Should Manny Still Be Placed Above Floyd On The ATG List?

Floyd always ranked higher....fck are u talking about...IMO both are ranked around 20-35 ATG.....not top 10 like some idiots like to say

Did someone just say jmm beat Barrera PACs best win? Didn't Ricky hatton beat Castillo the guy who most think beat Floyd. Who pac destroyed in 2 rounds? Where is this debate going? Barrera was way past his best and still gave jmm a real good test and jmm at that time was considered the poor relation Mexican out of Barrera sand morales. But Barrera always rated PAC higher than jmm and always favoured PAC too beat jmm. After all PAC had3 wins over jmm and Barrera had fought both. Well you can't use that logic, dude because Hatton got KOd by Mayweather first. :/ and I don't seriously hope you think Pac actually "beat" JMM three times. Not only that, but whatever Barrera says doesn't mean anything as JMM sparked Pac. So Barrera was shot vs JMM and Morales wasn't old and coming off a loss vs Pac? Any division shared with JMM and Floyd basically meant that at many given times Pac wasn't the best fighter in his division. You can't be number two or three in the division and somehow rank higher than them. No matter what Roach or Arum said. Not only that but do you think Pacquiao goes through Mayweather's fights un defeated? We already know that he doesn't since JMM is on there. Can he beat Canelo, JLC at that time? Pacquiao is stylistically outmatched vs Canelo not saying Canelo is better, but he's got a stylistic advantage and also size...a lot of it. Anyhow... They fought in the same era, same weight class and one was clearly the superior fighter. That's all that needs to be said. That's what the books say, and that's how it will be remembered.

After the fight, pac cried about a fake shoulder injury. He lost his ATG status to me after that. Ran from a fight for years, did nothing in that fight, then blame it on some mess from a long time ago because he got schooled in that fight. By an almost 40 year old man. I never thought it was up for debate.

Your "criteria" also led you to make a thread arguing that, "In 20 years, people will see Mayweather-Pacquiao as at least a draw." you should be happy with a draw... spoon won't be, though...ha ha ha

Agreed. I'm bored of this thread, it's a rehash of fools. Same here, I'm bored. Floyd fans always try beg, borrow and steal credit for Floyd out of desperation as Floyd hasn't given them much to cheerlead and get their teeth into. If Floyd just got in the ring @ 160 against GGG then I'm sure they'd have something substantial to rave about and not have to keep bringing jmms name up.But Floyd has never taken any risks and been spontaneous Floyd's win over PAC means nothing and seals no deal. Floyd has been considered favourite in a fight by many or most people, so ewhy would Floyd actually beating PAC all of a sudden make Floyd higjherr on atg list?

Did someone just say jmm beat Barrera PACs best win? Didn't Ricky hatton beat Castillo the guy who most think beat Floyd. Who pac destroyed in 2 rounds? Where is this debate going? Barrera was way past his best and still gave jmm a real good test and jmm at that time was considered the poor relation Mexican out of Barrera sand morales. But Barrera always rated PAC higher than jmm and always favoured PAC too beat jmm. After all PAC had3 wins over jmm and Barrera had fought both. Agreed. I'm bored of this thread, it's a rehash of fools.

Did someone just say jmm beat Barrera PACs best win? Didn't Ricky hatton beat Castillo the guy who most think beat Floyd. Who pac destroyed in 2 rounds? Where is this debate going? Barrera was way past his best and still gave jmm a real good test and jmm at that time was considered the poor relation Mexican out of Barrera sand morales. But Barrera always rated PAC higher than jmm and always favoured PAC too beat jmm. After all PAC had3 wins over jmm and Barrera had fought both.

Debate on this thread is about their resumes, not head 2 head. Primary points have been that Manny's resume when all things considered is at least on par with Floyds. Floyd resume key items - 5 division champion 3 of original 8 - More champs fought - Perfect record - 4 division lineal champ - 1 ATG - Pacquiao Pacs resume key items - 8 division champion including 4 of the original 8 - 2 ATG wins - Barrera Morales - First to set record of 4 division lineal champ Now, besides insulting people, do you have anything of substance to provide or you just looking to troll in hopes your circle-jerk buddies give you what you want :bukkake: I'd take a Marquez or lineal champ Canelo over those Morales wins all day. And wtf kind of logic am I witnessing? If Pac only has "two" wins, and Floyd beats Pac that by default makes Floyd's resume better. You act like Pac has dozens of atg scalps on his mantle. Like dude has Hearns, Hagler, Leonard, Benitez, Chavez Sr, Duran, Whitaker, etc. it's f ucking Morales and Barrera (no disrespect to either but Pac has a LOSS to one of them) Lets not forget Marquez also beat Barrera. :/... Floyd tooled Marquez, the Pacquiao conquerer and if that wasn't enough Floyd best Pac himself. What is this logic!? A dude who has multiple one punch knockout losses and losses to a common opponent vs..the guy who beat him. Go ahead and post all the guys Pac won titles from then post the guys who where champions in those divisions at that time and the circumstances they were won in. The 8 divisions thing is a farce. Just like Pacquiao being some sort of midgit. Dude is a normal sized WW people need to get over it. Fighting giants? Wtf. I hate sounding like I'm defending Mayweather because I'm a bigger Pac fan but that argument is literally the most ridiculous thing I've seen today (Khan-Canelo was yesterday). No offense dude but delusions should only be allowed to go so far...

You're comparing Morales after Pac vs Pac before Mayweather. Just like Morales before the first Pac fight, Pac has been showing signs of degrading well before Mayweather only difference is Zahir was the first slap to everyone's face that he wasn't the same, Pac's slap to us was 2 years ago. Now, its likely Pac will win against Bradley unless he's shot to ****, but time will tell if he, like Morales will ride off to retirement after their respective losses. What ****ing slap? Did he look any different vs Bradley in the second fight? Stop making **** up.

Debate on this thread is about their resumes, not head 2 head. Primary points have been that Manny's resume when all things considered is at least on par with Floyds. Floyd resume key items - 5 division champion 3 of original 8 - More champs fought - Perfect record - 4 division lineal champ - 1 ATG - Pacquiao Pacs resume key items - 8 division champion including 4 of the original 8 - 2 ATG wins - Barrera Morales - First to set record of 4 division lineal champ Now, besides insulting people, do you have anything of substance to provide or you just looking to troll in hopes your circle-jerk buddies give you what you want :bukkake: Id be happy to wager history will regard Floyd higher he has so many areas that trump Manny its not funny , Ive seen the full careers of both guys and taken into account the weights and timing of their big fights in regard to them and their opponents , Ive said already that I believe Cotto Oscar Mosley and Hatton were better versions when Floyd beat them , I can debate each fight if you like , I believe Manny could not beat the 154 version of Oscar or Cotto and the way he ducked the 154 Cotto after already beating the guy cries weight loud and clear , Manny was made via matchmaking using weight as a lever . I also believe 130-135 Mayweather would beat the breaks of Manny Morales and Barrera . So at the end of the day its all just opinions and history will be what it be .

Pac farts claiming Manny is better than Mayweather well what a surprise , would be interesting to witness a recognised boxing outlet run by a recognised unbiased writer state the same sht the fanboys in here do , only Pac fans have any such stupids notions , could it be they are emotional children or dumb as fck adults . Here is a good book that appears to be written just for the Pac farts . Throughout history, humans have always indulged in certain irrationalities and held some fairly wrong-headed beliefs. But in his newest book, philosopher Lee McIntyre shows how we've now reached a watershed moment for ignorance in the modern era, due to the volume of misinformation, the speed with which it can be digitally disseminated, and the savvy exploitation of our cognitive weaknesses by those who wish to advance their ideological agendas. In Respecting Truth: Willful Ignorance in the Internet Age, McIntyre issues a call to fight back against this slide into the witless abyss. In the tradition of Galileo, the author champions the importance of using tested scientific methods for arriving at true beliefs, and shows how our future survival is dependent on a more widespread, reasonable world. http://s15.postimg.org/n8ugyu80b/0037b6f5_1.jpg Debate on this thread is about their resumes, not head 2 head. Primary points have been that Manny's resume when all things considered is at least on par with Floyds. Floyd resume key items - 5 division champion 3 of original 8 - More champs fought - Perfect record - 4 division lineal champ - 1 ATG - Pacquiao Pacs resume key items - 8 division champion including 4 of the original 8 - 2 ATG wins - Barrera Morales - First to set record of 4 division lineal champ Now, besides insulting people, do you have anything of substance to provide or you just looking to troll in hopes your circle-jerk buddies give you what you want :bukkake:

Still not using any criteria. You're stating he lost, there are fighters in most boxing top 10 lists who have more losses than Manny and less "championship" fights than Floyd. You'll have to give some actual boxing reasoning, that **** doesn't fly with someone who knows the sport. Your "criteria" also led you to make a thread arguing that, "In 20 years, people will see Mayweather-Pacquiao as at least a draw."

Pac farts claiming Manny is better than Mayweather well what a surprise , would be interesting to witness a recognised boxing outlet run by a recognised unbiased writer state the same sht the fanboys in here do , only Pac fans have any such stupids notions , could it be they are emotional children or dumb as fck adults . Here is a good book that appears to be written just for the Pac farts . Throughout history, humans have always indulged in certain irrationalities and held some fairly wrong-headed beliefs. But in his newest book, philosopher Lee McIntyre shows how we've now reached a watershed moment for ignorance in the modern era, due to the volume of misinformation, the speed with which it can be digitally disseminated, and the savvy exploitation of our cognitive weaknesses by those who wish to advance their ideological agendas. In Respecting Truth: Willful Ignorance in the Internet Age, McIntyre issues a call to fight back against this slide into the witless abyss. In the tradition of Galileo, the author champions the importance of using tested scientific methods for arriving at true beliefs, and shows how our future survival is dependent on a more widespread, reasonable world. http://s15.postimg.org/n8ugyu80b/0037b6f5_1.jpg

Easy. Manny lost the most important fight of his career. He lost in the beginning, middle and end of his career. Floyd fought more champions in more title fights and came out victorious. Manny lost to his biggest challenges and lost decisively in the two most watched fights of his career. Still not using any criteria. You're stating he lost, there are fighters in most boxing top 10 lists who have more losses than Manny and less "championship" fights than Floyd. You'll have to give some actual boxing reasoning, that **** doesn't fly with someone who knows the sport.

I totally agree, Pac had already surpassed Floyd long before they fought and long before Pac v JMM IV. But I was really asking the Floyd fans, using the criteria I put forward (a criteria used by most rankings), how is Floyd greater/better? I've actually asked this multiple times over the last couple years but never receive an answer. True, some people will think Floyd is greater but that's because of ignorance. Floyd knows PAC is better. He knows everything PAC has done is what people love. What PAC has done is similar to all those greats who came before pac did. Floyd says he will ko opponents but not only does he not do that he doesn't even make an effort in trying to. He's too specialised can only fight one way, or rather will only fight one way. Belongs in a circus act

I totally agree, Pac had already surpassed Floyd long before they fought and long before Pac v JMM IV. But I was really asking the Floyd fans, using the criteria I put forward (a criteria used by most rankings), how is Floyd greater/better? I've actually asked this multiple times over the last couple years but never receive an answer. Easy. Manny lost the most important fight of his career. He lost in the beginning, middle and end of his career. Floyd fought more champions in more title fights and came out victorious. Manny lost to his biggest challenges and lost decisively in the two most watched fights of his career.

Clearly. Name a decent Morales win after that. I'll wait. Manny on the other hand would have lost to Bradley if he was that badly faded. I also must've missed someone describing that as a one-sided fight. Nice try. You've got nothing here. You're comparing Morales after Pac vs Pac before Mayweather. Just like Morales before the first Pac fight, Pac has been showing signs of degrading well before Mayweather only difference is Zahir was the first slap to everyone's face that he wasn't the same, Pac's slap to us was 2 years ago. Now, its likely Pac will win against Bradley unless he's shot to ****, but time will tell if he, like Morales will ride off to retirement after their respective losses.

PAC was considered greater than Floyd before he was koed by jmm. Since being koed people had to take a deep breath and reevaluate. They asked themselves do losing to jmm and f!oyd change things? No they don't! Pac beat jmm 3 times, thats 2 times more than floyd beat jmm. Floyd beat a gun shy pac. Floyd fans like to say it was close legacy wise and Floyd beating PAC was the decider? Floyd had all physical advantages and PAC had one arm. Floyd fans beg, borrow and steal credit for Floyd, so PAC having one arm isn't insignificant. But that is only in their dreams. I totally agree, Pac had already surpassed Floyd long before they fought and long before Pac v JMM IV. But I was really asking the Floyd fans, using the criteria I put forward (a criteria used by most rankings), how is Floyd greater/better? I've actually asked this multiple times over the last couple years but never receive an answer.

People saying yes or no, what is your criteria? Mine, as is always the case when ranking fighters is based on achievements, titles won, opponents faced and at what stage, number of defences of titles, skill set, entertainment value and mainstream appeal. Pacquiao scores higher than Mayweather in almost all those categories. He was already a great fighter before the Oscar/Cotto/Marg/Bradley fights. Beating those guys and beating JMM for a 3rd time just solidified his position. Of course, there will be a lot of American bias for Mayweather, which is understandable but how many of those categories would Mayweather rank higher in? PAC was considered greater than Floyd before he was koed by jmm. Since being koed people had to take a deep breath and reevaluate. They asked themselves do losing to jmm and f!oyd change things? No they don't! Pac beat jmm 3 times, thats 2 times more than floyd beat jmm. Floyd beat a gun shy pac. Floyd fans like to say it was close legacy wise and Floyd beating PAC was the decider? But that is only in their dreams. Floyd had all physical advantages and PAC had one arm. Floyd fans beg, borrow and steal credit for Floyd, so PAC having one arm isn't insignificant.

Clearly. Name a decent Morales win after that. I'll wait. Manny on the other hand would have lost to Bradley if he was that badly faded. I also must've missed someone describing that as a one-sided fight. Nice try. You've got nothing here. Morales lost every meaningful fight he had after he defeated Manny...he was on the slide and had shaky performance vs Chavez, In Jin Chi before hand and didnt look great after anything to pump up Manny's resume...no need for that, he is an ATG...just not the best of this era, was not the fighter of the decade in my book during the 2000s, and was never better than Mayweather the media can only do so much to convince people, fight A is the best but the ring in the squared circle of truth.