Why Ali betrayed Malcolm X

[ICEMAN JOHN SCULLY]

Devil, in the words of Ali "Boy, you aint as dumb as you look"

[butterfly1964]

i think that young clay was bamboozled by the whole NOI to begin with. whaen clay was a teenager maybe 15, he already was interested in the NOI. he didn't like the idea that he had a slave name from the beginning. and malcolm and eligah just made it worst, whan clay was about 20. one things certain and that is that muhammad ali was not a *****. he stood up for what he believed in, and didn't back down. and as for his womanizing, ya'll act like you never were tempted with a fly honey once in a while. some of you are probably hating cause ali's good looks could have gotten any woman he wanted on this earth, and you CAN'T! lol!

[BLOODSHED]

Yeah, white people pushed him to the Nation of Islam.

Ignorance and institutionalized racism were two factors that forced Ali to seek a militant group that gave him some solace... "white men are devils." That was music to his ears.

You tell that to any person who is impressionable and you will have their ears.

I find it funny older white people call Ali a draft dodger but don't find anything wrong with Bush dodging the draft and using his connections to do so.

LOST GUY, You don't understand why someone could look to a GROUP like that because when you were 12 years old and had to pee real bad while downtown with your mom you weerent told you had to "hold it in,little boy, because the store you are standing in doesn't allow black kids to use the rest room

[JoartCC]

Facts? YOU dont know thefacts. Ali saved himself by not going to vietnam? YOU really think he would be in the bush with an AK?? You cant be serious. He lost three years willingly of his career, he KNEW that would happen. People like you want people to believe Ali didnt go to nam' cuz he didnt want to get shot. It's so ridiculous. Ali never would have even fired one bullet, thats FACT. His convictions were STRONG. And he got divorced. so what?? Elizabeth Taylor got married and divorced like it was a race to see who could do it hemost times. J-LO, too. Plenty of people get divorces. Only ONE of his divorces came to pass because of his womanizing and that was the one with Belinda. You REALLY do not know much about Ali. That is CLEAR.

Those are the facts. You even admitted them. lol!

But the point is, ALi is a ****ty guy outside a ring. A ****ty husband, a ****ty father, in short, a man with a ****ty domestic life.

COz if it were aint ****ty, then there won't be the divorces and affairs with women.

Ali is the epitome of an ignorant sheep being led to the slaughter. He's extremely easy to manipulate, extremely easy to brainwash and it didn't help that he only was consistent in his convictions when it comes to his urges. Look at what Nation did to him. ALthough he also brought that upon himself. He was already a man yet he thinks like a boy.

Society pressures is not an excuse to go to fundamental idealism bordering on extremism. Money and fame is not an excuse for abandoning his family and accomodating his whores.

Get your facts straight scully.

[ICEMAN JOHN SCULLY]

JOART, it is amazing how much you dont know.. and how obviously biased you are.

[The Devil]

Devil, in the words of Ali "Boy, you aint as dumb as you look"

Neither is this guy

[JoartCC]

JOART, it is amazing how much you dont know.. and how obviously biased you are.

Biased? lol! How?

Care to point out where I was wrong?

It's no secret Ali outside the ring is a ****ty man.

He's a hypocrite who doesn't want his wife to wear provocative clothes on public and yet he's ok with the notion of accomodating mistresses and other women. That's a ****ty guy for you.

He abandoned his family to go after sluts and bitches. That's no secret.

He let himself be manipulated by the Nation because convinience tells him so. That's no secret.

The problem with you Scully is that you have blinded yourself with the ALi in the ring from the one OUTSIDE OF IT.

[ICEMAN JOHN SCULLY]

The problem with youis that you are talking about a man that doesnt even exist anymore.

[Heckler]

Ali's contribution to the civil rights movement offsets the wrongs he did. For a BLACK man of his status, to express his views, and refuse to go to war in the late sixties is astounding. He showed African americans that there was no need to be passive in the face of their oppressors, to express their views regardless of the position they had been given in american society. HE GAVE UP EVERYTHING, public approval, money, his championship, the PEAK YEARS of his career... he sacrificed everything he worked his ass off all his life in order to make a point. You cannot deny his contribution towards achieving equality and for some moron to come out with 'he had no conviction' earlier in the thread is ****en ridiculous.

Some dont like him because he didn't go to Vietnam. He wasn't going to be FIGHTING in Vietnam and he was right in not supporting one of the biggest military ****ups of all time that was not driven by the need to protect the American people, merely bull**** obscure political motivations.

His following of the nation of Islam was loose at best. He joined the NOI merely as away of getting back at the white oppressors. However, unlike Elijah Muhammad he did not believe whites were the devil and associated heavily, and respected immensely whites like Angelo Dundee and Howard cosell.

He had good reason for not leaving the NOI. He might not be alive today if he did.

[Heckler]

If anyone thinks Ali only expressed his opinions because the NOI tells him to they are ******ed. Watch his interviews, with random questions thrown at him... he answers with passion and conviction. No-one gives away everything they have for something they don't believe in, no-one comes out with something as outlandish as 'no vietcong ever called me ******' in the SIXTIES unless they have very strong beliefs. Sorry Ali was not CONTROLLED, Elijah asked him to fire Angelo Dundee and stop associating with whites... and he bluntly refused.