Heavyweight Lineal Champions by TBRB/CBZ

**boliodogs** · 10-30-2019, 01:10 PM

I think lineal is a bunch of BS but I would accept their version as accurate. I like the part where they give Fury the title but then take it away from him as they should. Tyson was lineal but he vacated in 2015-2016 and is NOT lineal champion today. It pisses me off every time the ESPN call Fury the lineal champ as if he still is the lineal champ when he is NOT the lineal champ today. Ring does not consider him lineal either. Fury may have deserved to the win over Wilder but he got a draw so he is champion of nothing today and is not now part of the lineal race until he gets a world title. If the AJ vs Ruiz winner fights the WBC champ the winner of that fight would be the lineal heavyweight champ.

**The Big Dunn** · 10-30-2019, 01:17 PM

I think this is accurate. Fury can't keep the lineal title when he is coked up and in rehab. The winner of ruiz/Aj vs the winner of wilder/fury 2 should decide the next lineage IMO.

**famicommander** · 10-30-2019, 01:18 PM

Yes. They are the keepers of the REAL world championship.

Everybody else awards a title.

**Marchegiano** · 10-30-2019, 01:55 PM

Thanks buds!

I was in a rush this morning but I should have said, this is to help me with research into lineal itself and who, after sullivan-johnson, took control of what lineal means.

I appreciate you inputs. There's no wrong answer, no trolling or looking to argue here, just public opinion gathering. Thanks again.

**Marchegiano** · 10-30-2019, 01:58 PM

Originally posted by famicommander

Yes. They are the keepers of the REAL world championship.

Everybody else awards a title.

Does that mean they only recognize lineal champions?

**Citizen Koba** · 10-30-2019, 02:22 PM

Originally posted by Marchegiano

Does mean they only recognize lineal champions?

Charter – Transnational Boxing Rankings Board

https://www.tbrb.org/charter/

6. The Transnational Boxing Rankings Board Championship Policy

I. When a champion retires or abdicates, the first-ranked contender must fight the second-ranked contender to become champion. Lesser contenders do not constitute the best, and the fact that they are allowed to compete for open championships by other organizations does not make them so. The gravitas of the true championship will be vitiated no longer. Therefore, no allowances for third, fourth, and fifth-ranked contenders will be made.

II. If, under such circumstances, the first two ranked contenders prove unwilling to fight, the Board will force the issue as much as it deems appropriate.

III. If a champion is inactive in his division, attempts will be made to contact the champion/designee for an official announcement or clarification of his intentions. If none is forthcoming and the champion has not defended his throne after 18 months, and the first- and second-ranked contenders meet, then the official winner may become the rightful successor.

Successions – Men – Transnational Boxing Rankings Board

https://www.tbrb.org/successions/

Successions

The Transnational Boxing Rankings Board stands with those fans and purists who set the true divisional champions apart from the rest. What follows is how and when they got there as well as those recognized since our inception in October 2012. We decided against going all the way back through boxing history. Why? Because the odds don�t favor the Board�s historians agreeing on exhaustive successions nearly as much as they do a debate-gone-bad with flying fists and busted beaks. Collaboration has its limits. We want to stand pat on common ground.

...

This is followed by a list of their current champions and the lineages, which I ain't gonna copy paste here, though the link is worth a look for anyone who's interested.

I ain't really given CBZ a lot of attention so I can't really comment on their stuff.

**Marchegiano** · 10-30-2019, 02:28 PM

Originally posted by boliodogs

I think lineal is a bunch of BS but I would accept their version as accurate. I like the part where they give Fury the title but then take it away from him as they should. Tyson was lineal but he vacated in 2015-2016 and is NOT lineal champion today. It pisses me off every time the ESPN call Fury the lineal champ as if he still is the lineal champ when he is NOT the lineal champ today. Ring does not consider him lineal either. Fury may have deserved to the win over Wilder but he got a draw so he is champion of nothing today and is not now part of the lineal race until he gets a world title. If the AJ vs Ruiz winner fights the WBC champ the winner of that fight would be the lineal heavyweight champ.

Originally posted by The Big Dunn

I think this is accurate. Fury can't keep the lineal title when he is coked up and in rehab. The winner of ruiz/Aj vs the winner of wilder/fury 2 should decide the next lineage IMO.

Honestly not baiting an argument, just curious.

How to you marry the inconsistency with Corbett?

The official TBRB and CBZ lineal list has Corbett from 1892-1897.

In 1895 Corbett retired to go be an actor. Peter Maher fought Corbett's sparring partner Steve O'Donnell for the vacant crown. Peter won by KO, Corbett came into the ring and announced his retirement was final and that Maher was now the champion. The men shook hands, Corbett handed over the title, and went into acting.

Fitzsimmons would whoop Maher just a little while later, in the beginning of 1896

Mid-1896 Corbett returns to boxing with a draw against Sharkey, the HW crown is not on the line.

The end of 1896 would see Fitzsimmons lose the HW crown to a fight most people agree was rigged against him by Wyatt Earp, yes the lawman, gunslinger, Earp. Who ref'd the HW title fight between Fitzsimmons and Tom Sharkey.

Early 1897 Corbett, who has not been champion since 1895 and has even fought without claiming the title in 1896, is now the champion without fighting anyone at all, just by declaring since he never lost in the ring, and, Fitzsimmons is now a challenger who was never a former champion.

1897 Corbett-Fitzsimmons is not seen by TBRB or CBZ as a fight between two former champions but rather a fight between the champion since 1892, unbroken, and a challenger who has never seen the honor of a HW title fight.

Meanwhile Tom Sharkey does not lose a fight from the time he won the title in 1896 until he fights Jeffries in 1898.

This, I'll have ya's take notice by me, is why Jim Jeffries was so loved. He kicked Sharkey's ass in his 9th fight or so then beat up Bob in 1899 and by 1900 had taken Corbett out as well.

So, by Jeffries' era the lineal or lineals with you will are unified, the man who beat the man most certainly is Jeffries.

However, jump forward to 2019 and you're telling me Tyson Fury can not simply vacate and then later re-establish himself as champion without fighting on the grounds he'd never lost in the ring?

That seems very inconsistent considering Tyson Fury is asking much less of us than James Corbett, who you recognize until his loss, not draw against a man with no title, but loss, against a man who'd already lost his title too.

Tyson isn't stripping anyone of their reign. He's not striking a lineage from history, he's just trying to continue on in the same vein as Corbett.

Is it the title that goes back to Sullivan or isn't it?

Again, not trolling, don't mean to piss anyone off, just super curious how TBRB and CBZ fans justify this.

If Tyson Fury retired the title why aren't Peter Maher and Tom Sharkey lineal champions? If Corbett can regain the title because he never lost why can't Tyson?

**QueensburyRules** · 10-30-2019, 02:39 PM

- -Lineal heavy title died with Jeffries retirement.

None of these pretentious lug nuts can convince me otherwise.

There are no rules governing what is lineal.

**Marchegiano** · 10-30-2019, 04:03 PM

Originally posted by QueensburyRules

- -Lineal heavy title died with Jeffries retirement.

None of these pretentious lug nuts can convince me otherwise.

There are no rules governing what is lineal.

No, but there is consensus.

If the lineal died when Jeffries retired why didn't it die when Corbet retired?

Heavyweight Lineal Champions by TBRB/CBZ