Why Marquez will always be a step behind Pacquiao and Barrera

And Marquez is the oldest of the 3 Mexicans anyway. he has aged better. his style is better for a long career. the wars made erik and marco age a lot faster.

Over a HOW OLD Marco? Not that old. He was coming off a really good 6 win streak and notable wins over Erik Morales and Rocky Juarez twice. Sure he was past his prime, but still he looked good in most of those bouts. Kinda like De La Hoya and Mayweather except Barrera was actually active. He also has good wins over good people like Manuel Medina, Robbie Peden, Dereck Gainer, etc.

Concise decision over MAB (that morons bitch and whine about being close because they don't know how to score a fight without a knockdown or KO) or Manuel Medina. It will soon be a great victory over Joel Casamayor. Why? I'm not going to bother stating the dodgy fights with Pac. BTW: I guarantee that after the Casa fight all the Pac fans will state that the Casa fight is not a good win because Casa was old. Just wait for it. :lol1: The same way you and others will state Marquez is old when they meet again (Pac and Marquez) am i right?

BTW: I guarantee that after the Casa fight all the Pac fans will state that the Casa fight is not a good win because Casa was old. Just wait for it. :lol1: If Pac was fighting Casa and beat him, the HATERS would say the same thing. The HATERS were also saying that before in other threads.

Yes, getting up from 3 knockdowns in the first round, and battling back to deserve a draw (and in many eyes a win) isnt pushing urself when it matters. Hell, Marquez clearly beat Barrera and many many people think he holds 2 wins over Pacquiao, myself included. I know what he means, it's because Marquez is a pure counter puncher. He relies on other's mistakes, he doesn't press the fight with anything other than the jab and sometimes when he can throw something else, he doesn't. Hard to watch at times but he's an excellent counter puncher too. 2 wins vs Pac? lol maybe you meant 2 loses.

Marquez MUST learn how stop smooching the canvas everytime he face Pac in order to win.

He's pushed himself plenty in the 2 fights against Pacquiao and many believe he won the 2nd fight. I believe he will beat Casamayor when they fight and I see that setting up the third match between these 2 warriors.

Pac vs Marquez 1 was a draw. But if that 1 judge score the 1st round correctly(like the MAB-Juarez 1 fight), Pac would have won by split decision. Even Lederman and Merchant had Pac winning. Pac vs Marquez 2, because of the knockdown, Pac won by split decision. There are boxing medias that scored it for JMM, but they also said that it was a closed fight that could have gone either way. Well it went Pac's way. They also said that the judges decision must stand and respected. They also said that the decison was not a robbery. Even the fans said this in the threads after the rematch. JMM might be the better techinical skills, but Pac's power is just 1 point better.

If this thread was initiated about 2 years ago, I would highly agree. Marquez was supposed to dominate Juarez and John so thoroughly, yet came up short. But as of late, JMM has turned it up offensively. It remains to be seen if he can truly dominate an opponent the way Morales, MAB (in their prime) and Manny did. However, there's no denying his skills and toughness. My idea of closing the show isn't just winning against Manny in the eyes of majority of the people. I hope he learns to close the show by going for the kill instead of counterpunching an opponent to death when he's already hurt.

What is Marquez' very best win? The biggest win of his career? Concise decision over MAB (that morons bitch and whine about being close because they don't know how to score a fight without a knockdown or KO) or Manuel Medina. It will soon be a great victory over Joel Casamayor. Why? I'm not going to bother stating the dodgy fights with Pac. BTW: I guarantee that after the Casa fight all the Pac fans will state that the Casa fight is not a good win because Casa was old. Just wait for it. :lol1:

MAB beat Marquez. MAB droped him and didn't get the call and after taking another swing at him got a point taken away. MAB cleary won that in my opinion. As for MAb against Pacman. MAB seemed scared the 2nd time. The 1st fight seem to have had an effect on him. Christ! You really think MAB got the decision? You should really try and learn how to score boxing. Even if the knock down had been called properly, Marquez still should have won. Just because you don't like a fighter doesn't mean the punches he lands and scores with don't count. That's not how boxing works I'm afraid. There is so much talk of Marquez would have won if he had KO'd Manny. How the hell did Manny win if he didn't KO Marquez? After all, Marquez was the champ and the opponent has to take the belt from the champ. That certainly didn't happen. Wasn't Pac the one that is meant to knock everyone out? If he showed he wanted to win so badly how come he lost the championship rounds in their second fight? Marquez was also thirty three in those fights and yet he still showed he was the one who wanted it more by winning the championship rounds. You guys really need to get some perspective. This whole Pac thing has got you all spinning loops. "Pac knocks everyone out! He is the best ever and Marquez is shit because he didn't KO Pac in their fights!" Wait a second...:thinking:...so Marquez is shit because he couldn't KO Pac when he is a counter puncher and Pac is the KO fighter? So, what does that make Pac when he couldn't KO Marquez?

i don't think it's threatened. most don't like the fact that he gives manny problems. a lot of manny fans think manny is the greatest thing since sliced bread. the people that disagree with them will more than likely bring marquez up and that's what irks a lot of manny fans. manny can ko morales , ko larios , ko solis , ko diaz......even if he ko's hatton , someone will always bring up the marquez draw and the marquez "loss" and it bugs them. it's like with kobe fans. kobe can win mvp , kobe can singlehandedly get them to the playoffs , kobe can win scoring titles , kobe could lead the votes to the all star game......and when someone says he hasn't won a title without shaq , kobe fans go nuts. me? i have my own personal reasons to dislike the maricon. Great post Left Hook. That is exactly what i think too. To Manny fans he is GOD able to knock everyone out.

The Marquez brothers are crybaby bitches lol raf's not that bad. i like raf.

The Marquez brothers are crybaby bitches

The Norwood fight was shit, but Marquez clearly won. The John fight wasn't even close. I struggled to give two rounds to John, one round I gave to him all on a punch he landed. The Barrera fight wasn't close, at all. The first Pacquiao fight was a clinic, apart from the first round and 2nd round I gave all the rest to Marquez. The 2nd Pac was just the same as the first with out the 3 KDs in the first. don't argue with me. argue with him. i'm just stating the 4 or 5 i think that they are referring to. i have no interest in arguing over marquez's close wins/losses.

Who and how? :ugh: i can only think of 4 maybe 5. the fights that could be said were close were norwood , john , pacquiao 1 and 2. others think the barrera fight was could've gone either way as well. i don't agree with marqeuz losing all of those fights though.

Typical hate thread. Marquez is undefeated in many peoples eyes. 53-0. He's 47-6 in just as many peoples eyes. Hence the discussion

theres as much "close" decisions that have gone the way of the counterpuncher...(see mayweather-castillo) oh and 99% of close fights are clear...the boxing establishment just likes to justify everything... i agree. see this is why sometimes i'd rather argue my side on my own rather than argue on the same side as others. i never said close decisions are exclusive to counterpunchers. i never said you have to try to ko an opponent to win conclusively. (joel koed katsidis. was his win conclusive? i can argue michael should be the favorite in a rematch) my point was out of the other great feathers , marquez's style is more prone to a close decision or a bad decision. when you're a counterpuncher you wait for your opponent to come in , you're at a slight disadvantage with a judge that favors aggressiveness. in a close round a counterpuncher is at a handicap with a judge that favors aggressiveness because the other guy is coming in. i never said anything about marquez not trying to win or juan losing because he doesn't go for a ko. he's a counterpuncher he gets his ko's when the opponent gives him an opening. sometimes you don't get that opening.

theres as much "close" decisions that have gone the way of the counterpuncher...(see mayweather-castillo) oh and 99% of close fights are clear...the boxing establishment just likes to justify everything... Its a sport with infinite intangibles. You take any trio of judges scorecards on any close fight, rearrange their seating, show em the exact same fight and i guarantee you'd get a different outcome

guys , please don't confuse me with the other guys posts. i never really said anything about not going for a ko or not trying to win the fight. the point i was trying to make , although from the response i might have not stated it correctly , is that marquez's style is conducive to a decision being wrong or not in his favor. can i at least get some agreement on that. a close fight is a close fight no matter the styles but juan ma's is more conducive to those kind of bad decisions or pick 'em type decisions. you don't have to ko somebody for it to be conclusive. theres as much "close" decisions that have gone the way of the counterpuncher...(see mayweather-castillo) oh and 99% of close fights are clear...the boxing establishment just likes to justify everything...