Comments Thread For: Arum Reflects on Mayweather's IV, Pacquiao Shoulder Shot Scandal

[Zaroku]

im a chargers fan (even tho we suck like every year). and yeah pac a cheater. roid abuser.

and im just not a lumpia kinda guy... im down for some eggrolls tho lol.

filipinos food is too greasy bruh.

The Chargers? Omg! I had a great girlfriend from San Diego who knew more about football than me. I regret not marrying her. She was beyond cool.

Switching topics on you, I am watching these half Japanese ans black/Mexican/Samoan athletes that japan believes will bring gold to japan!

They got a few half Latinos for boxing that are mean as mean can be.

I look forward to the 2020 Olympics. Show up, I'll show you around.

[Dosumpthin]

QUOTE=ADP02;17012134]1. We are not talking about a high school wan bee athlete that comes to practice the next day already dehydrated beforehand. They had Floyd monitored. Check Floyd's videos...... he would even ask "What should I drink? Water? OK ....." [/QUOTE]

So you agree chronic dehydration can be caused by a medical condition?

2. Sorry but Floyd already told you. He was dehydrated because of giving urine, giving <1 tablespoon of blood 10 days before and exercises which he admits in his videos that he was just going to do "a little bit". "A little bit" of exercise made sense to me and I had already stated but since you guys know they are lousy excuses, you want to reinvent something for Floyd.

Floyd stated that providing samples of urine/blood, rigorous training regimine and his old age contibuted to dehydration.

Contribute : help to cause or bring about

Which makes sense for Floyd to draw this conclusion - because - ding ding ding - he is not a doctor!

Was this video taken after Floyd received the official diagnosis of the medical condition that caused the dehydration????


If so. Floyd is under no obligation to disclose personal medical information to the media.

3. Floyd's weight was rock solid for 30 days. Floyd admits to making weight EASILY for a decade. If Floyd was severely dehydrated due to what he stated, his weight would have gone much lower than it did. It didn't.
Actually even if Floyd had, as you tried to make us believe, diarrhea, Floyd's weight would not have been rock solid stable but it was.

1. Lol. Youre ******. 30 day weight has nothing to do with having uncontrollable runny ****s the night before the fight. Wtf are you talking about.


2. Im not saying that he had diarrhea.

Just pointed out yet another medical condition that could've easily warranted a retro TUE according to Wada ISTUE. And you don't have to be SEVERLY dehydrated to require the IV like Thomas Hauser has you believing. Lol.

PREFERED treatment for loss of essential bodily fluids due to excessive ****ting that was caused by a medical condition such as irritable bowel syndrome (official diagnosis) - would be to rehydrate using an IV.

But Floyd/Ellerbe/Ariza never mentioned any of that and stayed consistent in several interviews. Not even his pre-fight form mentioned any other medical condition. Oh wait. He has allergies! So do I ..... I should be using an IV every time I train and feel dehydrated. What a joke!

You talked yourself into a corner now huh? Lol. You're the one that claimed that Floyd didn't list anything about dehydration to NSAC. However he did list he had allergies.

Allergies - a medical condition that is intensified when your body is dehydrated.

We all have allergies, some people are more affected than others. It may not be a concern to you - however - some people may suffer it was a serious enough medical condition for Floyd to have listed it as a concern on the prefight form.


However, mannys torn rotator cuff injury was not serious enough.

Haha haha.

[ADP02]

Give up. UCI is accused of blatantly helping Lance cheat with PROOF. I've also explained that the only reason NSAC was on Manny is because he tried to place blame on them and they felt a need to defend themselves. I also explained they have NEVER diagnosed a fighter with dehydration. Either they are incapable of diagnosing it, they don't look for it, or they don't care to note it.

The TUEC would have to be paid off. That's at least 3 doctors that would have to put their necks on the line. You still can't explain why USADA would involve these doctors when if they wanted to help Floyd cheat, there would be an easier way.

WADA has the documents and you can't explain why USADA would involve WADA to further a risk of being caught.

Again. Give up. Your theory makes no sense. Independent labs, urine that was not diluted, and partial sample before the IV. GIVE UP!

Go back to before Lance got caught, they are similar stories. They were accusing UCI/Lance similarly to USADA/Floyd


NSAC: So its about being nice to NSAC not about the rules?
At the end of the day, one got his meds while the other didn't. Which one would you expect would be complaining?

USADA/NSAC friction is there. NSAC should have been notified as soon as possible about all medical conditions and the IV. Why didn't the NSAC investigate USADA/Floyd?


TUEC: Not necessarily. Nobody needs to be paid off. They are just scratching each others backs and its all good. Floyd and company provides USADA work and pays them. USADA establishes and gets the personnel that they seem "fit". The personnel gets this TUEC job and paid "handsomely" with perks.

How did UCI get paid? Lance Armstrong's team helped pay for PEDs testing. Could have been harmless at the time but in retrospect and knowing what we know that happened, USADA said it was unethical.


WADA: Go check out the Russian athletes scandal, as an example. You think that they would be providing WADA with documents that had evidence of wrong doing if they were capable of doing otherwise?




Give up? You cannot be as naïve as you post. You make it sound like Floyd couldn't have been cheating and that its not possible to defeat their PEDs testing program but even USADA does not believe that. The report that I presented to you from WADA does not believe that. In fact, the report suggests the opposite and points to the weaknesses in their program.


Floyd got an IV but shouldn't have.

[ADP02]

You really need to stop typing this. It's cowardly for you to keep lying. That is, unless you just have poor reading comprehension skills. I said if you believe that they mean the main reason for his dehydration is urinating and giving blood, then you are ******, or something to that effect. It's obvious to any rational person that it was mentioned not as a main factor, but as a contributing factor. When you do this, it shows your desperation and it's sad.

Floyd's a coward now? Its Floyd's statement not mine! :lol:


Not a main factor?
1) Its NOT a factor PERIOD!!!! Its a LIE!!! Even Floyd of 2011 admits to that.
2) I mention all factors mentioned by Floyd. You and some other Floyd fans are the desperate ones that bring up points that Floyd NEVER mentioned.

[ADP02]

Great! Watch Marquez not get credit beating PAC in slow motion.

Slow mo this!


Lucian Bute tested positive for banned drug ...... Memo Heredia then tries to explain away the positive test.

[travestyny]

Go back to before Lance got caught, they are similar stories. They were accusing UCI/Lance similarly to USADA/Floyd


NSAC: So its about being nice to NSAC not about the rules?
At the end of the day, one got his meds while the other didn't. Which one would you expect would be complaining?

USADA/NSAC friction is there. NSAC should have been notified as soon as possible about all medical conditions and the IV. Why didn't the NSAC investigate USADA/Floyd?


TUEC: Not necessarily. Nobody needs to be paid off. They are just scratching each others backs and its all good. Floyd and company provides USADA work and pays them. USADA establishes and gets the personnel that they seem "fit". The personnel gets this TUEC job and paid "handsomely" with perks.

How did UCI get paid? Lance Armstrong's team helped pay for PEDs testing. Could have been harmless at the time but in retrospect and knowing what we know that happened, USADA said it was unethical.


WADA: Go check out the Russian athletes scandal, as an example. You think that they would be providing WADA with documents that had evidence of wrong doing if they were capable of doing otherwise?




Give up? You cannot be as naïve as you post. You make it sound like Floyd couldn't have been cheating and that its not possible to defeat their PEDs testing program but even USADA does not believe that. The report that I presented to you from WADA does not believe that. In fact, the report suggests the opposite and points to the weaknesses in their program.


Floyd got an IV but shouldn't have.

Dude, you have no proof. Your whole argument is based on speculation due to your hatred of Floyd.

NSAC: Once again, they have NEVER diagnosed a fighter with dehydration, which is ASTOUNDING since everyone knows fighters deal with dehydration ALL THE TIME. It's not about being nice to NSAC. It's about NSAC not dealing with dehydration AT ALL. You can't deny this! You are arguing that he should have written in "Dehydration" when asked if there was a serious medical condition. Really? Is NSAC then supposed to go back and review all the cases where fighters didn't list their dehydration. Do you expect dehydrated fighters to do this now? It's not going to happen, and you know it. This would definitely be something that could put the fight in jeopardy because then NSAC would be responsible in the case that something goes wrong in the ring. If you're saying that they should monitor dehydration more, ok. I have no problem with that. Many others have said the same. As for Pacquiao, it blatantly asked if he had a shoulder injury that needed evaluation. He could have simply replied yes and got his doctor to state that he was at normal strength and ready to go. Just as his doctor did state!

NSAC didn't investigate Floyd because there is no proof he cheated. Actually, there is proof that he didn't cheat being that he passed 19 drug tests. NSAC DID beef with USADA. In the end, they were satisfied.

TUEC: So much more speculation on your part. The TUEC, according to the rules, are not given any names when they review the TUE application. You said they need not be paid off, then in the same paragraph say they would be paid handsomely with perks!!! So...they would have had to be paid off in order to help Floyd cheat. Again, that's 3 more people that didn't need to know about this that are privy to Floyd cheating, if I am to go along with your story.

Payment: By Mayweather Promotions. We've gone through this already. Same as when Top Rank pays VADA.

Russians: Not sure why this is relevant.

Yes, give up. This is not about IF someone can possibly cheat. Pacquiao could have possibly cheated too. We are not here to discuss speculation, right. We are looking at the facts.

[travestyny]

Floyd's a coward now? Its Floyd's statement not mine! :lol:


Not a main factor?
1) Its NOT a factor PERIOD!!!! Its a LIE!!! Even Floyd of 2011 admits to that.

Oh really??? I think this link settles all of this.

When it comes to donating blood and staying hydrated, there is great importance. This is due to the fact that your body’s functions revolve around an enormous number of cellular communications that happen, requiring things like potassium, sodium and chloride. As the day goes on, we lose hydration through sweat and urination. It is essential to replace lost hydration if you want to keep your body operating at its best.

One of the biggest components of a whole blood donation (as well as the blood in our bodies) is plasma. Plasma is made up almost entirely of water. The body immediately begins to replace the fluid portion lost after you donate. Essentially, all the hydration in your body will go towards replacing and building back up what the phlebotomist just took out.
http://blog.inceptsaves.com/blog/201...onating-blood/

2) I mention all factors mentioned by Floyd. You and some other Floyd fans are the desperate ones that bring up points that Floyd NEVER mentioned.

Riiight. And as you can see above, you are wrong. Secondly, you don't have his medical records. You couldn't even disprove the dreaded hyponatremia. You can't disprove any other condition that may have led to the IV. You can't prove anything. This is why you should give up.

[travestyny]

Go back to before Lance got caught, they are similar stories. They were accusing UCI/Lance similarly to USADA/Floyd

What? Who was saying this was similar? This is part of USADA's huge attack on Lance:

The 2001 Tour du Suisse (Tour of Switzerland) was conducted from June 19 – 28, 2001 and was won by Lance Armstrong. Armstrong told both Tyler Hamilton and Floyd Landis that he had tested positive for EPO at the 2001 Tour of Switzerland and stated or implied that he had been able to make the EPO test result go away. Armstrong’s conversation with Hamilton was in 2001, and he told Hamilton “his people had been in touch with UCI, they were going to have a meeting and everything was going to be ok.”

Consistent with the testimony of both Mr. Hamilton and Mr. Landis, Pat McQuaid, the current president of UCI, has acknowledged that during 2002, Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel visited the UCI headquarters in Aigle in May 2002 and offered at least $100,000 to help the development of cycling. UCI vehemently denies that this meeting or payment was, as Mr. Armstrong told Mr. Hamilton and Mr. Landis, tied to a cover-up of the 2001 Tour de Suisse sample.

So you want to place Mayweather in this scenario and tell me how it works? It doesn't.

1. If Mayweather ever tested positive for anything, the independent WADA accredited lab would be required to notify WADA immediately.

2. Any speculation that you have regarding Floyd and WADA's relationship is just that. Speculation. I can speculate that Dr. Neal ElAttrache was a part of Pacquaio's entourage. Why else would he accompany Manny to his dressing room for the fight? Are you telling me that he had to be the doctor to shoot Manny up with Toradol? They couldn't get anyone else to do it besides the "world famous doctor"? Was he interested in bringing even more fame to his name by being affiliated with Pac? Was he there because he was paid handsomely? Did he just want free fight tickets? Sweet. I bet he had great seats!

By the way, now that we know it was ElAttrache in the dressing room, the world-renown doctor, can we discuss WHY WOULD HE ATTEMPT TO SHOOT UP PACQUIAO WITH TORADOL IF ACCORDING TO HIM PACQUIAO WAS AT FULL STRENGTH, AND WHY TORADOL INSTEAD OF A LOCAL NUMBING AGENT??? I NEVER KNEW ELATTRACHE WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS. DOES YOUR GOOD DOCTOR STILL SEEM SO GOOD???

[ADP02]

So you went and dug up some recommendations from a panel from 2013. Nice try. Do you know if this panel from 2013 had prohibited methods in mind at all, or are they only listing prohibited substances? Stop pulling shlt out of your ass. The fact that WADA even had this panel should tell you how seriously WADA takes their duties, yet you claim they were too busy to review paperwork from the fight of the century. Hmm.



No. Wrong. You're pretending this is a new thing. THE PROHIBITION ON IV'S HAS BEEN THEIR RULE FOR QUITE A WHILE NOW!!! It is prohibited without a TUE. Floyd's application was approved of by the INDEPENDENT TUEC. Yes. INDEPENDENT. They have no political affiliation with USADA and are therefore INDEPENDENT! This is at least 3 other medical personnel which would have had to been made aware of this cheating scheme, according to you. Here's more for you to ponder:

What is a The****utic Use Exemption Committee (TUEC)?
The TUEC is the group of doctors and medical experts that review your TUE application and recommend whether the TUE should be approved or denied based on the criteria in the WADA International Standard of TUEs. Each anti-doping agency and International Federation has its own TUEC. Your identity is never revealed to the TUEC.

So let me get this straight. The TUEC had to be approached, and all of them had to agree with this lie. What if one didn't? Why the hell would USADA involve the TUEC when it would have been much easier to leave them out? Can you please explain???

The report criticized and found weaknesses including in WADA, NADO, LABs, ....

What kind of a question is that? Looking for another loop hole? Yes, they mention both Substances and methods. Its about the testing programs lack of effectiveness. Methods fall into that, of course.

The report mentions a lot of things that you close your eyes to. From their report, it states that ADO's such as USADA often just tries to comply at the bare minimum. That is the case with Floyd ... and if this report says this then it must be happeneing.


"WADA is unable to do more than report on non-compliance when aware"

Weaknesses Observed: Retroactive TUEs are frequently issued
Retroactive TUEs should be permitted only for gluco-corticosteroids and asthma medications and may be reported as negative only with the written approval of WADA.


Fight of the Century is just 2 athletes. WADA was recently criticized on other scandals that involved hundreds of athletes.
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YOU are WRONG! Stop fooling yourself!

What does the sentence before what you highlighted in red say? TUEC is established by ADO which means that USADA established their TUEC. So how independant can that really be? They even state "Ideally" independant then go on to discuss when its NOT independant .... so to say, they realize that its not really independant.


There is a conflict between your statement in which may have come from USADA and this:
" Will the information on the athlete's TUE Application remain confidential?

All the information contained in a TUE Application will be kept strictly confidential, the same as any medical information normally kept by your doctor. All members of the The****utic Use Exemption Committee (TUECs) are required to sign confidentiality agreements and if they require advice from other scientific experts on a particular case, your name is not used when circulating the application outside the TUEC.


And about the confidentiality agreements, there are exemptions. Guess who are part of the exceptions?
"With the exception of authorization by virtue of my office, or the express authorization of [Person in charge of your organization]"




USADA went to organizations to let them be aware that even though they lose a lot of weight and of course will be drained, they still would not be allowed to use an IV for recovery. That is what they were told.


Floyd's IV: Floyd got a RETRO TUE 3 weeks after the fact.
WHo has a better case in getting an IV,
Floyd whose weight is rock solid stable for 30 days and admits to making weight easily or the ones that even Floyd admits, are drained after losing so much weight? So to say, if Floyd can get it then they all should be able to EASILY!!! Get a doctor to state that you are drained and need an IV and voila, you got it!

Except for those who used it to mask PEDs, why else were all these athletes using IVs before USADA walked in their door with the bad news? They needed an IV because they were drained from dehydrating 10-15-20+lbs.

If you do not get that, how are you able to think Floyd can use an IV and not these others?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Like I keep on telling you, do not act so naive about this.

This would be you as a Lance Armstrong fan:
FAN - Let me understand your logic. So you are saying that Lance paid off UCI, LABs, doctors, event organizers, WADA, ADOs, teammates .....? This is ******
REALITY: Lance influenced many of those and paid off many of those people

FAN - How could Lance mask when the DCO came without any notice? You are going to tell me that he paid off the NADO? DCO?
REALITY: Many times Lance was warned 20-30 minutes in advance.

FAN: The rule is that Lance would be monitored by the DCO. So let me get this straight. Only was is if the DCO was paid off because its not possible that Lance was able to use an IV.
REALITY: At times even with the DCO present, an IV was smuggled right under the DCO's nose so that Lance was able to use an IV to mask. Other times Lance just delayed getting tested.

FAN: but Lance was tested 100s of times and results came back negative each and every time. So that means Lance is clean.
FAN: Lance was investigated and came back clean ..... what are you smoking, its all speculation!
REALITY: Lance was not clean

FAN: UCI allows RETRO TUE with RETRO Prescriptions when there is a valid medical condition. UCI reasoning for being lenient is that it should not matter if you get the information before or after a legit medical condition has been properly diagnosed by Lance's doctor. Anyways, you do not have Lance's medical results and until you do, its all speculation!
REALITY: Lance was using PEDs and RETRO TUE was not legit!

FAN: They cannot track Lance's samples. It only has a number not Lance's name.
REALITY: WADA got in hot water here. It was reported that WADA got a hold of Lance's sample (results) from the past and they came back positive! How did they know it was Lance's sample when a sample/results only has a number not Lance's name on it! That is what UCI said about WADA and wanted to get an explanation from WADA but WADA refused.




IV and RETRO TUE for everyone!!!

[ADP02]

QUOTE=ADP02;17012134]1. We are not talking about a high school wan bee athlete that comes to practice the next day already dehydrated beforehand. They had Floyd monitored. Check Floyd's videos...... he would even ask "What should I drink? Water? OK ....."

So you agree chronic dehydration can be caused by a medical condition?




Floyd stated that providing samples of urine/blood, rigorous training regimine and his old age contibuted to dehydration.

Contribute : help to cause or bring about

Which makes sense for Floyd to draw this conclusion - because - ding ding ding - he is not a doctor!

WT...! Floyd told you what he had and why he had it. Its time you start listening to your hero Floyd


LIES: When at least one if not all that is stated by Floyd is a lie then ..... its a LIE!!! If its a lie then Floyd was not saying the truth about why he needed that IV.


So who do you believe, Floyd from 2011 or Floyd from 2015?
"A lot of times, people don't realize, giving blood doesn't make you weak. Not being able to juice because you have to give blood makes you weak. That's what a lot of people don't realize and don't know."


Floyd lies AFTER the fact when he was told by his doctor Ariza what he had and why but you are thinking that Floyd is so dumb that he cannot even parrot what he had. Got it!

but

When Manny says something about his injury, he is a doctor to you and some other Floyd fans? Oh, that's different?

Was this video taken after Floyd received the official diagnosis of the medical condition that caused the dehydration????


If so. Floyd is under no obligation to disclose personal medical information to the media.

Sorry but Floyd/Ellerbe volunteered to tell us on multiple interviews that he was dehydrated and why he was and that is why he needed an IV.

1. Lol. Youre ******. 30 day weight has nothing to do with having uncontrollable runny ****s the night before the fight. Wtf are you talking about.


2. Im not saying that he had diarrhea.

Again, its time you listen to Floyd. Show me the interview or article that Floyd had the runs. I would even accept a picture of a mustered stain on the ring floor ....

Just pointed out yet another medical condition that could've easily warranted a retro TUE according to Wada ISTUE. And you don't have to be SEVERLY dehydrated to require the IV like Thomas Hauser has you believing. Lol.

PREFERED treatment for loss of essential bodily fluids due to excessive ****ting that was caused by a medical condition such as irritable bowel syndrome (official diagnosis) - would be to rehydrate using an IV.




You talked yourself into a corner now huh? Lol. You're the one that claimed that Floyd didn't list anything about dehydration to NSAC. However he did list he had allergies.

Allergies - a medical condition that is intensified when your body is dehydrated.

We all have allergies, some people are more affected than others. It may not be a concern to you - however - some people may suffer it was a serious enough medical condition for Floyd to have listed it as a concern on the prefight form.


However, mannys torn rotator cuff injury was not serious enough.

Haha haha.

Again, its time you listen to Floyd. Show me the interview or article that Floyd said it was due to allergies.



My allergies can get very severe. I had to do an overnight at the hospital and breathe from an oxygen mask when I was younger. Its been better of late .... Hmmm but no IV .....





This is comical stuff ..... keep them coming!