Henry Armstrong- Top 5 P4P or overrated due to romanticism?

[Tom Cruise]

See, I was just going off of memory from what I had read so I looked up boxrec and they said he was only recognised champ in california. Is that because only the california title was on the line that night?

Yeah California sanctioned it for their title, but NYSAC didnt due to it being 10 rnds.

Doing some Brec digging:

The other guy who had proper claim to the title was Al Hostak, the NBA champ. But looking at the lineages, NYSAC was the better claim.

Freddie Steele was unified (NBA/NYSAC) champ, he was beaten by Apostoli by KO in a non title 12 rounder, then was stripped by the NYSAC for not defending against Apostoli over the championship distance. Then after winning the vacant title to Young Corbett, Apostoli lost his NYSAC title by KO to Ceferino Garcia.

The titles werent unified again till '41, when Tony Zale beat Georgie Abrams.

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

See, I was just going off of memory from what I had read so I looked up boxrec and they said he was only recognised champ in california. Is that because only the california title was on the line that night?

The fight was recognised as a MW title fight by the California State Athletic Commission, the NYSAC refused to sanction the bout for their title (which Garcia held) as it was not scheduled over 15 rounds.

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

Yeah California sanctioned it for their title, but NYSAC didnt due to it being 10 rnds.

You beat me to it 😂😂

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

Yeah California sanctioned it for their title, but NYSAC didnt due to it being 10 rnds.

The other guy who had proper claim to the title was Al Hostak, the NBA champ.

I've never really caught much of Hostak. Only managed to find footage of his first fight with Zale.

[Tom Cruise]

I've never really caught much of Hostak. Only managed to find footage of his first fight with Zale.

He's just a name on Boxrec to me. Looks like a solid fighter world level fighter judging by the names he fought. Maybe lucky to have won the NBA title judging by this note under his Steele win:

The crowd of 35,000 saw Steele knocked down four times. He was counted out at by Referee Dempsey, former World Champion. Some ringside observers accused Steele of coming out against Hostak with his hands down, thus getting KO'd in the first round. But Steele had been hampered by a cracked breastbone, which prevented him from lifting his gloves high to where they belonged--according to his chief sparring partner, Davey Ward.

[BoxingTrav]

I don't know how folks can rank fighters that they never saw. My rankings started in 1986 the year I started watching. I appreciate watching old tape and reading stories and what not but if I wasn't there I can't rank.

[john l]

I don't know how folks can rank fighters that they never saw. My rankings started in 1986 the year I started watching. I appreciate watching old tape and reading stories and what not but if I wasn't there I can't rank.

I believe you can see a lot of tapes and read books and can get pretty good idea about many top fighter in past. but you really cant be expert on any era you were not around for.i started 1980 but unless you have seen all top 20 from era at least u cant rank era

[soul_survivor]

Yeah California sanctioned it for their title, but NYSAC didnt due to it being 10 rnds.

Doing some Brec digging:

The other guy who had proper claim to the title was Al Hostak, the NBA champ. But looking at the lineages, NYSAC was the better claim.

Freddie Steele was unified (NBA/NYSAC) champ, he was beaten by Apostoli by KO in a non title 12 rounder, then was stripped by the NYSAC for not defending against Apostoli over the championship distance. Then after winning the vacant title to Young Corbett, Apostoli lost his NYSAC title by KO to Ceferino Garcia.

The titles werent unified again till '41, when Tony Zale beat Georgie Abrams.

The fight was recognised as a MW title fight by the California State Athletic Commission, the NYSAC refused to sanction the bout for their title (which Garcia held) as it was not scheduled over 15 rounds.

Good stuff!

Just goes to show titles being split have been a problem in the past, although it happened a lot less and when it did happen, the top guys more often than not would fight each other.

I dunno what Armstrongs claim would have been IF he had won.

[BoxingTrav]

I believe you can see a lot of tapes and read books and can get pretty good idea about many top fighter in past. but you really cant be expert on any era you were not around for.i started 1980 but unless you have seen all top 20 from era at least u cant rank era

Yes you can have an idea of skill level. But greatness is hard to judge without being there to experience it.

[john l]

Yes you can have an idea of skill level. But greatness is hard to judge without being there to experience it.

I agree how can u rate champs unless u have seen top 10 and how can u rate them unless u have seen all top 20/gatekeepers