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Comments Thread For: Roach: Pacquiao is Not The Same Guy Who Fought Hatton

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  • #51
    Originally posted by Spiegelo View Post
    I'm sick of this "puncher or boxer" idea, where you can only be on one side of the spectrum. You really oversimplify all the levels of boxing when you say this. Yes, Manny is an offensive fighter, but that doesn't make him a one dimensional brawler. If you look at the last Marquez fight, you'll see brilliant boxing on display. He feints, then uses lateral movement to put him in perfect punching position. He's always balanced to attack, even while moving. It's the same way boxers like Bernard Hopkins set up their attack. Despite getting ktfo, he nearly doubled the accuracy and punches landed on one of the most accurate counter punches in the sport. He also hasn't looked anything like that ever since. And the notion that he is flat footed is ridiculous. Everyone keeps saying look at the Margarito fight. He doesn't stop moving throughout the entire fight. Then look at his last 4 fights, and tell me if you see the same nonstop, lateral movement.

    Pac's clearly been on the decline since Margs, and ever since he got ktfo, he doesn't seem to enjoy getting hit as much, nor does he fly in for the kill. Hope that helps you see what everyone else is talking about.
    Doesn't make him one dimensional but it does make him readable. He doesn't follow some of the most basic fundamentals of boxing defense and that's why he gets outboxed. The guy can't guard against the right hand (something I blame roach for, and his head movement is non-existed. If you can reach for him, you can hit him. This doesn't define all of his style, just some of the obvious one dimensional part.

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    • #52
      Originally posted by screwhead1 View Post
      Doesn't make him one dimensional but it does make him readable. He doesn't follow some of the most basic fundamentals of boxing defense and that's why he gets outboxed. The guy can't guard against the right hand (something I blame roach for, and his head movement is non-existed. If you can reach for him, you can hit him. This doesn't define all of his style, just some of the obvious one dimensional part.
      Lol Pac won 12 rounds with Mosely he still can't cut the ring. Haven't you guys realize he didn't need to cut the ring since he won 12 rounds lol

      Pac commanded the center of the ring and threw more punches than floyd and even pushed Floyd back to the ropes over and over for 12 rounds. As Floyd hugged and ran excessively. Translation - he got out boxed by Floyd.

      What in the world is this fans taking. I want some of it.
      Last edited by Spoon23; 03-16-2016, 07:38 PM.

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      • #53
        Originally posted by screwhead1 View Post
        Got off the juice, different man.
        Went 3-6 ever since blood testing.

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        • #54
          Originally posted by SilverMiles View Post
          He hasn't been since the Margarito fight. That fight took a lot of him physically and mentally.
          Lol how?, pac beat the man the whole time and was even asking ref to stop the fight in the 10th 11th and 12th. Then man got beat up and down
          Alls pac did was punch the **** out the guy all night. Easy fight for pac.

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          • #55
            Originally posted by Reloaded View Post
            Takes a lot out you beating up a CWed sloth in a 26 ft ring .

            Truth is Manny has not been the same since his lowering CWs of opponents stopped , instead of draining bigger guys he then brought smaller guys up and got KOed , and I wonder where Toradol fits into Mannys run from Diaz to Floyd .
            Mannys WW run was man made to order .
            But didn't PAC KO himself in 6 rounds?? He threw himself on the fist of Marquez... Slow Motion video proves PAC knocked himself out...

            His WW run was crap.. Where was Ariza when PAC needed him...

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            • #56
              Originally posted by SilverMiles View Post
              He hasn't been since the Margarito fight. That fight took a lot of him physically and mentally.
              hahahahahahahah this is hilarious.. yea he fkd up margarito for 12 rounds, ruined his career, took no punishment, ,, but yea, yea it took alot of him physically and mentaly lol rofl

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              • #57
                Originally posted by aboutfkntime View Post
                No version of Manny would have beaten Mayweather.
                I totally disagree.

                If the fight had happened 6 years ago, simply because Manny wasn't nearly as defensively proficient, by his trainer's own admission, there would have been no UD victory for either.

                However, Manny was, as has been noted, way more offensively proficient. He would punch and pivot, he would feint and throw, and he would connect shots I didn't even think he'd land. That Manny would have been able to use offense in a way Floyd had never seen before, and I firmly believe would have taken later rounds to a SD victory.

                The only reason the judges in MayPac didn't give it to Manny is because he didn't show up. He was inactive. His punch output was a joke except rounds 4 and 6. Blame Ariza if you must, but this fact cannot be understated.

                Even if Manny had thrown 1,000 punches and missed the same percentage, I still believe they'd have given him the SD simply because of activity and aggression.



                Originally posted by aboutfkntime View Post
                Floyd was always going to be a horrible style matchup for Pac, only Roach and pacfans really thought he had much of a chance. Even Arum knew what was up.
                I just don't think current Floyd was a bad matchup. 135-140 Floyd? Absolutely.

                To me MayPac was a mirror image of Pacquiao/Clottey in terms of what "The other fighter" was doing. Pacquiao took a UD in that fight despite hardly hurting Clottey and despite Clottey causing facial damage on Pacquiao. Why? Pacquiao almost never stopped throwing punches. He tried. He showed up.

                Originally posted by aboutfkntime View Post
                He has always been predominantly flat-footed, more puncher than boxer.
                Disagree.

                Pacquiao/Marquez 3, Pacquiao/Barrera, Pacquiao/Morales 2 or 3, Pacquiao/Rios, Pacquiao/De La Hoya, Pacquiao/Margarito. Pacquiao USED to punch on the move all the time.

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                • #58
                  Originally posted by hectari View Post
                  Pacquiao is like every other speed demon who relies on physical attributes they age quickly usually early 30s, he has been fighting on fumes for years now, he has been past it since the Margarito fight, I remember in the Clottey fight even though he threw a record number of punches, Lou Dibella said that Pacquiao was aging and he saw him slowing down right after the fight that was years ago.

                  Bradley even said when he first fought Manny he was much faster and snappier with his shots, in the rematch he said Pac was slower and hesitant, and didn't commit to shots, he said he was able to find him more as opposed to the first fight when both guys were basically very quick and avoiding and slipping shots when they mixed it up.

                  Both Bradley and Manny are at the same stage of their careers, both slower, both vulnerable, only difference is Bradley still has the desire and hunger to compete, While Pac has said for the past several years he is already content with his achievements in boxing, whenever a boxer says that and they continue fighting they are only fighting for a Check, because it means they have nothing else to prove so he is only fighting for Money now.
                  Marquez took alot out of Pacquiao in the 4th fight.

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                  • #59
                    Older and the fact that there is no more Alex Araiza to give him roids is the cause of all this!

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                    • #60
                      Originally posted by aboutfkntime View Post
                      I don't see this drop-off in Pac at all, other than in his punch output, and the fact that he looks fatigued at the end of his fights now.

                      All this " been done since Margarito " stuff is just fan talk I think.

                      He looked real sharp against Mosley..... oh, until Shane decided to move.

                      In the fights with Marquez he had the same problems hes always had.

                      In the Bradley fights he either looked good, or he didn't, depending on what Tim was doing.

                      And the common problem in all of those fights, was badly exposed for the whole world to see against Mayweather, but they were always there.

                      Other than his punch output, I don't see this significant drop-off at all.

                      He looked great against Rios and Algieri, because they were available, just like Margarito.


                      I have to admit it...I get a little hard when I watch Manny shadow boxing.

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