..American Robberies...

the difference is when foreigners get robbed we call it like it is.

Is it fair to say that with current fights like Chris John/Rocky Juarez and Sergio Martinez/Kermit Cintron being called DRAWS when the guy closer related to the country probably should have lost, that America doesn't really stand on steady ground when it complains of other countries being biased? I'm not saying that American does it most, or that other countries don't do it most. What I am saying is that it happens here, A LOT. For the record, I know Cintron wasn't born in America. However, he lives here, speaks better English than Spanish and considers himself American and you all know it. Nonetheless, vote. Discuss. Also, a note. With other countries, we often times have to hear what happened. We don't get the fights from over there, like they seem to get fights from these parts. Fans on that side of the pond, have more visual aid. Just throwing that out there. I was shocked that the Golden Boy actually lost that decision to Trinidad. I never thought De La Hoya would ever lose a close decision. He did get lucky on a couple of decisions(Whitaker and Sturm) that he definitely did not deserve

Star fighters gets protected when they fight at home. That goes for DLH (vs. Sturm), Foreman (vs. Schulz), Bute (vs. Andrade), Khan (vs. Kristjansen), Ottke (vs. Reid). Regarding star fighters it's probably quite even.

Realistically, however, CERTAIN close fights can still be robberies. If a guy one the fight by one round, but the judges would have NEVER given him the fight to begin with, he's getting robbed. It's rare, but that fight seems to have that feel. He could have KO'd Juarez, would have got a 10-8 round at the most. I, by the way, don't see the fight that close. I can remember thinking that John had won 5 of the first 6, and then AT LEAST 3 of the last six, probably 4. Making him the winner by 116-112. Possibly 117-111. You do realize that makes no sense, right? How do you know where or how the judges are going to judge the fight? It was close, again I think John won but Rocky fought very well in the first 3-4 rounds, faded in the middle of the fight and then came on strong at the end. A robbery is when there is no doubt who won the fight and I just don't get that with the Juarez fight.

Cintron had absolutely no business winning that fight. The part that pissed me off most was when he was crying about the draw. John won, but I can handle a draw with that one. As Lampley said "As draw's go, maybe not that bad" Germany is the worst. Actually I don't trust the results of any fight in Eastern Europe.

I don't think that you can say Juarez vs John was a robbery. I had John winning but it was closer than people thought and there were some very tough rounds to score. Realistically, however, CERTAIN close fights can still be robberies. If a guy one the fight by one round, but the judges would have NEVER given him the fight to begin with, he's getting robbed. It's rare, but that fight seems to have that feel. He could have KO'd Juarez, would have got a 10-8 round at the most. I, by the way, don't see the fight that close. I can remember thinking that John had won 5 of the first 6, and then AT LEAST 3 of the last six, probably 4. Making him the winner by 116-112. Possibly 117-111.

I don't think that you can say Juarez vs John was a robbery. I had John winning but it was closer than people thought and there were some very tough rounds to score.

America has some terrible referee`s and judges BUT in Britisher land the Jamie Moore fight the Reid/Ottke ref was hired as a judge. America is the worst but not by that much. Did Germany get nuked?

martinez cintron was ****ed up but to some extent it can be justified with incompetence cj vs juarez was fine i had it a draw myself but what about casamayor vs santacruz can anyone explain or justify that shit? i mean not one but all the judges there had to be a fix in there Yeah, I agree that it sucked. However, both fighters are pretty far removed from this country. So, it's more of a promotional thing, and that DEF. happens everywhere. Nonetheless, I think that homecooking happens everywhere. What can you do? Nonetheless, very shitty call.

It is different here. There is tons and tons of bias, but it isn't the same as overseas in say Germany. Our country doesn't care about boxing so people don't get decisions for being American. However, you do see very specific regional decisions. Rocky Juarez would not have gotten that decision in all likelihood in any other of the 49 states, but he's the favorite son of Houston, Texas. Cintron/Martinez? Hell if I know what happened there. All I can assure you is that no one in America likes or gives the slightest shit about Kermit Cintron. If someone is going to get a decision because they are American it sure isn't him. Besides, isn't he Puerto Rican anyway or is my memory going? I know PR is techincally American, but it is perceived as independent and separate here. Think of it as like Wales to England.

I'd be anyone's lapdog for that kind of money. For the right amount of money, the dude could pat me on the shoudler with his dick. Yeah....... I said it.

Yeah, they love to pat him on the head and smile, "Good fighter, here's a treat." Thankfully, for the best of the best, the treats are multi-million dollar contracts. I'd be anyone's lapdog for that kind of money.

Absolutely. In a rematch John will do even better, gain even more fans, and circulate his name out there more. It's all going to lead to some very nice fights for him in the future. He's also very marketable, HBO may pick him up. People in America love the whole "foreign fighter who speaks really good English" angle. It's endearing. Yeah, they love to pat him on the head and smile, "Good fighter, here's a treat." Thankfully, for the best of the best, the treats are multi-million dollar contracts.

To a degree. There are more blatent robberies in countries like Germany, but as far as the US is concerned I feel as though there are judges that are just terrible and not properly trained, which results in disjointed scoring. Is there even such a thing as "training" for judges? I know you take a multitude of tests, but how can you train a judge? You're supposed to score a round on clean punching, effective aggression, and ring generalship, those are commonly cited as the "main 3" anyway. But who you see landing the clean punching, and being "effectively aggressive" could depend entirely on where you are sitting. So the whole judging process itself is subjective to the perception of the viewer.

Fair enough. Though, without the pressure of a national and world-wide audience, I think those judges might have been OKay with giving Juarez the nod. Nonetheless, a rematch I think makes most sense. I like that John is so eager to fight the rematch in America. Absolutely. In a rematch John will do even better, gain even more fans, and circulate his name out there more. It's all going to lead to some very nice fights for him in the future. He's also very marketable, HBO may pick him up. People in America love the whole "foreign fighter who speaks really good English" angle. It's endearing.

To a degree. There are more blatent robberies in countries like Germany, but as far as the US is concerned I feel as though there are judges that are just terrible and not properly trained, which results in disjointed scoring.

It's an issue that's completely subjective. Perhaps John would've gotten the nod, perhaps it would've gone to Juarez, or perhaps it would've been the same result we ended up with. The only way to know for sure is to get the rematch, and end the speculation. Besides, nobody is beating down the doors to fight the likes of John and Juarez. So they're best off fighting each other again, getting more exposure because of it, and then using that as a platform to make some noise in the division. Fair enough. Though, without the pressure of a national and world-wide audience, I think those judges might have been OKay with giving Juarez the nod. Nonetheless, a rematch I think makes most sense. I like that John is so eager to fight the rematch in America.

Fair, to an extent. However, let's look at it this way. If this fight DIDN'T air on HBO, do you think that everything else being the same, it would have remained a draw, or gone to Juarez? It's an issue that's completely subjective. Perhaps John would've gotten the nod, perhaps it would've gone to Juarez, or perhaps it would've been the same result we ended up with. The only way to know for sure is to get the rematch, and end the speculation. Besides, nobody is beating down the doors to fight the likes of John and Juarez. So they're best off fighting each other again, getting more exposure because of it, and then using that as a platform to make some noise in the division.

There has been alot of terrible decisions in America just like alot of other places. It is bit rich for people to start complaining of other countries when their own is infact pretty bad. I do find it amusing though when some American posters start complaining about Germany and act as if there is no corruption in American boxing and everything has always been fair :rolleyes: Bad decisions and robberies happen in most places What are you talking? I hear American posters complaining about bad decisions in the US all the time, I mean Holyfield was the American Champion who got the draw against Lennox, fans complained regardless of their origin.

Bad decisions happen everywhere. It's just too bad every fight don't end wit a KO.