights.
anymore lame ass excuses?
I love when posters out themselves. You have clearly never stepped in a ring. I can always tell the posters on this site that have actually stepped in a ring, because those guys never call another fighter a "pu55y" or a "coward."
You are a tool.
Amen! I am baffled when people on these forums call pro fighters "*****s", "fags", "cowards", etc. Those who have stepped in the ring before do carry more respect for fighters because they know what they go through in the ring and in training; and therefore, know that those words above are foolish to say. It is a brutal sport and you have to respect these men for doing it for a living, those posting that crap surely never have and probably never will step foot in a ring nor at the least a boxing gym. Nice to see someone else on this site bring this up. props!
You went hard on this one(lol),I never really liked TR but here I can't fault umm..Who else is there really for Pac to fight..Berto or JMM both are trash fights at 147lb imo..JMM looked really bad at the weight,and who the hell has Berto fought??
Trash??? lmao Pactard. excuse after excuse why Berto or JMM don't deserve the fight while Mosley does. Who the hell is Berto? hmmmm undefeated WBC Welterweight champion looking to finally test himself against a good opponent and Pacquiao could've been just that. He is a prime young fighter, explosive with power in both hands, he's fast and still learning. downside he lacks defense (just like Mosley).
JMM, technician who can counter punch the s**t out of almost anyone and that includes Pac. He took Pac to hell in both fights imo won the 2nd one. A smart fighter who can hold his own with the best and has the biggest heart out there.
Trash? yes mosley is trash. but Berto and JMM were too much of a threat for Manny and Arum decides to protect his ATM machine "Money Man Manny Pacquiao, I do what my promoter tells me to do." The TRUE fans WANT the best fighters facing each other and won't make an excuse why they can't or shouldn't fight each other
..As a sports fan, I'd rather watch Pac/Mosley. Two KO artist will be fun to watch. Who cares if Shane is 40, fact is more americans knows him compared to Berto and JMM therefore,more viewers will tune in. Shane is not that old, Hopkins is 45 and he almost beat Pascal. For fans that doesn't like this fight....too fvcking bad!
Two different fighters there. B-hop is an old school cat who relies on his boxing smarts and technique to beat people. He beats fighters with his intelligence and boxing ability. Mosley is more of a brawler who had great speed and has punching power. He relies on his natural abilities rather than his boxing abilities. I loved watching shane at 135lbs and till about 2007. After that he is not the same. Can't compare the two Shane is a legend but is not the same anymore.
And JMM and Berto would have sold just as much if not more. Clottey sold and that's all i'll say about that
I will answer this with no bias Pac is not one of my favorite fighters at The moment but like May I respect the hell out of umm..
Diaz/This fight was B.S. imo he should have fought Casamayor..
Hatton/A legit win Hatton was the Champ and this was/is Hattons best weight..
Cotto/Also was a legit fight imo..The weight had nothing to do with the outcome of the fight..
Margarito/This was the worst nuff said..He should have been fought Mosley imo,I still want to see it tho its a good chance it might be good..Styles make fights NO??That's my veiw on those fights..
Fair enough respect your thoughts and your classiness in your replies. Now that the Shane fight is made i can only hope for a miracle in which the younger shane comes back to life. shane has a punchers chance as does any boxer that steps into the ring, but that's a low percentage possibility. he is too stiff at this age and struggles letting his hands go. rather than staying behind his speed that got him his legendary status, now he is more of a one punch fighter trying to land the big shot and waiting for an opening rather than create them.
but how i see it is Manny uses his feet, sticks and moves working both the body and the head, eventually tires and frustrates shane and that is when the 10+ punch combinations start coming out and Pac may stop shane late in the fight or pick up a UD. and from what i seen shane does not do well against southpaws. He has a hard time figuring them out as do most orthodox fighters. Mismatch imo, like i said i'm a fan of the sport i'll stream the fight and watch the replay on HBO cuz hell i love boxing. but it is a garbage fight
I'm not saying your wrong about why Pac has won his last fights,I did a lil boxing and my boxing IQ is not the best but it an't the worst either ya dig..But it takes a certain kinda fighter to do what he has done and if ya boxed then ya can see that..Berto imo would not beat Shane right now I don't see it happening and I don't even believe he believes he can beat Shane which is why he priced himself out asking for 50/50 when Shane had just come off a how many mill selling PPV??All's I'm saying is Shane is the best option and makes more sense then Berto and JMM..Berto has a belt but has not tried to unify or fight anybody of note to make a name for himself so therefore has not made a name for himself so why should Manny fight him??Ya dig..
No doubt i can see Pacs abilities as a fighter. he is gifted no one ever questions that. His opposition is what has made him look as good as he has and that is what i question (his opposition selection).
No i think Berto beats Shane now. Berto just has to counter punch Shane and fight smart by boxing. Shane has trouble with boxers who fight smart. If he fights like a Marquez keeping the right distance between him and Shane and catches Shane lunging in he beats shane. By then Shane will be frustrated and Berto starts to open up going to the body and tiring him as the fight goes on. Berto has the speed to do that to Shane. Shane ain't no bum but he ain't the same as he was at 135lbs and during the DLH days. That is how I see it.
Manny has a chance to win the WBC belt against a legit opponent that is why he should face Berto. If he is gonna stay at 147lbs and do like the legends of this beautiful sport have done and unify the division then Berto should have been next. That is why, and the money follows Pac regardless so that is never an issue.
The problem is, not only Marquez is the contender... lets try to assume that Arum is telling the truth... First proposal of Marquez is 50/50 and we all know its unreasonable.. then the second is 2x the highest he ever got on a fight... which unreasonable... twice proposal and still junk while the other guy is proposing with sense... which will you entertain on the negotiating table?
If ONLY Marquez propose slightly reasonable to Pac, then we are on the same page, F*ck Arum and Team Pac! We want Pac-JMM! but if any of the two above proposal by Marquez is reasonable to you, then get your self a doctor. :bottle:
First mistake, you can't assume Arum is telling the truth because even he admits he is a compulsive liar. So he has no credibility there bad point made.
If JMM asked for double what he made for Mayweather i want to see that article please as proof (can't be quoted by Arum remember no credibility there he's a liar) and i'll gladly accept that point and I agree he doesn't deserve double yet. Because from what i have read he asked for the SAME amount he made for Mayweather (who is a bigger draw than pac).
It's a f**king PROPOSAL! from the initial proposal you negotiate IF and ONLY IF you really WANT to fight, understand that *key word* WANT the fight. apparently Manny and Bobby 'Liar'um had no interest in wanting the fight by them feeling "offended" and dismissing JMM as an opponent lmao JOKE!
Marquez has earned his right in this sport to fight Pac. He arguably beat Pac twice, drew the first and i think he clearly won the 2nd fight. If someone is calling me out and disrespecting me I step in that ring and shut his ass up SIMPLE AS THAT! Especially if i fought him twice already and still couldn't decisively beat him (leaving doubts in experts and fight fans minds). i don't care what he makes i only care what I MYSELF make as a purse and that i whoop his ass. it's not free money for Marquez cuz he has earned his dues. Not saying he deserves 10 million but he sure as hell deserves the same as Shane if not a little more. So if you can't understand this then ain't no point arguing to a person who can't comprehend things logically and from a fighter's mentality.
Respectable opponents??Where are they??If he fights JMM it would be at 147lb and therefore it would be the excuse all the Pac haters would use to why Pac creams him..If he fights Berto,it's oh Berto was a bum or he was not ready because he is too young..ect ect,Dude the real is unless Pac fights May or fights Martinez he will be criticized so lets just be honest there really is no winning for Pac this case so why not go for who he feels brings him more money..
OK back too Berto,Mosley was really looked at as the Champ for WW not Berto who was ranked like six before Pac fought Clottey..Shane's belt is the one ya need,and sorry but it does matter who ya won ya belt from and it also matters who ya defend it against..You as a boxing fan know this to be true,don't try to change it bro..Berto has not fought anybody since having it and tbh should not even have it(they robbed Collazo don't forget that)Berto should fight Cintron who called him a ***** publicly but I but we won't see that..Oh and their promoted by the same guy lol..Berto don't deserve **** bro sorry..
and let me ask you no bias no BS. just honest thoughts then of Manny's wins for the light weight title (Diaz), light welterweight title (Hatton), WW title (Cotto), and JMW title (Margarito). the guys he beat for these titles and the circumstances behind them according to you it DOES matter who you win the title from and defend it against. so i'm curious what you got to say about the the guys and circumstances he won the titles from
Dzinziruk is the most boring fighter in the sport today! hope this fight doesnt happen
every person has their own taste and styles that they like to watch. But if you ever boxed before or truely know boxing you see that this is an interesting match-up and i'm looking forward to it.
grant it sergei is not a busy fighter (which may make him "boring" to some) and to win i think he will need to be busier than usual and put combinations together throughout the fight. but sergei has the best jab in boxing right now and that alone is a b***h to get around so it will be interesting to see how martinez deals with a technically sound fighter who doesn't expose himself much. however i like sergio martinez to win this fight. very slick, fast, awkward and has a champions heart. i like this fight and i disagree with you. i hope this fight gets made but every person has their own taste when it comes to fights
What WW did Marquez beat to get a WW title shot? Oh, he beat the one
dimensional Katsidis AT LW! LMAO! So after beating Katsidis, Marquez can go
straight FROM LW to WW and fight for the title?
The fighters who has been fighting at WW should all step aside and let someone from LW, and who sucks at WW, to get a shot at the WW title. GET REAL, DUDE!Marquez is on quicksand at WW! Pacquiao would destroy him in two rounds.
Then the back pedaling will get out of control: Pacquiao should have come down to 140, Marquez would beat Pacquiao at 142, Pacquiao was afraid to fight Marquez at 143, Marquez is washed up, Marquez was too fat.. . . .
What did Manny Pacquiao do to deserve a title shot AT WW against Cotto AND at a catchweight? So all the other WW fighting in the division should've stepped aside and let a LW (Pac) fight for the title at a catchweight when the only WW he fought at the time was DLH, who had not fought in that division in years and was drained to the point where he needed IV's in order to even step into the ring? C'mon man YOU be real about this
What did Manny Pacquiao do to get a title shot at JMW and against a life long WW in Margarito and at a catchweight? So all other JMWs in the division should have stepped aside and let a small WW (actually natural LW) come in and fight for a JMW title against another WW at a catchweight? C'mon man another flawed logic. there is a double standard here.
What many guys on this thread are saying is they respect Manny's skills but NOT his opposition selection and the lame excuses that are coming from him and his people. What should have been done was have JMM vs Pac III at 140lbs so they could settle the score, answer many critics questions and make the most money. Because if we think logically and without bias this fight would have sold best. Mexicans, Filipinos, hardcore boxing fans, Pacmonkeys, and of course the mainstream people (b/c they know there is a history between the two AND they buy any Manny fight) all would gave bought this fight. ESPECIALLY with some good promoting as is the case for any Manny fight, they sold Clottey and Margarito they can definitely sell JMM vs Pac III.
This was expected they're out to make money not please the fans and not cement Manny's name as an all time great. I pick Tito Trinidad as manny's next opponent since some people on here wanna talk about Mosley being another good name on Manny's resume. Then after Tito comes B-hop at some catchweight to add another legend on that resume of his that his Pactard fans talk about. GTFO there is no way to justify this fight, and any Manny fight would have sold. JMM and Berto would have sold as would almost any other opponent so save the BS excuses as to why this fight was made along with DLH, Hatton, Cotto @ a catchweight, Clottey, Margarito (the cheater who had a suspended license) and now this one. Have standards people just cuz it's Manny doesn't mean he can be excused for for these absurd mismatches. He has the talent to compete with the better guys in the sport but is not willing to prove that right now. Sad for boxing.
You filipinos really are pactards. Why would they put berto and maidana in the undercard when one is with golden boy and the other one gets paids tons to fight bums. And what a ***** move though they said marquez money demands where to high and yet they are paying mosley the same thing marquez asked for?
That is what i was thinking. How are you gonna make up an excuse that JMM priced himself out then pay mosley the same maybe more. What a bunch of liars and the circus of TR, Arum and Manny continues
All these pactard idiots. You guys wanna talk about size? First off 10-17lbs heavier is all because REHYDRATION and FOOD not muscle!!!! Most importantly the only time size comes into play is when SKILLS come into play. The moment a bigger more SKILLED fighter steps into the ring then is when weight is an advantage. It is not about weight it is about skill. from personal experience ask any boxer or fighter, it is not an issue to throw down with bigger guys if they aren't at your SKILL level. The moment someone comes along with your skill level and is bigger than you that is when weight becomes an advantage. so Manny fighting these lesser skilled opponents that are heavier than him, to me it is not impressive. And yes for those of you who don't know cutting weight can be brutal and it does weaken you (why do you think Pacman and his team ask for it in the first place?) b/c they want to put the other fighter at a disadvantage.
If manny wants to come in below the JMW LIMIT OF 154lbs or WW limit of 147lbs that is his choice. but he has no right to make the other guy come in below that limit. There is a reason why boxing history has had weight LIMITS and that is when SKILLED fighters step in the ring w/ each to NOT give one guy the upper hand. It is a disgrace to the legends of the game who stuck to these weight limits when they accomplished the many things they did.
Lastly we can argue all day people. But the facts are all over this thread time and time again and rather than Pactards come up with facts they come up with absurd comebacks that are non-factial. *True fight fans will always ask for the best fight and will not make any excuses why the best fight can't be made*. Hold Manny accountable as you guys would any other fighter. I'm a boxing fan i watch every fight i can and i root for good fights not one rockstar fighter
Mosley would murk JMM. between the 2 mosley is the tougher fight. JMM has yet to prove he can carry the weight above 135 lbs.
mosley/berto is a 50/50 fight, so either guy is ok, but I prefer pac to fight berto over mosley. however berto can't draw flies to shiit, so I can understand why they picked mosley even though I don't like that fight.
It's Pac vs Marquez NOT Marquez vs Mosley. that's totally irrellevant to Pac vs Marquez. if you know anything about boxing i don't need to explain that, just remember styles and fighters make fights.
If you know boxing you know about Thomas Hearns, Roberto Duran, and Iran Barkley.
-Hearns lost twice to Barkley, one by KO
-Hearns beat Duran and knocked him the f**k out... does that mean Barkley would have beat Duran b/c he could beat Hearns and Duran couldn't? ...NOPE!
-Duran beat Barkley in the fight of the year.
this goes to show you can't compare Marquez vs Mosley to see how Marquez will do against Pac cuz we are talking Marquez vs Pac. And if Marquez were to lose to Mosley that doesn't mean b/c he does that he'll lose to Pac only b/c Pac can beat Mosley. Pac is smaller than mosley and has a much different style. two totally different fights, flawed logic.
in my eyes and the eyes of many fans JMM vs Pac should have happened at 140lbs, it would've made the most money and answered all critics questions and would have been a respected legit win for either guy. Mosley vs Pac will not be seen as a legit win for Pac if he does win which most likely he will win.
And Pac vs Berto regardless of all the hate people have towards Berto would have been a legit respectable win especially if Pac is looking unify the division. And they could have sold Berto, they can sell clottey and margarito they can easily sell Berto. Bob Arum and top rank are good at promoting fights, NOT making good fights, but they promote and that is all that is needed in order for people to buy a Pac vs Berto fight. but i do agree with you i would have liked Berto. What's done is done but Pac will be criticized for his constant cherry-picking AND all the BS rubbish talk coming from him and his people. I respect Pac's skills not his opposition selection
i wasn't impressed with Berto's trainer at all in the first fight.
I disagree, I don't have a problem with the advice Morgan gives in the corner during fights. It's good advice that would help Berto win; the problem falls on Berto himself. He is what I call a 'stupid' fighter in the sense that he lacks the intelligence in the ring and does not listen to any advice that his corner gives. That is what is keeping Berto from these good wins, he lacks the brains and I am slowly losing any confidence in his ability to think and listen in the ring. He's a talented fighter though.
Oh boy you sound foolish my friend for this alone
Who the hell is Berto? hmmmm undefeated WBC Welterweight champion looking to finally test himself against a good opponent and Pacquiao could've been just that.
So what ya saying is Berto's first test should be Pac a living legend who is hot and destroying everything that get's in the ring with him??LMAO why don't Berto go fight a top five WW or how about Marga's I would love to Marga's take Berto apart..JMM is ineffective above 135lb I would also like to see him fight a 140lb to see how he deals with the weight imo he gets his ass handed to him at 147lb..Sounds like ya have alot of hate bro got to get that out of ya..Open those eyes of yours..:puppy_dog:puppy_dog
Not hate i call things how i see them and at 147lbs Berto is the one who makes the most sense competition wise. Honestly i credit Pac if he were to beat Berto b/c although Berto hasn't fought the best out there YET, he is the current champ and that can't be overlooked. Cuz Mosley is just a name, his abilities are not what they used to be. And we are not talking about Berto vs Margarito we are talking about Berto vs Pac (two different style of opponents). I ain't saying Berto is the man cuz he is far from it but he is the best opponent for Pac IMO. Don't think he would beat him but i'd like to see this fight.
The reason Manny is destroying the guys in front of him is cuz the level of competition is not there. Styles make fights and the people that have been put in front of him make him look amazing. If you don't already, enter a boxing gym and learn the sweet science from a fighters stand point you'll see things in a different perspective and understand why Manny smashed his past 5 opponents and it ain't cuz he is a GOD in boxing. It is about the opponents styles and somewhat due to draining them (DLH and Cotto).
I agree with JMM vs Pac at 140lbs I would like. but i just think JMM's style and his boxing IQ is what gives Pac problems not his size. He is a counter puncher who forces Manny to THINK b4 he attacks. Something Manny's 5 previous opponents haven't done.
I ain't a hater, Pac has great talent and i never discredit his boxing abilities. up till 2008 he was challenging himself. But now being as good as he is he avoids the tough fights against the technical styles who have given him problems in the past. I call it how i see it.
can marquez beat cotto?can marquez beat clottey can marquez beat margarito no...lol......even a class c katsidis can knock him down lol
It's Pac vs Marquez NOT Marquez vs clottey, cotto, or margarito. totally irrellevant with Pac vs Marquez. if you know anything about boxing i don't need to explain that, just remember styles and fighters make fights.
If you know boxing you know about Thomas Hearns, Roberto Duran, and Iran Barkley.
-Hearns lost twice to Barkley, one by KO
-Hearns beat Duran and knocked him the f**k out... does that mean Barkley would have beat Duran b/c he could beat Hearns and Duran couldn't? ...NOPE!
-Duran beat Barkley in the fight of the year.
this goes to show you can't compare Marquez vs cotto, clottey, and margarito cuz we're talking about Pac vs Marquez. Marquez may lose to cotto, clottey or margarito but that doesn't mean b/c he does that he'll lose to Pac only b/c Pac beat all those guys. Pac is smaller than cotto, clottey and margarito AND has a much different style than the two. Like i said flawed logic. Learn boxing and the history behind the sport then you'll make sense when you post.