I'm trying to understand the complaints concerning Pac/Marg..

so i guess the thing people are most 'upset' about is that its for a title you can direct that animosity towards the WBC... and bob arum...you think its coincidence that marg was ranked by the wbc at 154 after 1 fight against a journeyman? point is there is a list of contenders at 154 that deserve to fight for that belt before these two. theres no good reason they couldn't fight at 147 for pacs belt. arums bull**** takes credibility from the sport.

The 151 catchweight helps Pacquiao only in terms of trying to cherry pick history. But in terms of the actual fight, which really is all that matters once that bell rings, it helps Margarito. Margie is a career 147 guy, yet you're giving him 4 bonus pounds to play with, even though at 147 he would already dwarf little Packy? Cintron is one of the hardest punchers at 47/54 yet Marg ate his punches like nothing. Marg blocked most of those punches, with his face. It doesn't matter how fast you are, if you can't hurt the opponent you will have problems. Look at how mortal Gamboa looked when he couldn't hurt Salido as easily as people expected. Look at AP when he couldn't hurt Rios, who outweighed AP by 12 lbs. Pac could be in for a long night. :nonono:

You have very good points. I feel that there are good trainers, and some still from the era I am talking about. I do also feel that many athletes are doing other sports, and the lack of poverty and compeition with MMA is more abundant. The supply of boxers seem not as quality, also from amatuers, they don't seem to have the pedigree. Et... Forrest VS Kosta in amatuers was great. I am not sure if they televise amatuer boxing as much, but when I do see it, it's just not as good. I go gym, and there are some who acn be trained to do things, but just can't get any better, or much. It seems the same for boxers, like Berto has not improved on his footwork really. Gamboa is fast and has good reflexes, but the compeition has to be better. When you face someone as good as yourself or better, that's the test. You strengths do not look as good, and weaknesses exploited. Can you imagine what Leonard, Hagler and Hearns would do today? Even Nigel Benn, Eubank, Watson, Nunn, Mcclelan, Jones, Hopkins, Toney, Mccalum, Calzaghe in the super six? JMM, BARERA, Morales, Naz and Pac, Floyd in prime now? Heavyweights Aswell. Lewis, Tyson, Holyfield To me, there is soemthing lacking, yet the boxers still are fast etc... The thing with mma is that unlike boxing where success is derived from poverty and desire....the most successful mma athletes are actually well educated with college degrees and could very easily have a higher paying career elsewhere. Rags to riches people simply arent able to compete at the highest level in mma because it's such a chess match. So athletic ability comes in different forms. You mention all those greats being in the super 6 today. But they've all already earned their keep. We havent even allowed the majority of fighters today to make a name for themselves. and just because middleweight was so prevalent in the 90s...i could say for example the welterweights from the 90s would get murked the welterweight beltholders today. Welterweight Buddy Mcgirt for example is not beating welterweight MIguel Cotto.

So two unranked fighter at 150 lbs is a bad fight for you? You a comedian? No, two unranked fighters - one of them coming off a year long suspension and the worst performance of his career, the other fresh off another PPV tuneup - fighting at 150 for a vacant paper 154lb title for $60 is a bad fight to me.

Okay so this must mean Pac at 154 has no ranking then. It's ok for 2 unranked guys at 150 to fight IMO. Or any other boxer that goes up because it is a different weight? Marg is more suited to 154 than Cotto IMO. I see how you think now. LOL. Does your post make any sense to you?

Yes it is true that you need to fight there, but as fans we can also see that a boxer going up can still win by using our knowledge and logic. For example Pac hasn't fought at 150 before, but most assume he will beat Marg at the weight. Well Marg hasn't fought there either. I apply this to marg going up also. I feel he can beat the other names at JMW. The long lay off was with an ass kicking, but a long lay off is bad even if you win, especially when you're 38 and the last guy was tailor made for you. I don't think you can definitely say Marg is not top 10 JMW. Is Cotto a top 10 JMW after beating Foreman? You can't just base it on one fight both ways. Cotto beat a top ten junior middle. Who did Margarito beat again?

Well, yes, but the only reason for this fight is to make Pac into an eight division world champ. They're simply giving him a fight against the least deserving fighter with the biggest name who he has the easiest chance of beating to let him make 'history'. The title is the only important thing in this fight in reality. Without any title it would never have happened, just as the Cotto fight wasn't going to happen unless Cotto put up his title. Its all about the money, the belt is just an extra incentive nothing more nothing less, price that belt for 1 mill, lets see if the title is really that important.

This fight blows............. Im more interested in watching Rigondeaux.

Its a WBC Belt, we all know is bullshiet. But on a serious note who the fawk would pass out a WBC Belt for a penny change. Pacquiao should have just said forget but seriously who would do that if you have money to spare Well, yes, but the only reason for this fight is to make Pac into an eight division world champ. They're simply giving him a fight against the least deserving fighter with the biggest name who he has the easiest chance of beating to let him make 'history'. The title is the only important thing in this fight in reality. Without any title it would never have happened, just as the Cotto fight wasn't going to happen unless Cotto put up his title.

the problem with it, at least in my opinion, is that neither Pac nor Marg are 154lbs fighters, therefore the title shouldn't be on the line. We have a winner.... I approve of this message.

Its a WBC Belt, we all know is bullshiet. But on a serious note who the fawk would pass out a WBC Belt for a penny change. Pacquiao should have just said forget but seriously who would do that if you have money to spare

Is it not junior middleweight class is from 148 to 154 pounds? Yes, that's right. From 148 to 154, not 148 to 150. The issues with the fight are pretty damn obvious and have been spelled out here already. Undeserving fighters fighting for a vacant title at a catchweight at a division in which neither is ranked nor fights at. Not only that, but while Margarito would have been a good fight a couple of years ago, right now he is done. Just like Cotto, Morales, Hatton, Oscar etc, Margarito is coming off a loss, this one more brutal than anything the others went through (apart from maybe Cotto), has looked absolutely shocking in his last two fights and no one ever comes back normal from that type of horrid beating. He's a good candidate to get Pac an easy historic victory for a title that shouldn't be there at a weird weight, and look very good against. If the fight with Garcia (and before that Mosley) was anything to go by and the way Margarito was flinching and grimacing in pain when he got hit and looking gun shy, then they also understand he will get knocked out which will make it look all the better. It's just a strange fight overall that is simply another easy fight showcase against a big name, albeit a name that is no longer any good for Pacman to win his 8th 'title' against a guy that doesn't stand much of a chance and is perfectly picked for him. It should still be a good fight while it lasts though I have a feeling it will just be a blow out, but it should be thought of as nothing more than it honestly is. A non title, tune up fight for the 'star' to look good in against a broken fighter.

Good points. However trainers can only deal with what they have. To me, when Roy was on top, there were greats and Hof's being made, and athletic too. I'm not old enough for anymore than before that. You had raw athletic power and speed in Tyson. Yes you have Wlad who can surfboard and is toned, and Hyae, but I feel that the past guys had super unreal ****. I am probably wrong when I think of your points though. As for boxers with ex sports, I think that they are athletic, but still not athletic in the boxing sense as before. Like pure speed, power, reflexes etc.. There's a universal saying that there's no such thing as a bad student. only bad teachers. If a fighter is unable to improve their technique and skills or does but simply disregards them because their athletic ability allows them to get away with fundamentally wrong technique then the trainer has failed the athlete. as far as the rest of your post power, speed and reflexes are attained through practice. but athletic ability is athletic ability. I would be hard pressed to find any featherweight in history that could surpass the speed and reflexes of a gamboa today for example.

So basically, what I get after reading just the first page, is that people are hurt because its a title fight. Yet, most people agree that titles are **** to begin with, so whats the problem? Two guys who like to engage their opponents are going to square off. Cut it with the nit picking and enjoy the fireworks.

I thought the reason for the title is because only title fights go 12 rounds and regular go 10? Or does it depend on commission. No way a big fight like this will be a 10 rounder

For a belt simply to pad stats. Then disregard the belt. The belt is meaningless and history will judge it as such. If you take the belt out the equation altogether it's actually a good matchup on paper with foty potential.

Pac hasn't punked Khan in sparring IMO. But he could. They only sparring they have done was after the Khan KTFO lost to Prescott. Khan is better than that, although Pac is also. I would say boxing quality has gone down, from athletic ability to pure skills since the 90's. The decline in fundamentals in prominent fighters today are the fault of trainers...not the fighters. Apart from that...you cannot that fighters today are any less athletic than that of yesteryear. Not when there's guys like Vitali and Chris John who were former kickboxers before becoming world champion boxers. Not when there's a Sergio Martinez who went from being a pro soccer player to a pro cyclist to a pro boxer. That takes an immeasurable amount of athletic ability.

These titles are basically a joke nowdays anyway so I really don't care about the catch weight thing. I'm not going to watch the fight for the belt, I'm going to watch the fight to see the fight.

You do realize that padding your stats is not a good thing. I don't care about his opponent or the sanctioning body. I care about the weight. So you're not pissed about the fight being for a title....you're pissed that he's fighting an opponent who's spent his entire career between 147 and 154 at a weight he's very comfortable with??? wtf???

Margarito looked like shit against Garcia. That is for damn sure. But it's not like too many other fighters have been impressing me here lately either. Like is the case with Devon Alexander, Maidana, and hell Khan is a top 140 lber and Pac punks on him in sparring. Who is it that Pacquiao is supposed to prove himself against? I know it may sound like I'm holding him to different standards than Floyd, but the guy isn't gonna get any credit whether if he fights Cotto again, Mosley, or Margarito. I think Pac would murk Bradley even though he's better in my view than Khan and Devon. The only feasible guy I see giving Pac a challenge is Martinez. Williams would be dangerous too probably, but he don't bring shit to the table and is being a big ducker himself. And it's not like anybody has a gun to your head forcing you to pay for this fight. I'm not gonna buy it either. The catch weight and fake title chasing I definitely have a big issue with though.