The Part About Loma-Teo Nobody Is Talking About

[BoxingIsGreat]

i believe bob never really wanted this fight nor does he...and i kinda get it...it almost doesnt make sense from a promotional company standpoint although im sure you can make an argument that either guy winning wont hurt anything also

the thing i hate reading, which comes from the usual suspects who defend anything involving an EE fighter that they need to live vicariously through, is this...."lopez talks alot of ****...if he wants to back it up just take the money and back it up in the ring"

the list of guys who take short money just to get a fight made is very small...and its not wise...even if youre 100 percent confident youll win it doesnt mean you have to take less than you feel you are worth(within reason).....the momentum and hype for this fight has been building and building......lopez isnt going to take less in this situation...he also isnt fighting floyd, canelo or pac here....while this fight will raise his standing(especially by winnning) it isnt that big of a profile raise to take less money in the event of an L...

The bold: This is what it's all about, and I'll speak out on it every time I see it. Green K.

[koolkc107]

i believe bob never really wanted this fight nor does he...and i kinda get it...it almost doesnt make sense from a promotional company standpoint although im sure you can make an argument that either guy winning wont hurt anything also

the thing i hate reading, which comes from the usual suspects who defend anything involving an EE fighter that they need to live vicariously through, is this...."lopez talks alot of ****...if he wants to back it up just take the money and back it up in the ring"

the list of guys who take short money just to get a fight made is very small...and its not wise...even if youre 100 percent confident youll win it doesnt mean you have to take less than you feel you are worth(within reason).....the momentum and hype for this fight has been building and building......lopez isnt going to take less in this situation...he also isnt fighting floyd, canelo or pac here....while this fight will raise his standing(especially by winnning) it isnt that big of a profile raise to take less money in the event of an L...

Bob doesn't want this fight until it makes money.

If Teo accepts the lowball, Arum "makes" the money he should have payed out.

But, what Arum really wants is to wait till folks can by tickets and order subscriptions or ppv.

This scenario is perfect from where he sits because he comes out ahead either way.

Either the fight dies, ESPN steps in with more cash to placate Teo, or Arum gets to push it to next year.

[Afi23]

To me, Teo has a better argument to ask for more than 1,2 mil than Callum Smith asking for more than 5 mil.

[BoxingIsGreat]

As I said in another thread, pay the man and we have a fight. I'm thinking 2.5 mil min. Arum needs to go to the vault for this one.

[Curt Henning]

Bob doesn't want this fight until it makes money.

If Teo accepts the lowball, Arum "makes" the money he should have payed out.

But, what Arum really wants is to wait till folks can by tickets and order subscriptions or ppv.

This scenario is perfect from where he sits because he comes out ahead either way.

Either the fight dies, ESPN steps in with more cash to placate Teo, or Arum gets to push it to next year.

i agree with exactly what you say....i think thats exactly why he dismissed pac/crawford when he still had pac....

just not too sure pushing it till next year is an option....so i think either the fight dies or espn steps in to save it.....personally i think it dies

[Afi23]

Bob doesn't want this fight until it makes money.

If Teo accepts the lowball, Arum "makes" the money he should have payed out.

But, what Arum really wants is to wait till folks can by tickets and order subscriptions or ppv.

This scenario is perfect from where he sits because he comes out ahead either way.

Either the fight dies, ESPN steps in with more cash to placate Teo, or Arum gets to push it to next year.

I agree with you, Loma has not shown enough slippage for the "pass the baton fight to the younger generation" fight.
Bob most likely does not want to risk Loma vs Teo where he can't squeeze the most money out of it and risk a Loma L in the process especially if he feels like Loma can still raise his own stock (and win) vs the likes of Haney, Ryan and Tank.

[koolkc107]

Here's the math again, for those of you who missed it or don't get it. I'm going to use 2 different metrics. The first is based on what past champions Loma faced got, the second is based on career high peak viewership, since neither Lopez or Loma has done a US ppv (Loma has done British ppv once but the numbers were pretty bad and there's nothing to compare to for Lopez)

1) Linares got 1 million to Loma's 1.2 million. That's about a 55/45 split. Pedraza got 1 million to Loma's 2 million. That's about a 65/35 split. Both Linares and Pedraza had losses, Loma was a challenger to Linares while Pedraza was a unification. Lopez is undefeated; and while Lopez is probably more of a draw than both, for argument's sake let's slot Teo in between the other two champions. That would mean Teo should get 40%. The total pot for Loma/Lopez appears to be 4.45 million. 40% of that is about 1.8 million, meaning that by this metric Arum is lowballing Lopez by over half a million dollars.

2) Lomachenko's career peak viewership came against Pedraza. It was a little over 2 million people watching. Lopez's career peak viewership came against Commey. It was at over 1.4 million. That is 3.4 million viewers total. 2 million of 3.4 million viewers comes in right under 59%. 1.4 million of 3.4 million viewers comes in right over 41%. Again, it seems that based on peak viewership, a 60/40 split is in order and that the 1.2 million dollars being offered to Lopez is about half a million dollars short.

Hope this helps...

[Citizen Koba]

Here's the math again, for those of you who missed it or don't get it. I'm going to use 2 different metrics. The first is based on what past champions Loma faced got, the second is based on career high peak viewership, since neither Lopez or Loma has done a US ppv (Loma has done British ppv once but the numbers were pretty bad and there's nothing to compare to for Lopez)

1) Linares got 1 million to Loma's 1.2 million. That's about a 55/45 split. Pedraza got 1 million to Loma's 2 million. That's about a 65/35 split. Both Linares and Pedraza had losses, Loma was a challenger to Linares while Pedraza was a unification. Lopez is undefeated; and while Lopez is probably more of a draw than both, for argument's sake let's slot Teo in between the other two champions. That would mean Teo should get 40%. The total pot for Loma/Lopez appears to be 4.45 million. 40% of that is about 1.8 million, meaning that by this metric Arum is lowballing Lopez by over half a million dollars.

2) Lomachenko's career peak viewership came against Pedraza. It was a little over 2 million people watching. Lopez's career peak viewership came against Commey. It was at over 1.4 million. That is 3.4 million viewers total. 2 million of 3.4 million viewers comes in right under 59%. 1.4 million of 3.4 million viewers comes in right over 41%. Again, it seems that based on peak viewership, a 60/40 split is in order and that the 1.2 million dollars being offered to Lopez is about half a million dollars short.

Hope this helps...

I like the approach - breaking down the numbers, although I would point out that Teo - Commey was co-main and that a significant part of the viewership could have been driven by Crawford. So as yet Teo has not proven he's a draw on his own, certainly not with consistency. Furthermore that Teo vs Loma is much more akin to Loma vs Pedraza - a unification - than it is to Loma vs Linares (where Loma was a challenger) except in this case the trinkets are even more in Lomachenko's favour obviously since he's now unified.

Aside from that though I kinda see it somewhat like you, Bob ain't really got too much motivation to pay Teo more than he's offering... he ain't wanting to lose money and if Teo walks it's not the end of the world either. Fight can be made later for more money, or at worst it never gets made and Teo moves up, neither star takes an L and Loma fights Teo's successor for the IBF instead.

Based on the reasoning I gave above though, I'm more inclined to see 33/66 as fair... roughly $1.5 mil to $3mil in favour of Loma, but at the end of the day it's down to each fighter (and their team) to decide what he's worth and what a fight is worth to him. Ain't gonna fault a dude for trying to get the most he can for his services. Only time will tell whether choices were wise or not.

[koolkc107]

I like the approach - breaking down the numbers, although I would point out that Teo - Commey was not the main event and that a significant part of the viewership could have been driven by Crawford. Furthermore that Teo vs Loma is much more akin to Loma vs Pedraza - a unification - than it is to Loma vs Linares (where Loma was a challenger) except in this case the trinkets are even more in Lomachenko's favour obviously since he's now unified.

Aside from that though I kinda see it somewhat like you, Bob ain't really got too much motivation to pay Teo more than he's offering... he ain't wanting to lose money and if Teo walks it's not the end of the world either. Fight can be made later for more money, or at worst it never gets made and Teo moves up, neither star takes an L and Loma fights Teo's successor for the IBF instead.

Based on the reasoning I gave above though, I'm more inclined to see 33/66 as fair... roughly $1.5 mil to $3mil in favour of Loma, but at the end of the day it's down to each fighter (and their team) to decide what he's worth and what a fight is worth to him. Ain't gonna fault a dude for trying to get the most he can for his services. Only time will tell whether choices were wise or not.

All of what you said is valid.

Lopez's peak DID come on an undercard.

33% is about what Pedraza got and you could make an argument for that...but, Lopez is undefeated and more popular than Jose. That's why I slotted him between the two champions in the first metric. There's also the fact that almost 3 million people tuned in to watch the Heisman trophy presentation right before Loma v Pedraza. But, I used that instead of the next highest because I wanted best case scenarios. So, that kind of balances out the fact that Lopez's peak was as an undercard fight.

But, the point here is that Arum is offering closer to 25%. That's a lowball on purpose and, if you're Teofimo, it's worse when you look across the aisle and see Loma offered a career high payday. Where's the pandemic excuse for him?

[Citizen Koba]

All of what you said is valid.

Lopez's peak DID come on an undercard.

33% is about what Pedraza got and you could make an argument for that...but, Lopez is undefeated and more popular than Jose. That's why I slotted him between the two champions in the first metric. There's also the fact that almost 3 million people tuned in to watch the Heisman trophy presentation right before Loma v Pedraza. But, I used that instead of the next highest because I wanted best case scenarios. So, that kind of balances out the fact that Lopez's peak was as an undercard fight.

But, the point here is that Arum is offering closer to 25%. That's a lowball on purpose and, if you're Teofimo, it's worse when you look across the aisle and see Loma offered a career high payday. Where's the pandemic excuse for him?

Honestly dunno... not sure what if any guarantees Loma and Teo have got or how the offers made stand relative to those guarantees. Undoubtedly there's a budget to work to and could be Bobs offering both guys a similar amount in proportion to their minimums so I ain't necessarily gonna call it a deliberate lowball without full knowledge. Like I say though I do agree with the thrust of your argument that Bob's effectively created a no-lose, which is - of course - what he should be doing when judged as a businessman.

For the same reason I'm not gonna be calling Teo a 'duck' or whatever else, cos far as I'm concerned every fighter has the right to decide what they are worth and what a fight is worth to them - although for PR purposes Teo might consider going a little lighter on the smack talk in future if he elects to hold out and the fight doesn't get made. Probably a lesson all fighters gotta confront at some point though.