Everyone Wants to Talk About Floyd's IV - What About Pac-Monster's Toradol Abuse???

[travestyny]

What prerequisites need to be qualified before that TU is granted dickhead

Oh, you can ask questions but you can't find your balls to answer questions. Odd

First of all, it's called a TUE.

Second, all of the prerequisites for a TUE are listed in WADA's ISTUE.

Now my turn. Once again, who is responsible for determining if the prerequisites for the TUE are met?

[ADP02]

Dude, are you pretending to be this stupid, or are you really this dumb? That's a serious question.

Do you think saying it's medically implausible for him to drink that much fluid in that amount of time is the same as saying drinking fluid doesn't lower specific gravity?

Really? I'm really shocked with how dumb you are. I seriously never knew you could be this stupid. I sincerely hope you are trolling.

Its like you didn't even read my post.

but I get it. You know that you are wrong and just cannot admit it. Sad stuff.

[travestyny]

Its like you didn't even read my post.

but I get it. You know that you are wrong and just cannot admit it. Sad stuff.

You're still going? I thought you took my advice and gave up due to embarrassing yourself.

You are proving that your comprehension level is far lower than I ever thought. This is embarrassing on the level of multiple posters trying to school you on what the word "or" means.

1. You clearly are insinuating that the medical expert testified that it is medically implausible that drinking water lowers specific gravity.

You said it was "medically impossible" to bring down the specific gravity but the possibility is there as you can see.

NO ONE EVER ARGUED THAT IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO BRING DOWN SPECIFIC GRAVITY BY DRINKING, FOOLIO.

You even added the red to my post.

Your answer:

Sorry but you kept on saying this.

THE AMOUNT OF WATER HE WOULD HAVE TO DRINK IN ONLY 1 HOUR AND 17 MINUTES WOULD HAVE LITERALLY KILLED HIM

LMAO. I have no words for how stupid you'd have to be to understand the medical review officer saying it's medically implausible to drink the amount of fluid needed to lower the marijuana metabolite in such a short amount of time to be the same as the medical review officer saying drinking water will not lower specific gravity. Nevermind this:

NSAC Lawyer: But you do believe that drinking water would cause specific gravity to decrease?

Medical Review Officer: Yes.

Do I need to point that part out to you in the video?

2. You highlight the word "several" in reference to several liters, and you asked if the study you brought up mentions that there will be danger in drinking 2 liters of water in two hours. Clearly, you are insinuating that the medical review officer means it would be dangerous for Diaz to drink 2 liters of water in two hours.

Those are quotes from YOU and Diaz's team.

Here is part of what was said by Diaz's team:

Diaz's Lawyer: 733 to 61.104 ng/ml decrease of 672 ..... can it be due to rehydrating that much? IS a swing that large medically plausible?

Diaz's expert: Absolutely not. To drop from 733 to 61 in 1:17 minutes it would require massive consumption of fluids. We are talking in the order of several liters in a very short period of time. That has an affect on our body and causes hyponatremia. The sodium level drops too much or an electrolyte imbalance. Basically if not properly corrected it can lead to serious medical condition such as headaches, .....

3) The study had given the subjects about 1 liter of WATER per hour!!! In other words 2 liters in 2 hours. Did the study say that was risky?

LMAO. Wowwww, dude. You thought the medical review officer meant it's dangerous to drink 2 liters of water???

Medical Review Officer: It would take VOLUMES of fluid. MASSIVE consumption of fluid. We are talking in the order of 30 glasses of water. An EXQUISITE amount of fluid.

Now here's a little math for you.
1 glass of water = 8 fl. ounces.
30 glasses of water = 7 liters of water

Already showed you that 6 liters would KILL half of humans weighing 165lbs. Let's be generous and say Diaz was 200lbs after the fight. So he drank 7 liters of water or more from the time he got back to the dressing room, in front of 2 DCO's, in a period of 2 hours. He began drinking as soon as he got to the locker room, and in an hour his status was still slightly dehydrated. After 2 hours, when your study shows specific gravity plummets to less than 1.009 with a bit less than 2 liters of water, Diaz was able to complete drinking in the order of 7 liters of water and his specific gravity was 1.009.

So what did I miss? Can you explain?

[ADP02]

You're still going? I thought you took my advice and gave up due to embarrassing yourself.

You are proving that your comprehension level is far lower than I ever thought. This is embarrassing on the level of multiple posters trying to school you on what the word "or" means.

1. You clearly are insinuating that the medical expert testified that it is medically implausible that drinking water lowers specific gravity.





You even added the red to my post.

Your answer:



LMAO. I have no words for how stupid you'd have to be to understand the medical review officer saying it's medically implausible to drink the amount of fluid needed to lower the marijuana metabolite in such a short amount of time to be the same as the medical review officer saying drinking water will not lower specific gravity. Nevermind this:

NSAC Lawyer: But you do believe that drinking water would cause specific gravity to decrease?

Medical Review Officer: Yes.

Do I need to point that part out to you in the video?

2. You highlight the word "several" in reference to several liters, and you asked if the study you brought up mentions that there will be danger in drinking 2 liters of water in two hours. Clearly, you are insinuating that the medical review officer means it would be dangerous for Diaz to drink 2 liters of water in two hours.



LMAO. Wowwww, dude. You thought the medical review officer meant it's dangerous to drink 2 liters of water???

Medical Review Officer: It would take VOLUMES of fluid. MASSIVE consumption of fluid. We are talking in the order of 30 glasses of water. An EXQUISITE amount of fluid.

Now here's a little math for you.
1 glass of water = 8 fl. ounces.
30 glasses of water = 7 liters of water

Already showed you that 6 liters would KILL half of humans weighing 165lbs. Let's be generous and say Diaz was 200lbs after the fight. So he drank 7 liters of water or more from the time he got back to the dressing room, in front of 2 DCO's, in a period of 2 hours. He began drinking as soon as he got to the locker room, and in an hour his status was still slightly dehydrated. After 2 hours, when your study shows specific gravity plummets to less than 1.009 with a bit less than 2 liters of water, Diaz was able to complete drinking in the order of 7 liters of water and his specific gravity was 1.009.

So what did I miss? Can you explain?

You keep on shooting yourself in the foot!

First of all, who said that Diaz was drinking water? Or what exactly he was doing? It's Diaz's lawyer that framed the scene to be something but it was not exactly as they had you thinking and for various reasons.


Lets try this one more time. If you are not clear, just say so ..... if NOT, then just say that you are WROOOONG!!!


I pointed to several studies and there are many more. You cannot do as you are doing and use 1 study to state that its impossible because you are extrapolating numbers that are not even there!!! So that is why I say 2 liters for one of those studies. Why? Because they said so! All I can then say is, they were NOT trying to risk the subjects (reading the study). So certainly Diaz can drink more than that especially if he counters it with a balance of electrolytes. I already pointed this out to you and did so AGAIN. I will say more below on this.



The "expert" witness and the lawyer tried to define the parameters and carefully chose his words.. You went with it!

1) Was it 1 hour 17 minutes or closer to 2.5 hours? That in itself shoots down your "experts" scenario!!! This should be enough right there!!! ITS OVER!!!

2) As stated, did Diaz just drink water? If he drank fluids that contained the required electrolytes or had some other way of doing that, then its no longer a question of "medically impossible"!!! At most its a risk but as stated, Diaz has done this before so he should know what he needs to do and refine his protocol if required.

3) Only 2 liters? Diaz had closer to 2.5 hours and can drink much more than 2.5 liters. I told you that for some it took even less than that to get their specific gravity to a state that was very low.
4) A study is a controlled environment where they must take only what is stated in the study. Diaz is NOT in a controlled study so he can do whatever trick he has in his bag.

As I stated before, creatinine and specific gravity are testing tools but they have their limitations. Just by looking at the various studies, you should realize this. Not all subjects have the same numbers.


Now for Diaz:
TEST 2:
- Again, creatinine has its limitations in relation to hydration and a few of (its limitations) them may have affected the numbers. Exercise and trauma can affect and even studies confirmed this! There is also a dependency on urine volume.
- THC: Diaz's number was > 300. They tell users NOT to do any type of exercise close to your test as that would release THC that is stored in Diaz's body and consequently increase the THC numbers. Well, Diaz did fight and his numbers were elevated. So exercise can affect and even Diaz's coach brought this up but maybe that was an excuse by the coach? Well I also read that studies confirmed this!

TEST 3: As mentioned specific gravity has its limitations. Similarly to creatinine, exercise can affect but so can the affect of a fight!

"Urine samples in 139 professional boxers before and after a bout were examined. 46% of the fighter's urine changed from clear before the fight to turbid immediately afterwards and the specific gravity increased in 80% of the cases. Traces of acetone were manifest in 14%. Sugar spilled in the urine in 9% of the boxers.
Albuminuria: 68% that had none present before the fight, 68% was present after the fight. Red blood cells were found in significant pathological amounts in 73% after the fight .... and more.

In addition to an effect of exercise, there is also an effect of acute trauma observed in the urine immediately after the fight ....."


plus of course in Diaz's case, there is THC in which will drive up the numbers as well. Test 3 showed a supposedly hydrated Diaz but not one as hydrated as Test 1.


There is more as you will see below but just to say that there are many variables to consider before you can use the word "Medically impossible". Especially when the "experts" scenario was not accurate to begin with!!!

One thing that both sides agreed with when questioned and you do not like is this statement:
Doctor "expert" witness for Diaz: Final results can vary dramatically since its a different protocol using different equipment,...!!!! ...... BOOM!!!

Now what you are trying to have people believe is that a test on an admitted marijuana user who had trouble getting a license because he failed several tests just before the fight couldn't possibly have failed a marijuana test?

Quest performed 2 separate tests and BOTH had Diaz testing positive! For what? Marijuana!

Come to think of it, even SMRTL was able to find marijuana but at lower levels.

Finally, I pointed out that there are studies that show that in a few hours or less, it was both possible to drive down the dilution of urine and also manage to bring down levels of marijuana metabolites.

Looking at your example that you posted on the other page: 53 to 5 ng/ml? and stating it as Diaz's lawyer stated it, 5ng/ml is more than 10 times lower than 53 ng/ml. How is that possible?

Besides the ones that I showed you already, there is also this on a study that didn't even seem to be related to the subject even trying to dilute. So imagine someone like Diaz who will not only dilute but as I keep on telling you, try whatever he could to make sure that he tests negative. Not do what is stated in a controlled study as you keep on thinking is the case :

Also, the below subject would have also passed the urine dilution test. That is, not less than 20.

SUBJECT G
Time 20.5 to 23.0 to 24.0
THCCOOH 223.2 to 27.1 to 13.7
Creatinine 184 to 39 to 23
Volume 320 to 195 to 260

SUBJECT H
Time 6.0 to 9.5
THCCOOH 234.2 to 59.6
Creatinine 174 to 45
Volume 116 to 390


So the truth is, when there is a positive result, the burden of proof is on Diaz and YOU since you believe Diaz, who is an admitted marijuana user!

[LoadedWraps]

You could tell Manny was juiced to the gills in Toradol tonight.

[travestyny]

You keep on shooting yourself in the foot!

First of all, who said that Diaz was drinking water? Or what exactly he was doing? It's Diaz's lawyer that framed the scene to be something but it was not exactly as they had you thinking and for various reasons.


Lets try this one more time. If you are not clear, just say so ..... if NOT, then just say that you are WROOOONG!!!


I pointed to several studies and there are many more. You cannot do as you are doing and use 1 study to state that its impossible because you are extrapolating numbers that are not even there!!! So that is why I say 2 liters for one of those studies. Why? Because they said so! All I can then say is, they were NOT trying to risk the subjects (reading the study). So certainly Diaz can drink more than that especially if he counters it with a balance of electrolytes. I already pointed this out to you and did so AGAIN. I will say more below on this.



The "expert" witness and the lawyer tried to define the parameters and carefully chose his words.. You went with it!

1) Was it 1 hour 17 minutes or closer to 2.5 hours? That in itself shoots down your "experts" scenario!!! This should be enough right there!!! ITS OVER!!!

2) As stated, did Diaz just drink water? If he drank fluids that contained the required electrolytes or had some other way of doing that, then its no longer a question of "medically impossible"!!! At most its a risk but as stated, Diaz has done this before so he should know what he needs to do and refine his protocol if required.

3) Only 2 liters? Diaz had closer to 2.5 hours and can drink much more than 2.5 liters. I told you that for some it took even less than that to get their specific gravity to a state that was very low.
4) A study is a controlled environment where they must take only what is stated in the study. Diaz is NOT in a controlled study so he can do whatever trick he has in his bag.

As I stated before, creatinine and specific gravity are testing tools but they have their limitations. Just by looking at the various studies, you should realize this. Not all subjects have the same numbers.


Now for Diaz:
TEST 2:
- Again, creatinine has its limitations in relation to hydration and a few of (its limitations) them may have affected the numbers. Exercise and trauma can affect and even studies confirmed this! There is also a dependency on urine volume.
- THC: Diaz's number was > 300. They tell users NOT to do any type of exercise close to your test as that would release THC that is stored in Diaz's body and consequently increase the THC numbers. Well, Diaz did fight and his numbers were elevated. So exercise can affect and even Diaz's coach brought this up but maybe that was an excuse by the coach? Well I also read that studies confirmed this!

TEST 3: As mentioned specific gravity has its limitations. Similarly to creatinine, exercise can affect but so can the affect of a fight!

"Urine samples in 139 professional boxers before and after a bout were examined. 46% of the fighter's urine changed from clear before the fight to turbid immediately afterwards and the specific gravity increased in 80% of the cases. Traces of acetone were manifest in 14%. Sugar spilled in the urine in 9% of the boxers.
Albuminuria: 68% that had none present before the fight, 68% was present after the fight. Red blood cells were found in significant pathological amounts in 73% after the fight .... and more.

In addition to an effect of exercise, there is also an effect of acute trauma observed in the urine immediately after the fight ....."


plus of course in Diaz's case, there is THC in which will drive up the numbers as well. Test 3 showed a supposedly hydrated Diaz but not one as hydrated as Test 1.


There is more as you will see below but just to say that there are many variables to consider before you can use the word "Medically impossible". Especially when the "experts" scenario was not accurate to begin with!!!

One thing that both sides agreed with when questioned and you do not like is this statement:
Doctor "expert" witness for Diaz: Final results can vary dramatically since its a different protocol using different equipment,...!!!! ...... BOOM!!!

Now what you are trying to have people believe is that a test on an admitted marijuana user who had trouble getting a license because he failed several tests just before the fight couldn't possibly have failed a marijuana test?

Quest performed 2 separate tests and BOTH had Diaz testing positive! For what? Marijuana!

Come to think of it, even SMRTL was able to find marijuana but at lower levels.

Finally, I pointed out that there are studies that show that in a few hours or less, it was both possible to drive down the dilution of urine and also manage to bring down levels of marijuana metabolites.

Looking at your example that you posted on the other page: 53 to 5 ng/ml? and stating it as Diaz's lawyer stated it, 5ng/ml is more than 10 times lower than 53 ng/ml. How is that possible?

Besides the ones that I showed you already, there is also this on a study that didn't even seem to be related to the subject even trying to dilute. So imagine someone like Diaz who will not only dilute but as I keep on telling you, try whatever he could to make sure that he tests negative. Not do what is stated in a controlled study as you keep on thinking is the case :

Also, the below subject would have also passed the urine dilution test. That is, not less than 20.

SUBJECT G
Time 20.5 to 23.0 to 24.0
THCCOOH 223.2 to 27.1 to 13.7
Creatinine 184 to 39 to 23
Volume 320 to 195 to 260

SUBJECT H
Time 6.0 to 9.5
THCCOOH 234.2 to 59.6
Creatinine 174 to 45
Volume 116 to 390


So the truth is, when there is a positive result, the burden of proof is on Diaz and YOU since you believe Diaz, who is an admitted marijuana user!

You're an absolute moron. Stop typing bull**** to me. Reading your posts is nothing but a waste of time.


1. Stop speculating. If there is something that he could drink that would drag his marijuana metabolite down from over 300ng to 61ng in 1 hour 17 minutes...even 2 hours, PROVE IT. SHOW SOME ****ING PROOF!

2. He did NOT have 2 hours to do this. He had 1 hour 17 minutes, as was stated many times. There is no way that he began drinking 2 hours ahead of the test and was still slightly dehydrated by the time of the 3rd test. That's why 1hr 17 minutes is chosen. A doctor and medical review officer is testifying to this, and you think you can prove him wrong? THIS IS HIS ****ING JOB!

3. You see with one subject that it was 53ng down to 5ng, and you say that means Nick Diaz could have dropped it down from over 300ng to 61ng? Does this magical fluid that you now have him taking have some special power to multiply it's effect to fit your agenda? That was beyond stupid of you.

4. Still waiting for you to explain how he drank over 7 liters and had a SPG of 1.009. CAN YOU EXPLAIN IT? YES OR NO?

5. What studies are you referring to? SHOW THEM. Why are you posting numbers from some study with no link..and with 4 hours elapsing when you know Nick Diaz had 1hour 17 minutes...or you now want to claim 2 hours, which is still bull****.

You have to do better. Show some damn proof and stop speculating.

[travestyny]

1) Was it 1 hour 17 minutes or closer to 2.5 hours? That in itself shoots down your "experts" scenario!!! This should be enough right there!!! ITS OVER!!!

How did he start drinking at 2.5 hours out from the test and 1 hour later he is slightly dehydrated? Show me.

One thing that both sides agreed with when questioned and you do not like is this statement:
Doctor "expert" witness for Diaz: Final results can vary dramatically since its a different protocol using different equipment,...!!!! ...... BOOM!!!

You misunderstand, which is not a surprise with your low comprehension skills. Point out where in the video he says this, and I will explain, little guy. Both used the GC/MS test, so I'm sure you don't know what you are talking about. The whole crux of the issue is that there shouldn't be one test with 733ng of marijuana metabolite and one with 61ng of marijuana metabolite. It's not about results varying. ONE TEST IS WRONG! You choose to believe the QUEST result when they ****ed up chain of custody and anonymity as opposed to 2 WADA accredited tests. And no, QUEST did NOT do two tests. They tested one sample that might have been tampered with since anonymity and chain of custody was ****ed up, but nice try.

Now what you are trying to have people believe is that a test on an admitted marijuana user who had trouble getting a license because he failed several tests just before the fight couldn't possibly have failed a marijuana test?

Are you slow? All the tests found marijuana metabolite. Seriously. Get some help with your comprehension.

[Shape up]

Oh, you can ask questions but you can't find your balls to answer questions. Odd

First of all, it's called a TUE.

Second, all of the prerequisites for a TUE are listed in WADA's ISTUE.

Now my turn. Once again, who is responsible for determining if the prerequisites for the TUE are met?

TUEC stupid, who writes the rules, WADA, rule says that if you have an IV away from the hospital then you require a prior TUE, quite straight forward for any intelligent person, which says a lot about you dickhead

[travestyny]

TUEC stupid, who writes the rules, WADA, rule says that if you have an IV away from the hospital then you require a prior TUE, quite straight forward for any intelligent person, which says a lot about you dickhead

Took you, what, 4 days to figure that question out. You're an absolute moron.

Now take another 4 days to figure this out:

Does the TUEC have the patients names when they decide if the requirements for a TUE is met? Yes or no?


By the way:

who writes the rules, WADA, rule says that if you have an IV away from the hospital then you require a prior TUE

WADA confirmed that under the 2015 World Anti-Doping Code and the International Standard for Therapeutic Use Exemptions (ISTUE), a retroactive TUE can be granted for an IV drip to combat dehydration.

LMAO. Give up yet, clown?

[Shape up]

Oh, you can ask questions but you can't find your balls to answer questions. Odd

First of all, it's called a TUE.

Second, all of the prerequisites for a TUE are listed in WADA's ISTUE.

Now my turn. Once again, who is responsible for determining if the prerequisites for the TUE are met?

Took you, what, 4 days to figure that question out. You're an absolute moron.

Now take another 4 days to figure this out:

Does the TUEC have the patients names when they decide if the requirements for a TUE is met? Yes or no?


By the way:

WADA confirmed that under the 2015 World Anti-Doping Code and the International Standard for Therapeutic Use Exemptions (ISTUE), a retroactive TUE can be granted for an IV drip to combat dehydration.

LMAO. Give up yet, clown?

Yep it can give a TUE, if the IV was performed in hospital, was floyds IV performed in hospital dickhead, answer that **** for brains