If Canelo-Golovkin Never happens.....

[daggum]

If Alvarez beats Chavez Jr, beats "Zurdo" Ramirez, and puts together a good string of defenses/events along the way (winning most of them, but not needing to win them all), he ends up on Mexico's Mt Rushmore of boxing.

Given another 5 years of boxing (assuming he keeps to the three fights a year pace), you're still talking about a 31 year old Saul Alvarez (Floyd was 30 years old at about the time that he, personally, thinks his prime was over, and he spent the next 7 years cashing out $750m in gross earnings).

Rid**** Bowe's issue was that, at the young heavyweight age of 29 years old, he walked away from the sport, trying to come back at 35 years old (at about the time where most folks were done); nobody really talks bad about Rid**** Bowe, because he still left 40-1 and beat Holyfield twice.

canelo hasnt fought 3 times since 2011. why assume that....

[Scipio2009]

canelo hasnt fought 3 times since 2011. why assume that....

Because he was set to fight three times last year, with the third fight only being pulled over some precautionary stuff. There's no reason to think that Alvarez can't fight three times a year (May PPV, September PPV, January/February on HBO)

[Lester Tutor]

canelo dropped his belt instead of fighting ggg. thats the only thing people will remember. they wont remember any rumors about potential purses.

Alvarez didn't invent vacating belts. Alvarez was already on record after beating Cotto that if ggg wanted the fight then he'd have to meet at 155 since Alvarez never fought above that. Golovkin refused. Said his focus is 160 yet says his dream fight is with Floyd or np fighting him or PAC at 154...

Yet "Alvarez too big...he disrespect to boxing.. my focus is 160."

Ggg shook he can't take on a Light middleweight challenge bluff even when its technically a 160 sanctioned bout.

[daggum]

Alvarez didn't invent vacating belts. Alvarez was already on record after beating Cotto that if ggg wanted the fight then he'd have to meet at 155 since Alvarez never fought above that. Golovkin refused. Said his focus is 160 yet says his dream fight is with Floyd or np fighting him or PAC at 154...

Yet "Alvarez too big...he disrespect to boxing.. my focus is 160."

Ggg shook he can't take on a Light middleweight challenge bluff even when its technically a 160 sanctioned bout.

yeah those are nice excuses but im just saying what everyone will remember and they will all remember canelo dropping the belt when ggg was his mandatory. they arent going to be as concerned about why and make up excuses like ggg wouldnt fight me at a catchweight lol. that makes it better somehow?

[Lomasexual]

Alvarez likely gets remembered as one of arguably the best Mexican fighters to ever put on boxing gloves.

He is young still, which is great. He could make a future where he is considered one of the greatest of all Mexican fighters.

But right now it doesn't look like he will be anything of the sort. When you think of the legit Mexican greats, there is really no way that Alvarez is heading to stand amongst them.

Part of the problem for Alvarez is that he has hit the diva part of his career too early. I squarely blame ODLH for that. But the ****** games, the catchweights, the dropping belts, all this kind of nonsense - he hasn't yet earned the credibility to do these kind of things without it affecting his legacy.

One of the hallmarks of the Mexican greats - you can call it a stereotype if you want - is that there are no other fighters who are so brave and so willing to fight. It is why boxing fans all over the world love Mexican boxers.

You have contemporary greats like Morales, Marquez and Barrera - loved, admired, respected by everyone. Go back a bit further to Chavez and even Oscar himself, and they all earned their stripes - with ODLH turning into a diva at the end.

Canelo has been badly derailed. At least if he wants to be considered one of the greatest Mexican boxers. His last couple of fights - his current diva antics and unwillingness to rise to the challenge - are the exact opposite of what has made the Mexican greats really special.

He will probably make more money this way. But boxing will be poorer for it.

[Lester Tutor]

yeah those are nice excuses but im just saying what everyone will remember and they will all remember canelo dropping the belt when ggg was his mandatory. they arent going to be as concerned about why and make up excuses like ggg wouldnt fight me at a catchweight lol. that makes it better somehow?

Alvarez has many years in the spotlight ahead of him, and when the ggg questions that will continue to linger- from the theorists around here - still need to hope their fight doesn't get made. If and when Alvarez beats Golovkin, and far better if he does so by KO, will void any pre theoritical talk on ducking, especially when Alvarez is interviewed. No different than the early May Pac drama. Alvarez could play the narrative that if they want to bring up that he waited for him to get old, well then he can just say again, that the fight was there at 155 after Cotto and Golovkin refused to fight below 160. This isn't hard to figure out. To the casual they will believe Alvarez the same way gullibles believed Pac! Gullibleism comes in handy

[daggum]

Alvarez has many years in the spotlight ahead of him, and when the ggg questions that will continue to linger- from the theorists around here - still need to hope their fight doesn't get made. If and when Alvarez beats Golovkin, and far better if he does so by KO, will void any pre theoritical talk on ducking, especially when Alvarez is interviewed. No different than the early May Pac drama. Alvarez could play the narrative that if they want to bring up that he waited for him to get old, well then he can just say again, that the fight was there at 155 after Cotto and Golovkin refused to fight below 160. This isn't hard to figure out. To the casual they will believe Alvarez the same way gullibles believed Pac! Gullibleism comes in handy

are you pretending that floyd-pac was meaningful simply because it happened? if canelo-ggg happens too late it will be seen just like floyd-pac. a big money maker but not important as far as legacy.

casuals arent going to remember that canelo wanted a 155 catchweight. they are going to remember canelo droppe the belt and refused to figth ggg. only hardcores are going to remember that canelo wanted to drain ggg and most of them are going to realize that was comical and canelo looks terrible trying to fight for the 160 title at 155. obv a few fanboys will pretend that ggg ducked but of course fanboys will be fanboys. you had people on here defending floyd for ducking pac with the 40 million flat offer.

[Lester Tutor]

are you pretending that floyd-pac was meaningful simply because it happened? if canelo-ggg happens too late it will be seen just like floyd-pac. a big money maker but not important as far as legacy.

casuals arent going to remember that canelo wanted a 155 catchweight. they are going to remember canelo droppe the belt and refused to figth ggg. only hardcores are going to remember that canelo wanted to drain ggg and most of them are going to realize that was comical and canelo looks terrible trying to fight for the 160 title at 155. obv a few fanboys will pretend that ggg ducked but of course fanboys will be fanboys. you had people on here defending floyd for ducking pac with the 40 million flat offer.

If you're a Canelo fan and Golovkin gets beat decisively or worse by KO they'll forget all that belt dropping like you said. There's soon to be a new flux of 160 fighters coming along with Lara. Who did Golovkin fight that if compared to the new pool of 160 fighters will they even care about GGG in 3 years time?

We don't have to be fans of either fighter. If you know the rules of boxing and how bouts are sanctioned along with GGG saying he'd fight Floyd or PAC at 154... then future writers will recount the dialogue and its history. Especially if Alvarez supersedes GGG in the next years with accomplishment trust me writers will favor Alvarez and reevaluate what we are talking about. If Golovkin had just said once after Cotto lost to Nelo, "I fight Canelo at 155 it's no problem for me then." Then we would know that Nelo got bulldozed in sparring or that Nelo's power was nothing then...

Let me ask you, do you think Golovkin thought Alvarez to be a threat at 155? Do you think Gennady could make that weight comfortably since many claim that Golovkin is a small middleweight? In fact there's video of Golovkin saying he is a small middleweight...

[TonyGe]

yeah those are nice excuses but im just saying what everyone will remember and they will all remember canelo dropping the belt when ggg was his mandatory. they arent going to be as concerned about why and make up excuses like ggg wouldnt fight me at a catchweight lol. that makes it better somehow?

In the history of the middleweight division it's extremely rare or never that the middleweight Champion loses weight and fights in a lower weight class. A fighter in their 30s can't lose that type of weight and retain their strength. I know there are intermediate classes etc. Canelo doesn't want to fight Golovkin at Middleweight because he feels he's not strong enough at that weight. Golovkin won't move down because he'll be weight drained. In terms of legacy other than the lineal tile farce that Canelo has Golovkin doesn't need Canelo. Canelo doesn't care about his legacy he's in it for the money. Fair enough.

[daggum]

If you're a Canelo fan and Golovkin gets beat decisively or worse by KO they'll forget all that belt dropping like you said. There's soon to be a new flux of 160 fighters coming along with Lara. Who did Golovkin fight that if compared to the new pool of 160 fighters will they even care about GGG in 3 years time?

We don't have to be fans of either fighter. If you know the rules of boxing and how bouts are sanctioned along with GGG saying he'd fight Floyd or PAC at 154... then future writers will recount the dialogue and its history. Especially if Alvarez supersedes GGG in the next years with accomplishment trust me writers will favor Alvarez and reevaluate what we are talking about. If Golovkin had just said once after Cotto lost to Nelo, "I fight Canelo at 155 it's no problem for me then." Then we would know that Nelo got bulldozed in sparring or that Nelo's power was nothing then...

Let me ask you, do you think Golovkin thought Alvarez to be a threat at 155? Do you think Gennady could make that weight comfortably since many claim that Golovkin is a small middleweight? In fact there's video of Golovkin saying he is a small middleweight...

yes if you are a canelo fanboy and canelo ko's ggg in 5 years you will pretend that was a great win. fanboys will pretend anything. we already know that. thats why they are fanboys.

the fight being at 155 is a joke. you keep coming back to that for some strange reason. the fight was mandated to happen at 160 and canelo dropped the belt and fought liam smith instead. no one is going to care about what ggg said in 2012 for a fight that was supposed to happen in 2016-2017. only fanboys cherry pick and take statements out of context. that 5 year old statement is relevant now how? at the time he was trying to get a big fight. then he established himself and said he was unifying 160 but you ignore that statement and hold an older statement as gospel. its pretty silly. none of this matters of course because dropping the belt is a more obvious duck then any of your catchweight proposals.