Mayweather/Hatton: Shades of Leonard/Duran I?

esteban de Jesus defeated duran at 135, while he was in his prime.:ugh: are you saying floyd had less skill then esteban de jesus:nonono: duran was beaten in his prime weight floyd has never been defeated at any weight. duran had 12 title defenses for his entire career, floyd has 11. floyd would box circles around duran who hated movement you forget no mas and the de jesus fights:ugh: esteban de jesus was probably the third best lightweight around that era it was carlos ortiz,duran than dejesus,you don't know much about him cause he fucked his life with drugs and duran avenged that loss twice.

its clear imo that the puncher in this fight is ricky. pbf wont hang around long enough to set his feet and deliver knock out shots... he'll just be throwing scoring shots. i think he knows that going toe to toe with ricky would be falling straight into rickys gameplan and a fighter as smart as floyd wont risk it. pride isn't something that has got in his way before with fights, he's all business Let's set the record straight. Hatton is NOT a great puncher. The only people he has knocked out are inferior. lower level competition. For God's sake, he couldn't even hurt Eamon McGee and was floored by him. No way Hatton will knock out Floyd or even hurt him. Those alleged vicious body shots had no effect on Juan Urango, Luis Collazo or Kostya Tyszu, the only quality fighters (Castillo was old and washed up) he has fought and they won't affect Mayweather. The only way Hatton wins this fight is if Mayweather lays on the ropes with his hands down and lets Hatton hit him. That's what most of you guys consider to be going toe to toe. It won't happen and Hatton won't hurt Mayweather.

I think why a lot of greats are considered that way is because most of them fought and beat other greats, several times in some cases. They weren't concerned with perfect records and because of that the overwhelming majority didn't end up with one. Part of Mayweather's problem is he hasn't fought and beaten any prime hall of famers, and in doing just enough to win, in a lot of fights has looked less than spectacular against somewhat ordinary fighters. Would be nice to see him fight the matchups people want like Cotto and Williams, maybe even Mosley, to erase more question marks in people's minds. That is why I have no problem with people saying Floyd is overrated. He has more to prove, he has one half of the equation, the all time great skills. He needs to beat the names that will have his accomplishments be just as good if not better than his skill-set. Nothing wrong with more to prove and it will be proven sooner or later.

Skillwise the difference between Duran and Hatton is much bigger than between SRl and Floyd, even though Leonard was better tha Floyd, exspecially @WW. But Duran had a great defense, very underrated. Rick is not very hard to hit. I think thats the main difference. But anyway Floyd would never fight a fight like Sugar Ray did against Duran. He is very much a safety-first-fighter.

I never said he wasn't people overrate him TO AN EXTENT. Saying he is the greatest of all time is overrating him, saying he can't hang with some of the best because they are so great is overrating THEM. I think why a lot of greats are considered that way is because most of them fought and beat other greats, several times in some cases. They weren't concerned with perfect records and because of that the overwhelming majority didn't end up with one. Part of Mayweather's problem is he hasn't fought and beaten any prime hall of famers, and in doing just enough to win, in a lot of fights has looked less than spectacular against somewhat ordinary fighters. Would be nice to see him fight the matchups people want like Cotto and Williams, maybe even Mosley, to erase more question marks in people's minds.

bernard hopkins in a interview with boxing scene predicts this fight go turn out to be a leonard-duran fight.

what im saying is that on this site i dont have to prove anything about being rational, it means shit in all reality, but its just as trivial to say im being rational for the sake of being rational, come on man, dont nitpick my argument. That was the only riff I had with the argument actually. I feel Duran at 135 would defeat Floyd just because he is that damn good. I felt your argument was plausible and that "stature on the internet" caught my eye. Busting your chops budd, just busting your chops.

Glad you finally realize it.:banana: I never said he wasn't people overrate him TO AN EXTENT. Saying he is the greatest of all time is overrating him, saying he can't hang with some of the best because they are so great is overrating THEM.

Oh Floyd is overrated as well Glad you finally realize it.:banana:

You made a hell of an argument but stature on the internet? I think not. what im saying is that on this site i dont have to prove anything about being rational, it means shit in all reality, but its just as trivial to say im being rational for the sake of being rational, come on man, dont nitpick my argument.

Yeah, you're right, Sugar Ray Leonard was over rated and Floyd is not.:ugh: Oh Floyd is overrated as well but not to the extent of these "supermen" from yesteryear.

I love how people overrate fighters from yesteryear. Yeah, you're right, Sugar Ray Leonard was over rated and Floyd is not.:ugh:

Thats fuckin load of bullshit, i dont know if you notice, but i tend to avoid arguing for page after page if i feel i said what i need to say. Basically like i said, either you know Duran at 135 or you dont, Duran was fast, Duran had head movement and at 135, The Hands Of Stone is easily the most powerful, aggressive puncher at that weight. Even Pernell Whitaker had his doubts about coming out on top against Duran when he gave an interview post Judah/Cotto on Espn. I shouldnt have to give you info on an all time great like Duran, his outstanding record of 72-1 at lightweight should speak for itself. Basically i know how you argue, which is why i normally under most circumstances, dont waste more than 3 or 4 posts of my time on anyone who i know is going to just run me in circles. I have been here for years, someone of my stature doesnt need to prove that im rational or anything like that, but i know Duran, and if you knew him you wouldnt even ask me anything about "styles" or any other factor because you would have seen and known that Duran at 135 is absolutely awesome, moreso than any other fighter all time at that weight. He was so aggressive and so fast that Mayweather would easily be a 2 or 3-1 underdog in that fight because Duran would match him in every category. Just because i dont give you some immediate response doesnt mean im backing out, i think i try not to make the mistake alot of you make, arguing the same shit over and over and over page after page, if i feel i have made my point, then i will leave it at that, dont fuckin sit here and question why i say what i say about Duran. You made a hell of an argument but stature on the internet? I think not.

That was quite literally the funniest thing I have ever heard. especially when you think of his recent pictures

Thats the thing. I don't care if the Oscar pics were real or not. But YOU do for some reason. I've never seen them. Don't know and really don't care. Whatever floats your boat. I only give a shit about what happens in the ring. The rest is for bitches gossiping about this or that. So tell me, Hatton fanbois, how does a picture with Duran equate with ANYTHING to do with Dec 8th? Nothing. I'll give you this though.. You will never see Duran saying "NO MAS" at a buffet table. Duran is savage at those Las Vegas all you can eat specials like a muthafuca.. That was quite literally the funniest thing I have ever heard.

Leonard>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mayweather I love how people overrate fighters from yesteryear.

Floyd can't even put Arturo Gatti on the canvas. I don't do the triangular logic in general but if Floyd couldn't put down Gatti (who has been knocked down dozens of times) when Gatti was essentially target practise, how would he put down Hatton, who has been knocked down once in his entire career and is harder to hit than Arturo? Didn't watch the fight to closely now did you. Floyd punched on his toes even while he was tagging Gatti up he was defensive. If he sat down on his punches it would have been a different story.

The non-responsiveness of "Black Jesus" seems to confirm what I initially suggested. That he's merely trying to appeal to consensus because he thinks that it's rational to do though he himself can't seem to justify it on his own terms, which points to someone who is a follower, instead of a thinker or analyzer. Quite rude of you also to avoid my follow up questions and instead babble on with another generalized assertion with your brain dead circular reasoning but I guess in ways boxing can be compared to religious faith. Thats fuckin load of bullshit, i dont know if you notice, but i tend to avoid arguing for page after page if i feel i said what i need to say. Basically like i said, either you know Duran at 135 or you dont, Duran was fast, Duran had head movement and at 135, The Hands Of Stone is easily the most powerful, aggressive puncher at that weight. Even Pernell Whitaker had his doubts about coming out on top against Duran when he gave an interview post Judah/Cotto on Espn. I shouldnt have to give you info on an all time great like Duran, his outstanding record of 72-1 at lightweight should speak for itself. Basically i know how you argue, which is why i normally under most circumstances, dont waste more than 3 or 4 posts of my time on anyone who i know is going to just run me in circles. I have been here for years, someone of my stature doesnt need to prove that im rational or anything like that, but i know Duran, and if you knew him you wouldnt even ask me anything about "styles" or any other factor because you would have seen and known that Duran at 135 is absolutely awesome, moreso than any other fighter all time at that weight. He was so aggressive and so fast that Mayweather would easily be a 2 or 3-1 underdog in that fight because Duran would match him in every category. Just because i dont give you some immediate response doesnt mean im backing out, i think i try not to make the mistake alot of you make, arguing the same shit over and over and over page after page, if i feel i have made my point, then i will leave it at that, dont fuckin sit here and question why i say what i say about Duran.

The non-responsiveness of "Black Jesus" seems to confirm what I initially suggested. That he's merely trying to appeal to consensus because he thinks that it's rational to do though he himself can't seem to justify it on his own terms, which points to someone who is a follower, instead of a thinker or analyzer. Quite rude of you also to avoid my follow up questions and instead babble on with another generalized assertion with your brain dead circular reasoning but I guess in ways boxing can be compared to religious faith.

Please justify this logically instead of making overgeneralized assertions that would be otherwise, ridiculous to a boxing novice. What makes Duran beatable 5 pounds higher at 140, but not 135? Especially concerning a Floyd Mayweather whose natural weight class is arguably 135 anyways? ^In other words and in Layman's terms, who did Duran beat at 135 who was better or as good as Floyd Mayweather, that would compell you to make such a claim so confidently?