Why do people say Canelo and Floyd were taking risks

[GhostofDempsey]

Re the GGG fights for Canelo...is it really a risk to take those fights when you know you can/will probably go 12...and once you go 12 you will be given the W if at all possible, and at worst you have a draw.

And you make twice as much for those fights as your other fights...similar with Kovalev...he knew he could go 12 with Kov so the pressure was off...and as we saw the cards at the time of stoppage, that fight was in the bag regardless as well.

Similar story with Jacobs...not saying there is NO risk...but certainly the risk was much reduced.

IDK, what if Canelo never fought GGG? Fans would say he never risked anything, ducked him. It's obvious that there is corruption in boxing, and judges turned in scandalous scorecards, but there was always that risk that GGG could have stopped him inside the distance, or that Canelo suffers a debilitating injury that stops the fight.

Now that he has a guaranteed contract, he can cherry-pick the remainder of his fights. If he doesn't like his mandatory, just dump the title and he still earns $36M+. He is the shot-caller now, so he can demand weight limits, re-hydration clauses, gloves, ring size, referee, etc. Same way Floyd had his guardian angels judging and reffing fights, Canelo will be extended the same privilege.

[Boxing_1013]

He ducked Ward. GGG was already building HBO noise since 2011 that they were curious for a Ward matchup given their backgrounds. That all predates Canelo Alvarez.

GGG is nothing without Canelo, and as a boxing fan who cares if Canelo makes significantly more than GGG or GGGs fans using money as an excuse to not pursue ATG themes.

If GGG beat BJS in Kazakhstan for Undisputed it would have boosted Gennadiy’s value with A side. All Middleweights would have to see GGG if they wanted a belt, including Canelo. Unless Canelo would’ve skipped 160 to 168. That didn’t happen because GGG knew who his master was. GGG never took risks.

I like to deal with facts or likely scenarios...this is from Ward in 2013:

"As for me and Golovkin, look at my body of work. I'll fight anyone out there. But look at his body of work and look at mine. There is no comparison. I fought the last three years with no break. I've been in grind mode. Let him build up his resume, get a body of work first, then we can talk."

https://www.si.com/mma/2013/01/18/gennady-golovkin

As for GGG taking risks...yeah he could have taken more, this is true...you could say that about just about anyone.

[Thuglife Nelo]

I like to deal with facts or likely scenarios...this is from Ward in 2013:

"As for me and Golovkin, look at my body of work. I'll fight anyone out there. But look at his body of work and look at mine. There is no comparison. I fought the last three years with no break. I've been in grind mode. Let him build up his resume, get a body of work first, then we can talk."

https://www.si.com/mma/2013/01/18/gennady-golovkin

As for GGG taking risks...yeah he could have taken more, this is true...you could say that about just about anyone.

No. We base P4P with resume and risk taking. That’s not “anyone” or everyone

[Boxing_1013]

We are in the network exclusive deal era my friend. Floyd, Canelo, ODH, Manny, GGG, Tyson, Cotto, etc don't get paid to fight they get paid to win and perform. The networks aren't concerned with quality of opponent as much as they are ratings/ppv sales/views.

Hell Floyd and Canelo, if you think about it, are more like a Vegas show then pro fighters. They fight 2x a year and they are responsible for making Las Vegas the 2 biggest paydays of the year. Vegas wants those 2 paydays every year.

I understand your point but this isn't 1980 when NBC, ABC and CBS had to bid on fights so they paid more for the best fights. There is also plenty of money to be made outside of the US. SO if you have an AJ, you can monetize him against bums just like you can against the best guys.

I don't think the fighters are to blame. IMO, if Canelo and Floyd were in the 1980's era and got paid more to fight better guys, they'd fight better guys all the time.

I hear ya man...I don't think we are really disagreeing.

In my mind I don't really hate on Canelo or Floyd...they are both great fighters..I haven't seen all of Floyd's fights (Maidana fights/ODLH) but I felt he beat Pac 8-4 easy and JLC was 7-5 to Floyd or 6-6.

Canelo has a couple losses imo to GGG but I felt he beat Lara 7-5 and Jacobs 7-5...he and Floyd are definitely great fighters and are just playing the role in which they find themselves.

As you pretty much said, it would be really ****** for them to face a tougher fight for maybe less money...I just get a little tired of the current Canelo fan posts talking about how much risk he is taking.

How much risk is it really when you know you will go 12 rounds, and if you do, you know you are going to win.

I agree about AJ as well...he is another example...imho he didn't want the Wilder fight for the longest time because he knew how risky it was and how it could very likely derail his gravy train...not to mention he was probably a little scared as well.

I view AJ's 'run' similarly...they are lining up solid enough names but there isn't a ton of risk really there for AJ...and for good reason...he lost to a 30-1 underdog and is not in the same league as Canelo or Floyd as far as pfp quality.

[Boxing_1013]

No. We base P4P with resume and risk taking. That’s not “anyone” or everyone

OK and only an over the top Canelo fan would really say that the fights he is taking, are risk taking fights.

They are very calculated fights...fight BJS in the UK if he wants to get credit for taking risks.

[Thuglife Nelo]

OK and only an over the top Canelo fan would really say that the fights he is taking, are risk taking fights.

They are very calculated fights...fight BJS in the UK if he wants to get credit for taking risks.

Nobody cares about that. Fury stopped Wilder in Vegas. Why wouldn’t BJS want to do that?

You haven’t learned the concept of A-side. If Canelo wants to fight in Vegas for his fans which made $17mil gate in 2019, why would he go to the UK for the B-side for this fictional “risk theory.”

You keep getting sonned, shun!

[Boxing_1013]

Nobody cares about that. Fury stopped Wilder in Vegas. Why wouldn’t BJS want to do that?

You haven’t learned the concept of A-side. If Canelo wants to fight in Vegas for his fans which made $17mil gate in 2019, why would he go to the UK for the B-side for this fictional “risk theory.”

You keep getting sonned, shun!

You keep thinking that maximizing revenue = taking risks...and it doesn't...they are basically mutually exclusive in today's boxing.

Not saying Canelo sucks either...he is better pfp than Wilder so is unlikely to get stopped by anyone at 168 or below..especially as he will put in weight clauses if needed...and no one is going to outweigh him by 40 pounds like Fury did with Wilder.

[Citizen Koba]

I do think Floyd was a bit less protected at the lower weights...and to that end he was in more risky fights...even with all of his fights being 'at home' at the lower weights, his work there imo was very impressive.

To compete (well) as high as he and Pac did weight wise, is still pretty crazy to me.

Found this great Mannix article on the early days with Floyd and TR and Bruce Trampler matchmaking...

In the early days, Floyd always wanted fights. “He had a fire and passion for his trade,” says duBoef. In January of 1997, duBoef recalls a phone call from Mayweather. He had just stopped Jerry Cooper and was itching to return. The problem: Top Rank didn’t have much for him. The company had a show in Chula Vista, Calif. in February but barely had $2,000 to pay him. Mayweather didn’t care. He took the fight and stopped Edgar Ayala in the second round. “That taught me a lot about him,” says duBoef. “Inherently, he’s a fighter. He just loved it. He loved to train and he loved being in the ring.”

https://www.si.com/boxing/2015/04/27/top-rank-1996-olympics-floyd-mayweather-manny-pacquiao-bruce-trampler

Gives a wholy different picture of Floyd from the Money May persona we came to know in his later career, but then I suspect that may be just a kinda part of life... as young men we're driven foremost by our egos and vanity and things like fame and glory are at the front of our minds... then we start to get older, start to figure out how the world works, we maybe take on a little cynicism. And for a boxer, later still, maybe in your 30s with the end of your career closing in you're gonna be thinking about securing the futurespecially if you ain't one of the blessed few like Floyd, Oscar or Canelo, who's already made enough for 5 lifetimes.

I mean, the risk reward equation probably looks quite different to someone who already has generational wealth to someone whose career could well stall into oblivion on low paid undercards with an L.

[Thuglife Nelo]

You keep thinking that maximizing revenue = taking risks...and it doesn't...

Me thinking? You’re the one that acknowledged GGG not fighting a seasoned Middleweight in BJS for Undisputed and all the belts and instead chose to “maximize revenue” by fighting Canelo. You said that. Canelo always made bank without GGG or BJS, so by fighting them he took the risks. GGG never fought Ward or the mythical “168 is easy for me.” BJS ducked Andrade when the mandate was ordered from the WBO. BJS decided to go north.

[Boxing_1013]

IDK, what if Canelo never fought GGG? Fans would say he never risked anything, ducked him. It's obvious that there is corruption in boxing, and judges turned in scandalous scorecards, but there was always that risk that GGG could have stopped him inside the distance, or that Canelo suffers a debilitating injury that stops the fight.

Now that he has a guaranteed contract, he can cherry-pick the remainder of his fights. If he doesn't like his mandatory, just dump the title and he still earns $36M+. He is the shot-caller now, so he can demand weight limits, re-hydration clauses, gloves, ring size, referee, etc. Same way Floyd had his guardian angels judging and reffing fights, Canelo will be extended the same privilege.

I agree that facing GGG especially was still somewhat of a risk for Canelo...I just don't think it was as big of one as some make it out to be...I picked GGG to stop Canelo in fight 1, largely because I didn't think Canelo could or would be able to employ the same gameplan Jacobs did vs GGG...but he was able to pull it off and lasted 12 rounds...I don't think he really came to fight though, and I think he knew after watching the Jacobs fight that he could do similar and at least go 12.

Fair play to Canelo in fight 2, he came to fight but still lost imho...but he also had the experience of fight 1 under his belt, so knew what to expect vs GGG more than most would.

So yeah I do give Canelo credit for facing GGG, though I do feel he waited until he knew he could go 12.