If Haymon doesn't bail out Top Rank... is Arum finished?

[Baltimore]

No. Arum won't be finished until he's passes away. He just in a pickle where he has to adpat and share the wealth.
Either way you look At it it's a win win situation for all parties involved. Fighters are gonna get more exposure and better paydays and the fans are getting more free tv fights and better match ups.

This is exactly how I feel on all the points you made.

[Nightfall]

Haymon knows what he is doing. Arum found that out in court

[Scipio2009]

I don't think Arum would be finished. He's been in the game 40 years and he can adapt. However Arum is a wounded dog right now so it's better to make him an ally. Where he can be controlled.

... or you could treat him like the boxing world treated Don King, and simply let him whither away, as a new star fails to actually materialize.

With Arum no longer being the house promoter for HBO, he's got no leverage worth looking to him as an ally for.

[Scipio2009]

Arum has been around 40 years, he's not getting pushed out by anyone. This is good news, imagine some of the fights we could get.. Bradley,Lomachenko,Crawford etc....those guys just got a ton of fight possibilities if they do indeed work together.

None of the names that you've mentioned make better sense for Haymon than simply keeping Arum out of his shop.

Bradley is a good fighter, but he's locked into a seeming $2m per fight guarantee from Bob Arum; Haymon can have his guys fight each other, mix in 147s from Eddie Hearn, not spend near the money, and make for more compelling fights. Terrence Crawford is a really good fighter but, outside of Figueroa Jr and Broner, Haymon literally has near none of the other top assets at 140. Lomachenko looks like the goods, but Haymon already has Santa Cruz, Selby, Russell Jr, Cuellar, Mares, Frampton and Hearn's fighters at 126 to battle against already in hand.

Working with Haymon would be great for the potential matchups for Arum's fighters, benefiting Top Rank greatly; very few of those matchups do anything to elevate the fighters already with Haymon

[285Kid]

Andy Ruiz vs Deontay Wilder
Gilberto Ramirez vs James DeGale
Jesse Hart vs Badou Jack
Ryota Murata vs Daniel Jacobs
Timothy Bradley vs Danny Garcia
Terence Crawford vs Adrien Broner
Felix Verdejo vs Rances Barthelemy
Vasyl Lomachenko vs Javier Fortuna
Oscar Valdez vs Gary Russell Jr.
Nonito Donaire vs Hugo Ruiz

[Scipio2009]

People keep acting like its PBC vs the boxing world. That isn't the case. For PBC to succeed he NEEDS to make connections to the Arum's, the De La Hoya's & hell even the Jay Z's & other guys in the boxing world. What Haymon is allegedly trying to attempt can't succeed even with his impressive roster without others jumping on board along with their talented fighters. Crawford, Loma, Felix, Vargas & Bradley among other TR fighters potentially being a "PBC Fighters" (which just means they are on PBC cards, don't get all excited simple mfers!). Thats good for Arum. Thats good for Haymon. Thats good for PBC's future. And ultimately, I feel (many are sure to disagree), its good for boxing.

^I disagree. For PBC to succeed, Haymon needs to lock in a critical mass of the top talent across the weight classes, which he's already done. He was never going to get everybody and, just like the UFC, he doesn't need everybody (though, with Ward possibly knocking off Kovalev, bringing RocNation and the WBA/IBF/WBO 175 belts under the umbrella would be a benefit).

Top Rank is basically on the cusp of being perceived in a similar manner to how Strikeforce and PrideFC have been remembered with UFC writing the history ("home of some good fighters, but no fighters who had their skills validated on the only stage that counts").

Vasyl Lomachenko was the WBO 126 champ, yet it didn't matter because Haymon had 4 of the 5 belts at the weight and access to 8 of the top 10 fighters at the weight anyway; with the map being what it is, Lomachenko is moving up to 130 (on of the weakest divisions, in terms of consolidation, in the Haymon orbit).

In division after division, "Haymon's orbit" has already broken through the 50% access to fighters barrier, with 160, 140, and 130 being the only weak spots at the weights that people generally care about (bantam on up) and some divisions being over 70% access.

The need for Arum or his fighters, especially with the m.o. of how he does business, has been greatly overstated in my opinion

[Scipio2009]

What have I been missing? The recent Lara/Martirosyan fight was on Showtime, not PBC. The Thurman/Porter took a year to make. The ESPN fights that were promised are not happening. I rarely see Atlas and people are missing FNF. Not to mention a $925 million lawsuit was filed by investors against Waddell & Reed.

Why are you people making these ****ty threads?

-ESPN has a full summer schedule of fights planned out (with the summer hitting a dead spot for sports content, ESPN has now filled that in with boxing for a good bit of it.

-the $925m lawsuit, as basically every suit against PBC/W&R, has the looks of being shown to be frivolous

-Showtime/CBS, the likely final home for the PBC package, gave another example of their investment into boxing.

[Scipio2009]

If they don't make a deal with Haymon, which I don't see why they wouldn't at this point. Why wouldn't Arum want a guy like Loma on national primetime TV? Why wouldn't PBC wanna make that Loma vs Russell rematch or other fights. Bradley vs the Thurman vs Porter winner. When Ramirez moves up to 175 have him fight Stevenson or Beterbiev. Jesse Vargas vs Adrien Broner. So many fights & I don't hate TR's guys in a lot of them.

Because, like the Mayweather-Pacquao fight, Bob Arum would be a passenger in basically all of those matchups, bringing his fighter in, but Haymon leaving the decision making for the actual event to one of the promoters that he actualy trusts doing business with (Lou Dibella, Tom Brown, Leon Marguiles, Floyd, Yvon Michel, Eddie Hearn, Leija Battah, etc).

There's no chance in hell that, even for Lomachenko-RussellJr II, Haymon would agree with giving the fight date to Arum and let him, sans the PBC uniform presentation, like Arum would run a Top Rank event.

And frankly, I don't think Arum would stand for being treated in the same manner that he's treated Banner Promotionas/Zanfer Promotions over the years.

[mathed]

It doesn't make sense why Haymon would bail out Arum when the fighters can get out of their contract once Arum has failed to produce on his end.

And to think it is PBC who lost over half a billion dollars last year. LOL, I think TR is the one doing the bailout.

[PKing]

I agree with everything Scipio said.

He is actually intelligent.